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  1. #46
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
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    Yeah; pretending to be someone else in order to get into someone's pants is despicable and creepy; but it isn't rape. Rape involves taking away someone's ability to choose — or, in the case of statutory rape, having sex with someone who cannot legally give consent.
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  2. #47
    Mighty Member upgrayedd's Avatar
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    The worst part of the story was when Aquaman woke up with crabs
    I have no beef with Vegans

  3. #48
    Mighty Member upgrayedd's Avatar
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    I think most people who are saying this is not rape are looking at this from a sexist point of view. Just because it happened to a male it's not bad, like female high school teachers getting pregnant by underage teenage boys. If Bunn had of written the story as a male shapeshifter deceiving and having sex with Mera, Aquqman would be forgiven for brining this rapist to justice, but because it happened to a male it's not rape.
    When the situation is reversed its an outrage.
    If this hypothetical situation occurred with a girlfriend, your daughter and your mother would you guys still be saying it's just creepy, unfortunate or immoral? If this person was captured would you not want your lawyer to press rape charges on him? I know I would, and I pray anyone who still says no is never picked to be a jury member in a rape trial
    If a identical twin has sex with his brothers wife after a few drinks isn't rape either in your opinion either (drops mike with loud thud)
    Last edited by upgrayedd; 07-11-2016 at 11:56 AM.
    I have no beef with Vegans

  4. #49
    BANNED colonyofcells's Avatar
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    I am not sure if this is important, but I seem to remember Wonder Woman and Superman had lots of sex before Superman died.

  5. #50
    Astonishing Member BatmanJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by upgrayedd View Post
    The worst part of the story was when Aquaman woke up with crabs
    Better crabs than scabies, 'that I can tell you.'

    If you are married and someone pretends to be you and has sex with your wife, who believes she is having sex with you at the time but is having sex with someone she doesn't want to have sex with, you guys don't consider that rape?

    I'm not saying it's the same experience as being forced against one's will -- there are different ways to rape someone, some are more violent than others -- but it is absolutely rape. It is using false means to make someone have sex with you when they didn't want to do it. That's rape. And if someone did it to your wife and you wouldn't consider it rape, well, I'm showing my age here, but you're Michael Dukakis.

  6. #51
    Spectacular Member Earth-2 Refugee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Know View Post
    Damn! Did the Earth 2 story line really get that stupid? WTF happened after Robinson and Taylor left?
    After Taylor left Wilson decided, "I'll just keep focusing on Apokolips, screw making new versions of JSA villains." We had Solomon Grundy team up with Alan Scott, Alan Scott's dead boyfriend came back as the White Avatar without any of his memories, the Red Beast in the Tower of Fate was actually the Red Avatar aka Wildcat aka Yolanda Montez, and the Blue Avatar was some monster at the bottom of Atlantis (possibly Cthtulhu). Dick Grayson, a wartime reporter, and Commissioner Barbara Gordon-Grayson were also introduced along with their son and Barbara was killed instantly. Dick's son was given to strangers who were actually escaped magical convicts let loose by Constantine to fight Wotan or something after Constantine got stranded on Earth-2 (I didn't read the tie-ins, but I did read a summary online that may be wrong). Dick Grayson was then trained by Ted Grant for about one hour, making him a master crime fighter of course (I can't begin to explain how stupid this is). Then Black Superman and Powergirl became a couple, and Huntress started chastising Thomas Wayne for using super steroids. Dessad then turned Huntress into a Fury, then the Avatars turned Huntress normal again or something like that (it's been over a year since I read this garbage). Commander Khan sacrificed his life in a suicide mission to kill Darkseid that failed instantly. Atom died to make a sanctuary for survivors of Darkseid's invasion while they fought off the invasion. Then when Darkseid finally started destroying the planet Alan Scott (the most emotionally compelling character) gave up all of his emotions to save the survivors and put them on a ship orbiting the planet. Also Jimmy Olsen became a New God, and Barda betrayed Mister Miracle, which compelled him to hook up with Fury. Then Convergence happened and Flash, Green Lantern, Black Superman, Thomas Wayne Batman, Dick Grayson, and Yolanda Montez ended up in the event. The event ended with Thomas dead, Dick Grayson paralyzed like Oracle (coincidentally done by the Joker from probably Pre-Flashpoint), and Telos giving them a new Earth to ruin. Green Lantern then sent out a beacon to bring all of the ships to that Earth, and this Earth had two suns, one yellow and one red making Black Superman and Powergirl useless. Terry Sloan then crashed these ships into the planet since the ships weren't designed for re-entry for no reason beyond we need a new reason for everyone to hate Sloan. Sandman then joined Sloan despite telling Khan he would never join Sloan, and then an army of Sandmen were made despite there only being one surviving Sandman out of five or six (literally making Sandman a pointless character because there are hundreds like him). Mister Terrific gave Dick Grayson a suit to make his legs work and Dick became the third Batman. Then Sloan died after trying to fix the Earth (it is a sad day when I want the villain to win because his plan is actually good for the Earth). Basically, Sloan wanted to take a device and turn the new Earth into what Earth-2 was before Apokoliops first arrived. Also this device came from Oliver Queen, who was friend with Bruce Wayne and became Red Arrow. Oh and Powergirl and Black Superman broke up because of a stupid and pointless retcon. After Sloan died though I stopped reading because the only character I could still relate to died. This was Earth-2 Cliffnotes, hope you enjoyed it.

