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  1. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ceebiro View Post
    I get where they were going with the sex (Barbara DOES indeed have power in the Bruce/Barbara dynamic), but I don't like how they handled things after the act.

    To be honest, I feel like the Batgirl prologue and spoilers:
    Oracle
    end of spoilers epilogue felt like completely separate movies attached to TKJ.
    Don't like how they handled things after the act how? Him ignoring her? That plays out in the real world a lot.

  2. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrimsonRain666 View Post
    Don't like how they handled things after the act how? Him ignoring her? That plays out in the real world a lot.
    That things happen in real life doesn't mean that it works for the story they're telling, especially as far as we are made to understand the characters. I get what they were going for but I think the whole sex bit and the fallout was a pointless addition to their interaction.

    Besides, the dock scene basically showed the merit to both characters perspectives without Barbara needing to physically dominate Bruce.

  3. #108
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    The fact that they're big idea to show her "in-control" also says a lot about their thought process (none of it good unfortunately).

  4. #109
    Unapologetic NYer GDC3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan12456 View Post
    If you don't see how Tim Drake killing someone or Bruce banging one of his students is out of character I don't know what to tell you.

    May read a comic about one of the characters some time?
    Partner, not student. It's a trope in cop dramas used all the time. Partners get close, tensions rise, one thing leads to another, then the awkward aftermath.
    Last edited by GDC3; 07-26-2016 at 09:47 AM.
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  5. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Babs View Post
    Bruce Timm did amazing things, yes, but that doesn't make him infallible, and he certainly didn't do those things all by himself. After these 20+ years, it's now getting more and more obvious that people treated Bruce Timm as the poster-child for the DCAU, people calling it the "Timmverse" when most of the actual writing came from Paul Dini. It's them as a duo who created BTAS. Arkham Asylum and Arkham City, the writing for those games was as good as BTAS... because they had Paul Dini.
    Of course Timm isn't infallible. No one is. And yes, obviously Timm didn't do everything by himself. For exampe, when a director directs a movie, he/she doesn't do everything by themselves. It's a team effort. But the directer is the main driving force. That's basically what Timm is.

    The vile some people here are spouting is ridiculous. It reminds me of how people turned on Raimi, Nolan, and Whedon over time.

    And for the record, I like Dini, but I think he's a tad overrated. He hasn't really wrote anything that good since the B:TAS days. The story in Arkham city was actually a bit of a mess (arkham origins had a much better story).

  6. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan12456 View Post
    If you don't see how Tim Drake killing someone or Bruce banging one of his students is out of character I don't know what to tell you.

    May read a comic about one of the characters some time?
    Please don't insinuate I don't read comics. I know all the bat characters very well.

    I'm not sure how familiar you are with the DCAU, but Tim Drake kills the joker, and when he does, it's treated as the most horrific thing in the DCAU. It completely breaks Tim, and he stops being Robin. It's a very powerful moment.

    And in the DCAU, it's never shown Bruce and Barbara banged. In B:TAS, Barbara was Batman's student and friend.

    Barbara mentions to Terry in Batman Beyond that she briefly dated with Bruce, but it's treated as a wink and something that was wrong. If you don't like that, I understand, but saying Bruce Timm doesn't get Batman or it's characters is ludicrous.

  7. #112
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    Amazon order OFFICIALLY Cancelled.

  8. #113
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    Just watched it. Yuck! I need to really just stop watching DC movies because they always infuriate me how they handle their characters. The quality of what we got, plus the comic con panel fiasco, plus the hype going in really make this film a disaster. I would strongly implore those who haven't seen it to give it a pass.

  9. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by capNthor View Post
    Just watched it. Yuck! I need to really just stop watching DC movies because they always infuriate me how they handle their characters. The quality of what we got, plus the comic con panel fiasco, plus the hype going in really make this film a disaster. I would strongly implore those who haven't seen it to give it a pass.
    I guess this is going to be another love it or hate it movie with no middle ground. I loved everything about the movie. The theater I was in last night was packed...and as I walked out all I heard were positive things about it.

