The case for Angela as Marvel's flagship superheroine or why Captain Marvel hasn't catched on so far

[RLAAMJR.]

Marvel just got Angela so it will really take time for her to become Marvel's female face and seeing that her ongoing is not doing well and no constant appearances on other Marvel books especially Avengers book, I'd say Angela doesn't have a chance.

[RLAAMJR.]

Can somebody tell us which female character has better ongoing solo sales record than Carol's?

[Doctor Know]

Can somebody tell us which female character has better ongoing solo sales record than Carol's?

Easy:

Spider-Gwen

Gwenpool

Jane Thor

Ms Marvel


Carol's book was marginally ahead of Silk's. Scarlet Witch's solo, Moon Girl and Angela bringing up the rear.

Add in the DC heroines, and Batgirl, Wonder Woman, Supergirl, Harley Quinn, Catwoman and Superwoman were ahead of Carol also. Black Canary and Starfire were selling less than Carol though.

[RLAAMJR.]

Easy:

Spider-Gwen

Gwenpool

Jane Thor

Ms Marvel


Carol's book was marginally ahead of Silk's. Scarlet Witch's solo, Moon Girl and Angela bringing up the rear.

Add in the DC heroines, and Batgirl, Wonder Woman, Supergirl, Harley Quinn, Catwoman and Superwoman were ahead of Carol also. Black Canary and Starfire were selling less than Carol though.

So Dazzler's ongoing, Mystique's ongoing and Emma Frost sales weren't considered better than Carol's ?

[Wellman]

Spider-Girl (May 'Mayday' Parker, Peter's alternate reality MC2 kid) also had the longest uninterrupted run of any female Marvel comicbook, making it to over 100 issues before they tried to relaunch it. But that was a MUCH different time when Marvel wasn't relaunching everything every year and a half or less.


On topic, Angela, needs a workable premise to make her work. Just being retconned as Thor's sister and into the Marvel universe isn't enough, they need to make a stronger hook for her and why readers should care about her adventures.

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

Compare the number of male characters who show skin to the number of female characters who do and you can see why people prefer Wonder Woman and Angela covered up.

I'm sorry but that's a fallacious and stupid argument. Wonder Woman looks ridiculous with shorts or a busy armor. This is puritanism dressed as faux progressivism. Comic book people look gorgeous, neither Wonder Woman, Angela, Kratos or Namor need to cover up. Most of the female characters are using practical suits that not all of the times work while most of the males superheroes are still using the good ol' spandex. Big freaking deal.

Hear, hear!

[Digifiend]

So Dazzler's ongoing, Mystique's ongoing and Emma Frost sales weren't considered better than Carol's ?

Doctor Know was only referring to recent books. Do we even have sales figures for the 80s books?

[skyvolt2000]

Doctor Know was only referring to recent books. Do we even have sales figures for the 80s books?

No and those books had the benefit if being returnable and sold at more locations.

If we go by length-Dazzler has a long run.

I would say Carol benefited from more chances like She Hulk.

Carol's issue is what does she have to offer that makes her difference from Jessica Jones, WW, Ms Marvel and others.

[Wiccan]

Easy:

Spider-Gwen

Gwenpool

Jane Thor

Ms Marvel

And I think it's clear how none of these could fit as "Marvel's flagship heroine" though...

[Ken Ashcroft]

And I think it's clear how none of these could fit as "Marvel's flagship heroine" though...

Maybe it's hard for any of them to become Marvel's flagship heroine because Marvel until now have never really bothered promoting its heroines as flagship characters? It's always been male characters like Spider-Man, Wolverine, Hulk, etc that have been at the forefront of the company promotions and images and it's not easy to suddenly have a Heroine that stands out amongst all the other heroines.

It's kinda different at DC where even if at times where her sales or popularity were not very high, Wonder Woman has always been regarded as being one of DC's big three alongside Superman and Batman.

[Tofali]

Were Marvel male flagship really pushed or did they just happen? The Iron-Man push was funny thou

[Digifiend]

It just happened. Spider-Man got added to Amazing Fantasy, was meant to appear every month... but it was cancelled (if they were pushing him deliberately, that wouldn't have happened). He clearly wasn't the big hit at first that he would later become when reintroduced in his own book six months later.

They probably originally meant for Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, or Namor to be the flagship hero.

[ed2962]

My understanding was that Stan came up with the Spider-Man concept, but publisher Martin Goodman wasn't so sure about it. Stan convinced Martin to let him run it in the last issue of Amazing Fantasy which they were cancelling anyway. The sales on that last issue were better than average so Martin went ahead a let Stan give Spidey an ongoing.

[Ken Ashcroft]

Yes, I remember seeing Stan say somewhere that they were struck by the number of teenagers that read the first few issues and wrote to Marvel saying how they could relate to the character. Not sure if getting bitten by a radioactive spider and getting superpowers was a common thing for high school teenagers in the 60s but Marvel had clearly stuck gold with Spider-Man in a way that would be hard to achieve today.

I wonder if we have anyone here that was a teenager in the 60s that could share that sense of wonderment with us.

[brettc1]

Even with all the stuff happening with Captain Marvel, there is no way I would rank Angela as a flaghship female character. Besides being virtually unknown she is a borderline high functioning sociopath.