New Champions Appreciation 2018

[Valamist]

I always hate this line of thought. Straight characters can focus on romance as much as they want, and no one complains that it's their "defining trait." But if an LGBT+ character exists in a book, people start the "I don't it to be their defining trait" talk. What does that even mean? Is it OK for an LGBT+ character to have a romantic relationship? For that relationship to be a major part of their arc in a book?

Well said.

For a arc no but when that becomes all of what they are at the cost of other characters then that is when the problems starts, being a mopey love lorn teen use to not be all that Wiccan was but once Gillen's YA started that is all he became and by proxy that is all others became near him, even when Hulkling had his own arc in New Avengers it still became all about Wiccan and less about Hulkling.

I like Hulkling but why bother trying to read about him when it'll just be woe is me Wiccan stories again

I dunno, I really liked that storyline in Gillen's YA series. I love both characters and the fact that their relationship is a part of their characters and motivations really is not a negative for me.

That being said, I would like Hulkling to get more spotlight. Wiccan dose have a habit of overshadowing him, perhaps because he is a more popular character. I think that was one of my favorite aspects of Al Ewing's 'Original Sins' mini series actually. He was basically the main cast member, with Wiccan only appearing once in a text, I think. He seems to be doing well at balancing them out in New Avengers too.

[Wiccan]

For a arc no but when that becomes all of what they are at the cost of other characters then that is when the problems starts, being a mopey love lorn teen use to not be all that Wiccan was

What exactly do you think Billy was that Gillen didn't explored? If we count only the Young Avengers volumes, Gillen's one gave much more development. He got all the demiurge story, he was the focus of the bigger mother plot, and even Loki and MAC's roles were about him. There's Children's Crusade who was pretty much Wiccan-focused and everything, but there he could interact with Wanda, Magneto, Pietro, Captain America, Doom, stuff that can't really be the focus of a YA-only book.

[Tiamatty]

For a arc no but when that becomes all of what they are at the cost of other characters then that is when the problems starts, being a mopey love lorn teen use to not be all that Wiccan was but once Gillen's YA started that is all he became and by proxy that is all others became near him, even when Hulkling had his own arc in New Avengers it still became all about Wiccan and less about Hulkling.

I like Hulkling but why bother trying to read about him when it'll just be woe is me Wiccan stories again

Do you make these same complaints when it's a straight couple? Because what you're describing isn't exactly unusual in stories about straight characters. "Mopey love-lorn teen" is a pretty good description of, like, the first 25 years of Amazing Spider-Man. I'd also note that it's not actually a great description of Wiccan from the Gillen/McKelvie YA. His thing in that book wasn't being love-lorn. His thing wasn't even actually his romantic relationship. His thing was his fear of his own power and his desire to be responsible. Yes, he also had some problems in his relationship with Hulkling, but those were secondary to his own self-doubts. And Wiccan wasn't "woe is me" in New Avengers, either. In fact, he was the exact opposite. He talked about his struggles with self-confidence, but he talked about it as part of a speech about how he keeps going and how he won't let some jackass Eldritch Abomination make him feel bad.

[Vak]

Nova being lgbt wouldn't make sense. No signs of that in his previous issues or appearances.

I agree this would not make any sense…
I GREATLY enjoy the Character Nova (Sam Alexander) and I try to pick up anything and everything that has him in it. For me (and am only speaking for myself) this would be out of character for Sam. If Marvel or Mark Waid on the other hand now wish for homosexuality to be a part of the character’s make up… so be it. For me this breaks the character and the character takes a sharp left turn. I will only say that, though am a big fan of Nova, this would be the end of his journey for me. Not sure why they feel the need to change the character like this (I can only guess). Anyway, BIG THANKS Marvel for giving me a good comic… I did enjoy Sam, and I was a BIG Fan!!! But for me his story will end here if such a character changing event takes place. Sad... I was really enjoying Champions too.
SamandCarrie.jpg

[The Negative Zone]

I agree this would not make any sense…
I GREATLY enjoy the Character Nova (Sam Alexander) and I try to pick up anything and everything that has him in it. For me (and am only speaking for myself) this would be out of character for Sam. If Marvel or Mark Waid on the other hand now wish for homosexuality to be a part of the character’s make up… so be it. For me this breaks the character and the character takes a sharp left turn. I will only say that, though am a big fan of Nova, this would be the end of his journey for me. Not sure why they feel the need to change the character like this (I can only guess). Anyway, BIG THANKS Marvel for giving me a good comic…

Unless Waid starts building up Nova as being Bi now then I don't see much explanation for him not being straight.

I honestly doubt any of the current Champions will be lgbt unless they add in some more characters. Though I can see Viv being bi or asexual.

[Tiamatty]

For the record, Sam is young and has very little romantic or sexual experience, and like most teen boys, he's had particular views of masculinity pushed on him by the world around him, including being bullied because people saw his father as not being much of a man. He's almost certainly internalized many of those lessons about what it means to be a man - it's damned near impossible not to.

So, yeah, I would see absolutely no problem with him wrestling with his sexuality. He very well could be bisexual, and simply in denial about it. (Hell, he could be gay and in denial about it, though if he were to come out as anything, my preference would be bisexual.)