  7. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by GlennSimpson View Post
    Well don't go by upgrayedd's description. Siren disguised herself as Mera and had sex with Aquaman. That's it.

    As I've said, it might technically be rape, but I think if Arthur was in some sort of therapy group with a woman who was actually held down and violently raped, and he said he could feel her pain, she would tell him to go eff himself.

    At least with statutory rape we have some additional word in there to indicate that it's not really the same thing. "identity" rape or some term like that would need to be invented.
    People also say, "well, a woman being held down and violently raped is different from someone having sex with a women who was drugged into unconsciousness, so the latter case isn't rape-rape."

    There are different kinds of rape under the law, just as there are different kinds of assault (felonious assault, simple assault, aggravated assault). But they are all rape, just as those different kinds of assault are all assault.

    There is a concept in law called "rape by deception," or "rape by fraud." It's pretty narrowly defined - it's not just "he (or she) pretended to be rich/Catholic/related to a famous person/whatever." Under the strictest definition found in American law, it's "a man is guilty of rape-by-fraud if he impersonates a woman’s husband in order to get her consent" (1872 California law) - by sneaking into her bed with the lights off when she expects her husband, for example, and letting her think that's who he is. (In fact, a man's conviction under this law was overturned because he pretended to be her boyfriend, not her husband - she was unmarried.) Except for the genders involved, what Siren did would, I think, clearly fall under even this narrowly defined law. The laws differ from state to state, and are changing over time.
    Last edited by Doctor Bifrost; 07-11-2016 at 11:43 PM.
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  8. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by BatmanJones View Post
    And if someone did it to your wife and you wouldn't consider it rape, well, I'm showing my age here, but you're Michael Dukakis.
    You're showing your (our) age and being a little unfair to ol' Michael. He didn't deny rape was rape; he just answered a capital-punishment question that involved it as though he were a robot, showing no emotions. Probably his pre-rehearsed answer to capital-punishment questions. I suspect it cost him the presidency.
    Doctor Bifrost

    "If Roy G. Bivolo had seen some B&W pencil sketches, his whole life would have turned out differently." http://doctorbifrost.blogspot.com/

