New Champions Appreciation 2018

[Tiamatty]

So what is going to be the response from members of the original Champions group: Hercules, Darkstar, Black Widow, Johnny Blaze, Angel, Iceman...?

My guess? "Oh, wow, you're really using that name? Huh. It's not a name with a lot of prestige, you know."

On the question of leadership, Waid said it actually depends on who you ask, as three of them consider themselves the leaders.

[Ken Ashcroft]

On the question of leadership did the original Champions have a leader?

[Frontier]

On the question of leadership did the original Champions have a leader?

Black Widow.

[Lucena Soares]

My guess? "Oh, wow, you're really using that name? Huh. It's not a name with a lot of prestige, you know."

On the question of leadership, Waid said it actually depends on who you ask, as three of them consider themselves the leaders.

Really? Well, that's going to be fun.

[somacula]

Really? Well, that's going to be fun.

So who's the most and the less experienced so far?
The less experienced are definetly Ms Marvel, viv and I think Nova
The more experience are Cho (hercules sidekick, also chaos war), Miles (Ultimate universe, he lead the ultimates) and Tyke (Lead the X men since day one up to the time he traveled to the present, also went to space to learn more cosmic stuff, battle of the atom, trial of jean grey and Black vortex).

[dragonmp93]

Well, not quite. Leadership was taken away from him early on when the teen X-Men got to the future because Storm knew that Scott wasn't an inherent leader, but was made that way, and given to Jean. They ended up co-leading together. I could see a similar thing happening with him and Kamala, or him having to learn to think on his feet.

Eh, no; the leadership wasnt taken away, he simply stepped down due to having process all the information of his future, and given that it was Teen Jean's idea to stay in the present, she became the leader-by-default.

Actually Jean sort of ended up screwing up every mission, got tyke killed, got captured by the shi ar, lost her will and decided to leave once, couldn't keep tyke in the team , got the team stuck in the ultimate universe, then left the team a few months later, so her leadership stage was a bit disappointing. On the other hand teen Cyclops wasn't exactly in the best mental capacity to lead and his pals weren't exactly trusting him 100 %, but hopefully this time he'll be up for taking the Champions to victory (as a field leader)

Wolverine and Kitty were the ones that got Tyke killed. And the Shi'ar wasnt her fault.

[JediKage]

So who's the most and the less experienced so far?
The less experienced are definetly Ms Marvel, viv and I think Nova
The more experience are Cho (hercules sidekick, also chaos war), Miles (Ultimate universe, he lead the ultimates) and Tyke (Lead the X men since day one up to the time he traveled to the present, also went to space to learn more cosmic stuff, battle of the atom, trial of jean grey and Black vortex).

Eh unless Waid is ignoring Pak cant see Miles and Cho clashing much. I say Cho has the most experience. Miles is second or third depending on when they grabbed Tyke out of the timeline.

[Harpsikord]

Eh, no; the leadership wasnt taken away, he simply stepped down due to having process all the information of his future, and given that it was Teen Jean's idea to stay in the present, she became the leader-by-default.

I mean, they could have just as easily given the leadership role to Beast because he was the oldest.

Wolverine and Kitty were the ones that got Tyke killed. And the Shi'ar wasnt her fault.

Yeah, it's also not fair to blame Cyclops wanting to spend time with his dad on Jean.

Eh unless Waid is ignoring Pak cant see Miles and Cho clashing much. I say Cho has the most experience. Miles is second or third depending on when they grabbed Tyke out of the timeline.

Cyclops came from "X-Men 8," which was a few months into his time as a hero. I'd say that since Miles has two years under his belt from 1610 he has more experience since Scott only has about a little over a year give or take.

[somacula]

Eh unless Waid is ignoring Pak cant see Miles and Cho clashing much. I say Cho has the most experience. Miles is second or third depending on when they grabbed Tyke out of the timeline.

I agree, Cho has been around longer than Tyke and Miles so he's definetly the most experienced of all
I don't know what's miles been up to so I hope someone can help me catch up
As for tyke prior traveling he fought magneto twice, blob, Magneto's brotherhood, Vanisher, he clashed with namor and unus, and before travelling Prof X left Cyclops in charge of the X men

Cyclops came from "X-Men 8," which was a few months into his time as a hero. I'd say that since Miles has two years under his belt from 1610 he has more experience since Scott only has about a little over a year give or take.

