View Poll Results: Wonder Woman should be stronger than superman?

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  • Yes

    14 11.29%
  • No

    56 45.16%
  • Equal

    54 43.55%
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  1. #31
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    Equal in terms of super-strength. Also equal in terms of super-speed, super-agility and super-durability. I'm tempted to say also equal to Superman in terms of super-invulnerability.

    Greater than Superman in terms of fighting knowledge, experience and ability due to her extensive training as an Amazon warrior and, depending upon the continuity, many, many, many more years of experience.

    Greater than Superman in terms of wielding weapons, particularly magical weapons / artefacts, once again due to her extensive training as an Amazon warrior and due to her practical mindset when it comes to battle (i.e. if she judges that her opponent is a genuine threat, then she will arm herself accordingly).

    But, weaker than Superman when it comes to other super-abilities such as heat-vision, super-breath, x-ray vision and, once again depending upon the continuity, flight.

    Basically, I think that Wonder Woman's unique strengths are generally balanced by Superman's unique strengths. However, if one was to consider the new DC movie universe, then it would appear that Wonder Woman is much more suitable to lead the Justice League than Superman given her 5,000 years of experience as a leader and warrior.

  2. #32
    Legendary Member daBronzeBomma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tayswift View Post
    well you don't know. WW solo seems very sword free
    But the new animated version the kiddies will be introduced to will be very sword-reliant:




    Quote Originally Posted by richalex View Post
    And you clearly have never read an issue of Wonder Woman. She's never been a golem. Her Story is no different than Adam and Eve or Prometheus, or Pandora.
    Actually, her story is now no different from any of the "secret father" tales, seeing as she is the secret daughter of Zeus. If her solo live-action movie uses that origin, say good-bye to the clay origin for the foreseeable future.

    I really don't see the big deal with Diana being Physically as powerful as Clark. She should be the most powerful Earth Bound being on the planet. Just because Clark is from the stars doesn't nor should it automatically make him more powerful. Why? Because the Earth is newer in the universe than Krypton? There is a reason that Earth seems to be the center of the Universe, meaning that Darkseid, etc keep coming "here" to take control of it. It isn't meant to be some backwater planet. There is something special about it.
    Because the the DCU is much bigger than just Earth. More of Superman's prominent enemies come from across the universe (Brainiac, Darkseid, Doomsday, Zod/Faora, Mxyzpltk, Mongul, Dominus, Lobo, Imperiex, Maxima) than do Wonder Woman's. The only reason Earth seems the center of the DCU is because readers wouldn't care nearly as much if it weren't.

    And also, The Titan/Olympian War created the New Gods. They should never be presented as more powerful than the Olympians. I get it King Kirby created them, but yeah, No.
    No. The Ragnarok of the Old Gods (who were definitely not the Greek pantheon of Cronus and his Titans, and Kirby was rumored to imply the Old Gods were Marvel's Norse Gods) created the New Gods. In ACTION COMICS #600 (1988), it was revealed that the destruction of the Old Gods (again, NOT the Titans) created a Godwave that eventually created the Olympian gods on Earth. The New Gods absolutely should be portrayed as more powerful than any of the polytheistic pantheons of Earth for the simple reason that the Earth gods don't do jack for good or evil whenever the universe is threatened, but the New Gods constantly do. The New Gods are more important, and thus more powerful on a universal scale.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by daBronzeBomma View Post

    Because the the DCU is much bigger than just Earth. More of Superman's prominent enemies come from across the universe (Brainiac, Darkseid, Doomsday, Zod/Faora, Mxyzpltk, Mongul, Dominus, Lobo, Imperiex, Maxima) than do Wonder Woman's. The only reason Earth seems the center of the DCU is because readers wouldn't care nearly as much if it weren't.
    None of that seems to be a problem for the thousands of Green Lantern books etc that deal with nothing on Earth. Darkseid keeps coming to the Earth because its the center of the Multiverse.