  10. #115
    Astonishing Member dan12456's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GDC3 View Post
    Partner, not student. It's a trope in cop dramas used all the time. Partners get close, tensions rise, one thing leads to another, then the awkward aftermath.
    Uhm no student. Even the producers and writers admit this and that Bruce had a parental role in her life. This fact is literally not up for debate. You can pretend to change the word but it's canon in this continuity that Bruce was her teacher.
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  11. #116
    Unapologetic NYer GDC3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan12456 View Post
    Uhm no student. Even the producers and writers admit this and that Bruce had a parental role in her life. This fact is literally not up for debate. You can pretend to change the word but it's canon in this continuity that Bruce was her teacher.
    Going by the movie where the word partner is repeatedly used. You can watch the movie and not assign your own bias to make it seem creepier than it is. You're right. It isn't up for debate, based on the film being talked about and the context of the relationship shown therein. So, I'm not pretending to change jack. The word "partner" is assigned to their relationship, not "student." In the film.
    Last edited by GDC3; 07-26-2016 at 02:16 PM.
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  12. #117
    Astonishing Member dan12456's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GDC3 View Post
    Going by the movie where the word partner is repeatedly used. You can watch the movie and not assign your own bias to make it seem creepier than it is. You're right. It isn't up for debate, based on the film being talked about and the context of the relationship shown therein. So, I'm not pretending to change jack. The word "partner" is assigned to their relationship, not "student." In the film.
    Partner who was his student, it's possible to be both. It's semantics bro. The people who made the bloody thing disagree with you. I'm not adding my own bias, Timm fricken talks about Bruce's parental role in Barbara's life in interviews.

    You can try to ignore that Bruce was her teacher in this continuity all you want if it helps you enjoy that sex scene, but its fact Bruce was her teacher.
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    Future Pull: Killmonger.

  13. #118
    Astonishing Member Darkspellmaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan12456 View Post
    Partner who was his student, it's possible to be both. It's semantics bro. The people who made the bloody thing disagree with you. I'm not adding my own bias, Timm fricken talks about Bruce's parental role in Barbara's life in interviews.

    You can try to ignore that Bruce was her teacher in this continuity all you want if it helps you enjoy that sex scene, but its fact Bruce was her teacher.
    Ignoring that factor, you have to consider, if Bruce is older then her and he's known Jim for years then he would have seen Babs growing up to the age she is at now. We know that Joker showed up when she was six, according to her, and it's assumed that Bruce has been doing this for a longer time then that, and he was 8 when his parents died, and started roughly when he was 20, and the Joker showed up later when Batman was already around, this means that Bruce was around while she was growing up. Bear in mind that Bruce sees Jim as a mentor/parent like figure as well, so that doubles the creepy factor here. Then, we don't know if she knows who Batman is, and you have an added layer of the whole Black cat and Spider-man issue where she has the hots for the Bat but probably wouldn't be interested in the man behind the mask in Bruce, or would freak out by it because, again, she probably grew up knowing Bruce Wayne in some way due to her dad's work and his past connection to Bruce when he was a kid.

    So by that logic you have a case of not only Babs sleeping with a man she doesn't know (and given the situation she may not have taken off his mask, and I kinda doubt he brings along protection with him for roof top mamboing), but Bruce allowing her to do it as a way to satifey her own anger issue, with the mentor/student thing topping it with the fact that it's his own mentor's daughter who he saw grow up since she was a kid. That's pretty damn disturbing.

  14. #119
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    Man, all the reaching people do to get outrage about this could win gold medal at the Olympics.
    Anyways the movie made over 3m for it's debut night.
    Footage of DC/WB reaction to the controversy below.

  15. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by mabromov View Post
    Of course Timm isn't infallible. No one is. And yes, obviously Timm didn't do everything by himself. For exampe, when a director directs a movie, he/she doesn't do everything by themselves. It's a team effort. But the directer is the main driving force. That's basically what Timm is.

    The vile some people here are spouting is ridiculous. It reminds me of how people turned on Raimi, Nolan, and Whedon over time.

    And for the record, I like Dini, but I think he's a tad overrated. He hasn't really wrote anything that good since the B:TAS days. The story in Arkham city was actually a bit of a mess (arkham origins had a much better story).
    Dini also wrote Arkham Asylum, which was the strongest plot of the games. And a very good run on Detective Comics. And the critically acclaimed Dark Night: A True Batman Story.

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