thought on diversity in fiction

[John Aston]

616 Peter sure. But his audience, along with comics in general is no longer confined to young, middle-class males of the 60s.

The audience demographics may be different today, but Spider-Man hasn't changed that much and those consistencies is what has attracted a wide range of people to the character. It works. It's like when Fantastic Four deviates from the Stan and Jack formula, the title (critically) struggles. When it goes back to the family unit, the title (critically) fairs better.

Why should an alternative-universe Peter, who for all intents and purposes is a new character entirely be confined to the same characteristics (racial, sexual or otherwise) when the entire point of alternate characters is to differ in some way from the original and thus make the story worth telling?
Especially when something like Peters gender is not intrinsic to the core values of the character and that which made him so appealing in the first place.

That's fair. Lately, Marvel seems to going that direction toying around with variations of the property: alternate Spider-Women, Ultimate Spider-Man, Superior Spider-Man, Spider-Miles, Spider-Man 2099, etc.

[marvelguy25]

you know, seeing the new Wonder Woman reboot i think it still a good idea to make a character like Carol bisexual. i mean with how the population are with greek amazonian women and most of them being lesbians including Wonder Woman who is bisexual and is written by a writer who knows how to write her and women i think it would be a good and interesting idea to make Carol bisexual. i mean her development is pretty much that of a really flawed woman and with everything she's been through i think it would be really good to make Carol bisexual. it would be as realistic as Psylocke's and much better written than Bobby Drake's.

[thewarning]

Mods, please consider closing this thread.

[marvelguy25]

i don't think they should. i mean this thread was made for a reason.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I think it should be moved to the marvel subforum because it focuses more on recent developments on the Marvel cast of characters.

With diversity in general, I think people just want characters written well and to have a greater variety present of characters on screen. It's that joke in the aziz ansari show "master of none" where two indian actors hope to get roles that arent deli owners or doctors.

[keeen]

they know nothing about common sense tbh. a straight male male can understand and can be able to fully understand if they try hard enough the same way anyone in a different diversity could. saying that just sounds pretty ignorant tbh.

Nope...we can empathize with another person's experiences by drawing comparisons to similar circumstances and feelings in our own lives, but the day-in, day-out experience is something that we will never fully grasp. It's not a question of intellect or "trying hard enough," as you say. Our understanding is always a facsimile, we're at best understanding OUR IDEA of someone else's experience, but our ideas are derived from our own experiences.

EDITED because I've just realized I responded to a comment on the first page and the conversation went in VERY different directions since then.

[marvelguy25]

Nope...we can empathize with another person's experiences by drawing comparisons to similar circumstances and feelings in our own lives, but the day-in, day-out experience is something that we will never fully grasp. It's not a question of intellect or "trying hard enough," as you say. Our understanding is always a facsimile, we're at best understanding OUR IDEA of someone else's experience, but our ideas are derived from our own experiences.

EDITED because I've just realized I responded to a comment on the first page and the conversation went in VERY different directions since then.

true but let's not forget that we're just creating characters and their backstories regardless if it reflects on our lives or not. i also believe people have the ability to understand people in general but if they want them and others then i'm sorry but we don't know you guys.

[Lax]

i like to give out my thoughts on diversity and how people react to them . eversince spidey was getting a reboot alot of people were suggesting either a black peter or miles morales as their only options and i asked why? they tthink that a black peter should attract audiance when clearly that wouldn't be the case as there would be alot of story potential to peter which fanfic writers thought of better than just making a character black. they even suggested miles to replace peter overall like not just movies but in tv shows. with how far people have taken diversity Miles has become my character i have a love/ hate relationship for. another issue we had is the Iceman coming out as gay storyline which just came out of nowhere. no hint nor any signs of buildup that he was one. just him being gay out of nowhere. alot of people i found on forums were upset about this not because of how it was handled but because of our complaints. no matter how hard we tried to explain ourselves they found it offensive with some people saying it's "realistic", it's "meaningful", etc. even though it's not. then there was the whole Iron ist being white instead of asian rants like they really don't know nor remember that the character has always been white. then there are alot of petitions into giving elsa from Frozen a girlfriend and that givesteverogersaboyfriend(with buckey) and with that one whenever me and everyone else tried to rant about this alot of people got offended no matter how hard we explained ourselves . whenever we have a problem with diversity and how it is handled even how it's ridiculous how people complain about it and how they talk about changing it they really think it's because we've racist and prejudice even though we're obviously not. we're just tired of having the characters changed in the most drastic ways as possible like killing off a character for another character and having that character's entire history and background changed. they use racism as an excuse to overpower us no matter how hard we tried to explain.

1. Level of offence is irrelevant to the validity of an argument.

2. If racism is being used as an excuse, don't validate the excuse.

so i ask you people, are you tired of how diversity is handled and how people respond to you like they're "offended" ?

I hold those responses in contempt.

what are your thoughts on diversity in fiction and how it's handled and should be handled?

My thoughts on diversity in fiction? The concept is overrated, if not outright unimportant.

How is it handled? Like a moral obligation.

How should it be handled? Ideally like an amoral element within fiction.