He has also done his fair share of superheroics in the present, don't forget

[Harpsikord]

He has also done his fair share of superheroics in the present, don't forget

Yeah, I was counting that for the "little over a year." I'd say probably about sixteen months or a little over a year and a half in general, maybe more depending on the status of Time Runs Out? I could've sworn I read someone mentioning it didn't happen because the Incursions no longer happened, but I dunno.

[dkrook]

Eh unless Waid is ignoring Pak cant see Miles and Cho clashing much. I say Cho has the most experience. Miles is second or third depending on when they grabbed Tyke out of the timeline.

Correct, and due to this i dismiss the idea that Miles wouldn't be an ideal leader over scott. This kid has seen, and been through some very extreme situations and performed well even before leading in ultimates group. He very grounded, with a strong moral compass, and I think that he may born to lead, he just needs an opportunity to show his stuff.

[somacula]

Yeah, I was counting that for the "little over a year." I'd say probably about sixteen months or a little over a year and a half in general, maybe more depending on the status of Time Runs Out? I could've sworn I read someone mentioning it didn't happen because the Incursions no longer happened, but I dunno.

Alright, for Cyclops adventures in the present with the x men there's :
-Battled modern brotherhood and won
-Fought modern Cyclops
-Battled present and future X men in bota and won
-Teamed up with hulk and Spider-Man to fight some cyborgs (and won)
-Fought purifiers and won
-Fought the shi ar and won
-Went into a fair share of cosmic adventures with his dad and the starjammers
-Times runs out did happened and Tyke apparently split his time between his dad and whatever old Cyclops was doing in the mutant nation.
-Also I don't know what was he up to during the other 8 month gap post sw.
Also don't forget that prior to X men first battle against magneto he had already been training for a while with Xavier.

Correct, and due to this i dismiss the idea that Miles wouldn't be an ideal leader over scott. This kid has seen, and been through some very extreme situations and performed well even before leading in ultimates group. He very grounded, with a strong moral compass, and I think that he may born to lead, he just needs an opportunity to show his stuff.

I could estimate that between his time in the past(probably a year) , time in the present (at least a few months) and both 8 month gaps Teen Scott has been Cyclops for around 3 years.

A bit more experimented than Miles, and all of that stuff about miles you just said are equally valid for Cyke and all the heroes in champions, life experience =/= leadership experience.

Prof X told Cyclops that he kept him around not for his power but his ability to lead and work with others, don't forget most Cyclops heroics have been always team oriented instead of solo adventures, Tyke has always been a team player instead of a lone wolf, miles just fought with the ultimates for a few times in ultimates and he wasnt exactly leading in ANAD.

Although as Waid said mostly the Champions would be wary of young Cyclops, although I can see Cho and Viv giving him the benefit of the doubt, so Tyke at least would've to show his ability to lead in the battlefield. But he wouldn't be the one calling the shots on what the team does overall

[Digifiend]

So who's the most and the less experienced so far?
The less experienced are definetly Ms Marvel, viv and I think Nova
The more experience are Cho (hercules sidekick, also chaos war), Miles (Ultimate universe, he lead the ultimates) and Tyke (Lead the X men since day one up to the time he traveled to the present, also went to space to learn more cosmic stuff, battle of the atom, trial of jean grey and Black vortex).

Miles wasn't leader of the Young/All-New Ultimates. Jessica Drew, aka Black Widow, was.

Nova probably has as much experience as Tyke - he's been in comics for four years now, which is nearly two years in-universe thanks to the eight month timeskip.

[Tiamatty]

I mean, they could have just as easily given the leadership role to Beast because he was the oldest.

I think Beast is too cerebral to be an effective leader. Of the O5, Scott and Jean were the most fit to lead.

[Incognito]

I think Ms. Marvel is going to lead Champions because she seems like the person who would most likely wants to lead a team because I remember she shouted Avengers Assemble but I want either Miles, Cho or Teen Cyclops to lead or maybe Champions doesn't have a leader but a de-facto leader.