The case for Angela as Marvel's flagship superheroine or why Captain Marvel hasn't catched on so far

[CaptCleghorn]

it's just 616marvel dude doing it
honestly at some point you could make a separate section for the "diss carol" threads.

There are two questions here.

The first: Should Carol Danvers be the Marvel Flagship Heroine? In addition to the school of thought that Marvel doesn't (or shouldn't) have a flagship heroine. But given that there is such a position, should Captain Marvel dwell there? There are many other possibilities.

The second question is specific to Angela. Based on the movie and Marvel's support of Carol's book, it seems that the original question (asked a while ago) has been answered with a resounding "no".

[Riv86672]

my issue with angela is just her lack of code name. That’s fine when your name is something like thor, but when your name is shared with a character from the office, it seems like a stumbling block to me.

^^^lol!!! :d

[Jabare]

I think there can be a case for most popular or compelling hero or strongest/most effective hero. But if you're saying someone is the flagship white guy, or female or asian character etc. etc. that just tells me all teh other characters aren't very compelling/interesting.

In this day and age I don't think Marvel has a flagship, in the sense most of you think. I mean you could argue Spider-Man along the lines I just mentioned if you really wanted to be a contrarian.

The MCU has several strong female characters. Captain MArvel was the first to headline her own movie and seems like the strongest (honorable mention to Scarlet Witch)

Being genuinely liked matters more. Like spider-verse wasn't close to a billion dollar movie, but it is very beloved.
Iron man 3 made a billion, but it's not better than civil war, winter soldier etc, largely carried financially by the avengers movie out at the time.

If you make a ranked poll on popularity (like cbr has made or any other sites), captain marvel would be in the 20s or 30s if not lower at this time. I mean, really a cbr popularity poll is coming up, so we can see how the reception is currently.

Captain marvel (carol) is well known and a household name, but the reception seems a bit lukewarm.



it's just 616marvel dude doing it
honestly at some point you could make a separate section for the "diss carol" threads.

well its a public online opinion poll so you know its accuracy is kind of dubious if you're applying it to more then the CBR community. But if you're saying she's not super popular on CBR I'd have to agree with you.

Being genuinely liked matters to fandoms and individuals, but if your Marvel or any company the box office is important. Sure people talk about merchandising and DVD/digital sales which aren't nothing but when fans start to bring those up as a saving grace maybe it will go well. Also, I think you are hard-pressed to say she wasn't well-received her box office wasn't from one weekend. Then you've got Disney and other people convinced sexist or alt-right people are against her so they don't care. You've seen her fans be vocal in public at the theaters and conventions with her cosplay. Whereas, Captain Marvel detractors tend to be more online from what I've seen. Then at worst you have people who are indifferent in public. They might not care one way but they won't waste time and energy criticizing her.

Her solo movie didn't blow my socks off but I didn't have a problem with it. Critical acclaim and fan consensus are nice, but when you make a big-budget blockbuster your chief hope is that it does very well at the box office. It's not going to win an Oscar (Black Panther was an anomaly).

In Disney's mind, Captain Marvel was a huge success. The Antman films got better ratings but neither film came close to Captain Marvel's box office. Plus there is a strong belief that Captain Marvel was targeted by negative reviews as the film received thousands of negative reviews before it even released. I'm not going to get into social politics, but I think Disney is very happy where things stand at the moment.

What is it that annoys some people so much? Is it that they made her stronger than Thor? Is it that they made Fury lame in her film? I guess I could see somethings that might annoy people but nothing worth getting so bent out of shape over. It's not like she's taking an already established character spotlight or role.

[Electricmastro]

What is it that annoys some people so much. Is it that they made her stronger than Thor? Is it that they made Fury lame in her film? I guess I could see somethings that might annoy people but nothing worth getting so bent out of shape over. It's not like she's taking an already established character spotlight or role.

I don’t know about “bent out of shape,” though I did hear some people call her a generic military chick. That, or I guess some people must be a little annoyed that she’s being glorified so much and that that her box office success is being flaunted around like it’s some biggest dick contest. lol

[H-E-D]

The box office only keeps getting brought up in response to people trying to claim her film as a failure.

[Electricmastro]

only

You'd be surprised at the types of fans you see online when you look around for long enough.

[Jabare]

The box office only keeps getting brought up in response to people trying to claim her film as a failure.

exactly. I didn't like Venom, I didn't think it was a good movie, but I'm not going around saying it was a failure or didn't work after it made a boatload of money. I can critique the story or other elements I didn't like, but at the end of the day, it still performed well.

[The Cool Thatguy]

exactly. I didn't like Venom, I didn't think it was a good movie, but I'm not going around saying it was a failure or didn't work after it made a boatload of money. I can critique the story or other elements I didn't like, but at the end of the day, it still performed well.

Yeah, but it coulda done better with Flash and not Brock

*mutters*

[Jabare]

Yeah, but it coulda done better with Flash and not Brock

*mutters*

oh there's a long list *cough* Spider-Man *cough*

[Electricmastro]

I think there can be a case for most popular or compelling hero or strongest/most effective hero. But if you're saying someone is the flagship white guy, or female or asian character etc. etc. that just tells me all teh other characters aren't very compelling/interesting.

In this day and age I don't think Marvel has a flagship, in the sense most of you think. I mean you could argue Spider-Man along the lines I just mentioned if you really wanted to be a contrarian.

As I understand it, flagship means "the best or most important thing owned or produced by a particular organization." so I suppose there's always an amount of subjectivity is involved even with the box office arguments. One can argue that Marvel has important heroes, sure, but if someone will also argue that "this hero has an exact level of importance/bestness above these other heroes," that I imagine that person should prepare themselves for all the replies that come their way, because for better or worse, I've come to learn that superheroes is a pop culture subject that can potentially be argued for days on end, especially on the internet.

[Citizen Kane]

I don't think anyone beyond the confines of this forum considered Carol Danvers the flagship superheroine of Marvel Comics pre-2015. Even now, I still think of Susan Storm, Black Widow, Storm, Jean Grey, and pretty much any X-Men superheroine before Carol ever comes to mind. Really, Marvel's push to make Carol a flagship character is exactly why she isn't catching on--she's being forced down our throats.

As for Angela, I'll have to disagree. To be honest, I never even heard of her until I browsed this thread. If you were to make her the flagship superheroine, you'll run into the same problems Carol is dealing with. Focus on fleshing out the character and making interesting stories. Once that's done, maybe she'll catch on like Miles Morales did.

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

To me, revealing that Tessa Thompson's Valkyrie's search for a queen turning out to be Angela is to be the start of focusing on fleshing out Angela in the Marvel Cinematic Universe!

[dreyga2000]

How is this still a thread??? Captain Marvel is getting a second (and most likely a third) movie and is likely to be the new leader of the Avengers. She is marvel's flagship super-heroine. Case Closed. Time to move on

[Cowtools]

How is this still a thread??? Captain Marvel is getting a second (and most likely a third) movie and is likely to be the new leader of the Avengers. She is marvel's flagship super-heroine. Case Closed. Time to move on

My thoughts exactly!

There's an appreciation thread for Angela surely, and if there isn't they can start one.
And a new Carol hate thread starts up about, oh, every month or so.
So there's no reason to keep this thread around.

[Geraldofrivia]

I never understand some female comic book fans. Ironman can coexist with Thor, Captain America, Hulk, Spiderman, Wolverine etc
Captain Marvel can coexist with other female characters. It is just her character's history with American Military, Avengers, X men, Krees, Skrulls, Shield and being Cosmic hero with Earthly origin makes her an ideal character to be flagship.