I don't know that I would expect Waid to reveal Sam as gay or bi, though. That would step on the toes of Sam's solo writer pretty heavily, and I don't think Waid's the type to do that. That's why, of the lot already included, Viv is the one most likely to come out as anything other than straight. Another character being added is also possible.

[Johnrevenge]

Unless Waid starts building up Nova as being Bi now then I don't see much explanation for him not being straight.

I honestly doubt any of the current Champions will be lgbt unless they add in some more characters. Though I can see Viv being bi or asexual.

Yeah, it would be better to bring a new member who is lgbt to the team (there are Karolina Dean, Julie Power, Hulkling, Wiccan, Anole, Bling!, Striker or Cullen Bloodstone, all of them amazing characters). If Waid is going to explore the sexuality of a character that will be Viv (is the only character whom Waid had liberty to write as she isn't in the hands of others writers).

[mugiwara]

Yeah, it would be better to bring a new member who is lgbt to the team (there are Karolina Dean, Julie Power, Hulkling, Wiccan, Anole, Bling!, Striker or Cullen Bloodstone, all of them amazing characters). If Waid is going to explore the sexuality of a character that will be Viv (is the only character whom Waid had liberty to write as she isn't in the hands of others writers).

Filthy non legacy/iconic characters allowed to breath the same air as Marvel's little darlings? Not gonna happen.

Also I wonder why Sam is seen as a most likely choice than Miles or Kamala. In the comics, I mean (IRL, it's because Miles and Kamala are far more popular and always had the same writers). Miles has little more experience with girls than Sam, and AFAIK Kamala didn't even get to first base with boys yet.

[Johnrevenge]

Filthy non legacy/iconic characters allowed to breath the same air as Marvel's little darlings? Not gonna happen.

Yeah, that's one of the main issues with Marvel, they treat their teen heroes like crap and only use the ones that are the "transient trend" till those get replaced by the new wave of teen characters and fall in limbo alongside the rest.

[Gray Lensman]

Filthy non legacy/iconic characters allowed to breath the same air as Marvel's little darlings? Not gonna happen.

Also I wonder why Sam is seen as a most likely choice than Miles or Kamala. In the comics, I mean (IRL, it's because Miles and Kamala are far more popular and always had the same writers). Miles has little more experience with girls than Sam, and AFAIK Kamala didn't even get to first base with boys yet.

My guess on Kamala and Miles would be that since they are already very popular characters in their own right, it's not likely that Marvel will change things. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." - that's a mentality I can easily see at play here. When DC changed one of the Green Lantern characters, they chose the Golden Age version (who was shoved off to an alternate Earth as well, as part of DC's war on anything not from the Silver Age or 90's), and even that was because they retgoned Obsidian (because the adult child of a Superhero means he was around before the only-important Silver Age characters that showed up 10 years ago).

I had better stop - I'm beginning to rant about unrelated stuff.

[Tycon]

Miles is a bit of a horndog for girls, it'll be a very long time and a couple years after Bendis' death will someone maybe think of making Miles bi

I've always had a problem with Bendis with his LGBT representation (well except for his recent X-Men run). It's like when he has a character express their sexuality as anything nonstraight, it's always an offhanded comment or something. Though, I still think Fabio and Ganke are gonna have a thing.

Nova being lgbt wouldn't make sense. No signs of that in his previous issues or appearances.

"signs"? He spent most of his series fighting aliens in space. He can easily be bisexual.

Probably Sam more cause in Space, everything is fluid. Or something.

This. Definitely this.

[Tiamatty]

I've always had a problem with Bendis with his LGBT representation (well except for his recent X-Men run). It's like when he has a character express their sexuality as anything nonstraight, it's always an offhanded comment or something. Though, I still think Fabio and Ganke are gonna have a thing.

I've said the same thing about Bendis. I've seen him get praise for including LGBT+ characters. And a few years ago, yeah, that was praiseworthy. But I am no longer willing to give him credit for acknowledging that LGBT+ people exist. He needs to actually do something with the fact that they're LGBT+.

[Sutekh]

Yeah, it would be better to bring a new member who is lgbt to the team (there are Karolina Dean, Julie Power, Hulkling, Wiccan, Anole, Bling!, Striker or Cullen Bloodstone, all of them amazing characters). If Waid is going to explore the sexuality of a character that will be Viv (is the only character whom Waid had liberty to write as she isn't in the hands of others writers).

Bling! would add some much needed sass to the team, and is probably the least likely of those listed to ever be seen anywhere else again. Others, like Striker, Julie Power and Karolina Dean, feel a little too old for this group, no matter much I'd like to see Striker or Karolina again (and Hulkling and Wiccan are both too big for the room, and, generally, a package deal). Cullen could be interesting as well, and Anole would have the interesting angle of being familiar with the adult Cyclops, but not at all with the teen Cyclops, which could lead to some awkwardness and mistaken assumptions.

[The Negative Zone]

"signs"? He spent most of his series fighting aliens in space. He can easily be bisexual.

Wouldn't we have at least seen some hint of Nova being lgbt by now? Like inner denial or something? We've been in his head.

[PyroTwilight]

I suppose the LGBT member(s) could even be Riri or the new Falcon.