    No. The Ragnarok of the Old Gods (who were definitely not the Greek pantheon of Cronus and his Titans, and Kirby was rumored to imply the Old Gods were Marvel's Norse Gods) created the New Gods. In ACTION COMICS #600 (1988), it was revealed that the destruction of the Old Gods (again, NOT the Titans) created a Godwave that eventually created the Olympian gods on Earth. The New Gods absolutely should be portrayed as more powerful than any of the polytheistic pantheons of Earth for the simple reason that the Earth gods don't do jack for good or evil whenever the universe is threatened, but the New Gods constantly do. The New Gods are more important, and thus more powerful on a universal scale.
    You should go back and read I believe the Perez Wonder Woman Issue 21 I believe where Diana helps the Olympians Destroy Olympus, because of what happens in Action 600. It states that it is the Titan and Olympian War that creates the New Gods. John Byrne has always had a hardon for the New Gods. I find it funny that Perez went right behind him and said, yeah, nah, it isn't going to work like that. (Of course JB tried years later to retcon that but it never stuck.)

    And yes, I know that Kirby intended for Orion/Thor, etc. They were to be reincarnated after Ragnarok to become the New Gods, Marvel didn't want to do that so he brought it to DC.
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  4. #34
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    No. The Ragnarok of the Old Gods (who were definitely not the Greek pantheon of Cronus and his Titans, and Kirby was rumored to imply the Old Gods were Marvel's Norse Gods) created the New Gods. In ACTION COMICS #600 (1988), it was revealed that the destruction of the Old Gods (again, NOT the Titans) created a Godwave that eventually created the Olympian gods on Earth. The New Gods absolutely should be portrayed as more powerful than any of the polytheistic pantheons of Earth for the simple reason that the Earth gods don't do jack for good or evil whenever the universe is threatened, but the New Gods constantly do. The New Gods are more important, and thus more powerful on a universal scale.
    Ooops, my Bad Wonder Woman Vol. 2 #19 here is the page explaining.
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  5. #35
    Astonishing Member Vinsanity's Avatar
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    Honestly no but she should be a better fighter and a better thinker in battle than Superman.

  6. #36
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    I always felt that the Amazons should have been created as the Defenders of the Planet, so to speak. When the Amazons split, some went and ended up becoming Atlantians. Some became the Bana-Mighdall. Some became Valkyrie. It would leave Earth not so easy to take over in the past, or else Darkseid would have done it centuries ago. With Earth being the center of the Multiverse (I believe the Oans have said this) it would give an in story reason as to why Earth is so popular and always becoming attacked, but always able to drive off other Alien Empires.
    Richard Alexander

  7. #37
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    I voted no on this. There are a lot of feats showing how strong Superman is (such as moving the Earth out of orbit and through a wormhole or bench pressing the weight of the Earth for days with only a drop of sweat to show for the effort). I haven't read any feats of Wonder Woman that are equivalent.

    She is clearly the better fighter with her Amazon training and better tactician but for pure power Superman is at the top.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toreador View Post
    I voted no on this. There are a lot of feats showing how strong Superman is (such as moving the Earth out of orbit and through a wormhole or bench pressing the weight of the Earth for days with only a drop of sweat to show for the effort). I haven't read any feats of Wonder Woman that are equivalent.

    She is clearly the better fighter with her Amazon training and better tactician but for pure power Superman is at the top.
    So because you haven't read them, means they didn't happen? Aw ok then.

    2384426-900_solartowb.jpg
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by richalex View Post
    So because you haven't read them, means they didn't happen? Aw ok then.

    2384426-900_solartowb.jpg
    The Golden Age WW is very Silver Age-esque in terms of her powers and world. Superman meanwhile was very grounded.
    #InGunnITrust, #ZackSnyderistheBlueprint, #ReleasetheAyerCut

  10. #40
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    While I do think Supes should be top dog (at least in the JL), to me it doesn't really matter what's said in an interview. Didn't Johns say the same thing about Green Lantern? I'll come back to this thread if this is actually reflected in a story.
    Last edited by SmokeMonster; 07-21-2016 at 09:52 PM.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by El_Gato View Post
    Stop comparing Wonder Woman to Superman and let her be her own character with her own power levels! I don't get the whole turning Diana into some feminist icon thing as that just drags the character down and turns off a lot of people! Let her be a superhero instead of turning her into some political statement.

    As for me I don't care if she's stronger or weaker than Superman as long as her stories are fun, good and interesting.
    All superheroes are political statements. This is not limited to Wonder Woman. Being a political statement and having good stories are not mutually exclusive.

    As for me, I voted equal.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by daBronzeBomma View Post
    Voted no.

    Doesn't mean Wonder Woman is not very formidable or can't take down Superman if he's in the wrong (she most certainly is and she most certainly can).

    Wonder Woman's powers, in one way or another, derive from the Greek gods. And the DC Olympians have never been shown to be as mighty as Marvel's Asgardians.