  9. #54
    Astonishing Member Doctor Know's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Earth-2 Refugee View Post
    After Taylor left Wilson decided, "I'll just keep focusing on Apokolips, screw making new versions of JSA villains." We had Solomon Grundy team up with Alan Scott, Alan Scott's dead boyfriend came back as the White Avatar without any of his memories, the Red Beast in the Tower of Fate was actually the Red Avatar aka Wildcat aka Yolanda Montez, and the Blue Avatar was some monster at the bottom of Atlantis (possibly Cthtulhu). Dick Grayson, a wartime reporter, and Commissioner Barbara Gordon-Grayson were also introduced along with their son and Barbara was killed instantly. Dick's son was given to strangers who were actually escaped magical convicts let loose by Constantine to fight Wotan or something after Constantine got stranded on Earth-2 (I didn't read the tie-ins, but I did read a summary online that may be wrong). Dick Grayson was then trained by Ted Grant for about one hour, making him a master crime fighter of course (I can't begin to explain how stupid this is). Then Black Superman and Powergirl became a couple, and Huntress started chastising Thomas Wayne for using super steroids. Dessad then turned Huntress into a Fury, then the Avatars turned Huntress normal again or something like that (it's been over a year since I read this garbage). Commander Khan sacrificed his life in a suicide mission to kill Darkseid that failed instantly. Atom died to make a sanctuary for survivors of Darkseid's invasion while they fought off the invasion. Then when Darkseid finally started destroying the planet Alan Scott (the most emotionally compelling character) gave up all of his emotions to save the survivors and put them on a ship orbiting the planet. Also Jimmy Olsen became a New God, and Barda betrayed Mister Miracle, which compelled him to hook up with Fury. Then Convergence happened and Flash, Green Lantern, Black Superman, Thomas Wayne Batman, Dick Grayson, and Yolanda Montez ended up in the event. The event ended with Thomas dead, Dick Grayson paralyzed like Oracle (coincidentally done by the Joker from probably Pre-Flashpoint), and Telos giving them a new Earth to ruin. Green Lantern then sent out a beacon to bring all of the ships to that Earth, and this Earth had two suns, one yellow and one red making Black Superman and Powergirl useless. Terry Sloan then crashed these ships into the planet since the ships weren't designed for re-entry for no reason beyond we need a new reason for everyone to hate Sloan. Sandman then joined Sloan despite telling Khan he would never join Sloan, and then an army of Sandmen were made despite there only being one surviving Sandman out of five or six (literally making Sandman a pointless character because there are hundreds like him). Mister Terrific gave Dick Grayson a suit to make his legs work and Dick became the third Batman. Then Sloan died after trying to fix the Earth (it is a sad day when I want the villain to win because his plan is actually good for the Earth). Basically, Sloan wanted to take a device and turn the new Earth into what Earth-2 was before Apokoliops first arrived. Also this device came from Oliver Queen, who was friend with Bruce Wayne and became Red Arrow. Oh and Powergirl and Black Superman broke up because of a stupid and pointless retcon. After Sloan died though I stopped reading because the only character I could still relate to died. This was Earth-2 Cliffnotes, hope you enjoyed it.
    Holy f*ck! Goddamn, that sounds horrible! Thanks for your abridged rundown of Earth-2. I know to steer clear of Wilson, World's End and Society now.

    With as bad as Earth-2 got, why was it never cancelled I wonder? Titles got the ax left and right during the New 52 era. Earth-2 sounds like it stunk something awful.

  10. #55
    Spectacular Member Earth-2 Refugee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Know View Post
    Holy f*ck! Goddamn, that sounds horrible! Thanks for your abridged rundown of Earth-2. I know to steer clear of Wilson, World's End and Society now.

    With as bad as Earth-2 got, why was it never cancelled I wonder? Titles got the ax left and right during the New 52 era. Earth-2 sounds like it stunk something awful.
    A lot of people who liked Robinson and Taylor's runs stuck around hoping it would improve. Some got that when Abnett came on as writer, but others couldn't take Wilson's bull and just dropped the book.

  11. #56
    Astonishing Member Prime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by colonyofcells View Post
    I am not sure if this is important, but I seem to remember Wonder Woman and Superman had lots of sex before Superman died.
    Which is going to be awkward now with Superdad being there and Superman being dead.

  12. #57
    Mighty Member upgrayedd's Avatar
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    Superdad may give into the temptation, that is my prediction. With Superdead out of the picture this may happen. I am sure Wonder Woman is going to give a big speech on how much he resembles Superdead and make a move on him.
    I have no beef with Vegans

  13. #58
    Astonishing Member BatmanJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by upgrayedd View Post
    Superdad may give into the temptation, that is my prediction. With Superdead out of the picture this may happen. I am sure Wonder Woman is going to give a big speech on how much he resembles Superdead and make a move on him.
    Only someone like Dan Didio or Zach Snyder would think it was a good idea to have Superman cheat on Lois. Wait a minute. ****.

    This is exactly the sort of un-Supermanning of Superman Snyder lives for -- the wronger the better. I'd say such a thing would never ever happen, given Superman's character but I guess Superman's character is not as reliable as it once was.

  14. #59
    Mighty Member upgrayedd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlennSimpson View Post

    Flash is Flash, although he never died and Wally was never Flash. .
    Update, just read Flash Rebirth and Barry says "Wally was the Flash for years without me". He and Wally may be the only ones who remember this, but I think this lays the groundwork for Wally never being the Flash, otherwise this will just confuse new readers
    I have no beef with Vegans

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