    For starters, DC's Olympians are actual gods that depend on believers while Marvel's Asgardians are more like cosmic alien beings that are mistaken for gods. Marvel's Asgardians are more like DC's New Gods in that they actually matter to the greater Marvel universe. DC's Olympians typically only have importance as far as Wonder Woman's involvement goes.

    Marvel's Odin is a legitimate galaxy-buster (his most likely DC counterpart is Highfather of the New Gods) and is involved in Marvel's crossovers, while I can't recall the last cosmic crisis in which DC's Zeus played any sort of major role. Basically, the Greek gods are a lousy power source, esp when you consider they are not even the only pantheon on DC's Earth (at a minimum, both the Egyptian and Norse pantheons also exist here).

    Wonder Woman never comes into existence without Superman, the reverse is definitely not true. He gets priority in this department.

    Again, Diana not being as physically powerful as Kal doesn't diminish her as long as she had vastly superior fighting skills and magical weapons to counter him. She is that rarest class of hero (Shazam, Captain Atom, Martian Manhunter) that can take on Superman in single combat and potentially win.
    The new versions of the Olympians don't need prayers for power.

  13. #43
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    Hmm, well, to be fair, it's easy for Johns to say that, it's another thing for the actual writing to back it up, so until it happens I'd take it with a grain of salt.

    Now as for the idea itself, I do get why Superman fans(or rather, bigger Superman fans than myself) are annoyed. It's not really fun for your favorite character to be used to prop up another character, although it is a bit of a compliment to how people see Superman. In addition, Superman has, from what I understand, had a bit of a rough time writing wise, so it can kinda feel like a lot of dumping on your favorite character. I think that, as essentially the first superhero, he definitely deserves props for that, but how much and how to do it? Some posters I think, want him to be a one man Justice League, which is fine as an opinion, but is problematic with making the other heroes in a shared universe feel relevant and special in their own right, especially those who share traits with the guy(Shazam, Martian Manhunter, and or course, Wonder Woman). Many others just want him to be a first among equals thing, which is also fine, but it still has a small thing I'd like to address.

    I'm going to be honest, Wonder Woman and the Justice League has always been an odd fit for me. The classic team, Big 7 I mean, always had a very tight role thing going on. Superman is the powerhouse guy, Green Lantern is the construct guy, Flash is the fast guy, etc. However, Wonder Woman generally felt like a "We have to include her but have no idea how to fit it into this role based team." So she's just sorta there. Morrison's Justice League run kinda cements this to me, she's there and she's not really actively downplayed or anything, but she still lacks a lot of the memorable moments and stories other character's got in my opinion. The same can be said about most of the big event stuff I remember, she is there but never has that memorable of a part in it.

    Eventually they came around to this idea that Wonder Woman's role is the warrior of the group. But what exactly does it mean? People keep saying more "martially skilled" and a better fighter, but in comics don't tend to get very fight technical anyway. There are exceptions, but it usually comes down to punching, and maybe some kicking. Strategist? I've never seen her used over Batman in that regard. Really it seems what the word means is she uses weapons while others punch. But again, it rarely seems to change much. So she's hitting with a sword instead of her fist. Big Whoop.

    Although I'm a bit meh on Bryan Hitch's Justice League stuff, he honestly seems the most interested in looking into the magical arsenal thing of any writer, but it's still just hitting with stuff rather than anything interesting. Her traditional lasso, which could actually have some unique combat applications is generally forgotten by writers, or does very little. Blocking stuff with the shield or bracers is a cool visual I guess.

    Oh right, I almost forgot the other part of being the "warrior" means being willing to kill enemies, which often leads to making her seem bloodthirsty under certain writers, usually to cause drama with the other members. Ultimately, that seems to be what being the warrior of the group does. There are things about her of course, like her links to mythology, but they tend to be used few and far between(when was the last time the Justice League went up against a mythological based opponent?). So Wonder Woman just ends up filling the same role as before, secondary powerhouse but with a sword now, which if you like that is nifty I guess, but it doesn't really help my issues with it in the long run.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tayswift View Post
    Wonder owman should never have to resort for weapons besides her tiara and lasso. resort to weapons is weakness and that is not what wonder woman should be
    That tiara is a very lethal weapon though. So I don't see the issue with her having a sword as well.

  15. #45
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    In the end it doesn't matter. BatGod beats both of them easily.

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