All-New Marvel is Starting to make me All-Pissed

[brettc1]

But Jay Garrick had the mantle first so he's the only Flash by your logic.



Nobody thinks that everyone against the their current direction is sexist and racist, but the page is clearly making fun of the ones that are.

That's interesting and true.

But there hadn't been a Flash comic for ten years when Barry Allen first appeared and the characters themselves were not embedded in pop culture as they are now. Also Jay only had just over a decade as the Flash, compared to Barry being the character for three times as long before COIE. Thor has been Thor for half a century.

And even then, jay returned in the now classic JLA/JSA crossover. Nor did Barry steal his powers to replace him in universe.

[Shirayuki]

That's interesting and true.

But there hadn't been a Flash comic for ten years when Barry Allen first appeared and the characters themselves were not embedded in pop culture as they are now. Also Jay only had just over a decade as the Flash, compared to Barry being the character for three times as lon before COIE.

And even then, jay returned in the now classic JLA/JSA crossover. Nor did Barry steal his powers to replace him in universe.

As far as the mainstream is concerned the mantles are with the original characters outside of Captain Marvel due to the movies. You could also make that return argument for heroes like Bruce Banner and Tony Stark as well because we all know they will be back in far less time than it took for both Jay and Barry.

[brettc1]

As far as the mainstream is concerned the mantles are with the original characters outside of Captain Marvel due to the movies. You could also make that return argument for heroes like Bruce Banner and Tony Stark as well because we all know they will be back in far less time than it took for both Jay and Barry.

As far as the mainstream are concerned. But seeing Thor as Thor one every two or three years on screen is not necessarily commensurate with seeing as not-Thor through 24 to 26 issues of a monthly comic

The snap back effect is also interesting because it show that change is indeed glacial, if it happen at all. One suspects the purpose of these characters being introduced as replacements in classic titles is to get enough fans interested in them to support their own stand alone titles.

[WaxHawk]

[QUOTE=Cowtools;2224369]By the examples you use, it seems like these fans would only be satisfied if their favourite character is winning every issue, all the time. Those kinds of fans are impossible to please, like fan shippers. Marvel would do better to ignore them completely for the sake of the rest of their audience's sanity.

Firstly, it appears I was a bit erroneous with my Steve Rogers call, as was pointed out to me and I have since investigated, it seems like his present comic could be the beginning of his rise to being his old character. I would be interested to learn from classic fans if they agree with this assessment.

However this doesn't address your comment. I think those fans are easy to please, but as you point out it could be boring, although for the most part these characters have been on top for the last 30 years. Anyway when I think of the best moments of my favourite characters it is when they won, not lost. (And I didn't mean to imply winning every issue, all the time).

Ultimately though if fans aren't happy with direction of their favourite character they have every right to express it, even if you and I disagree.

[Prof. Warren]

Yeah, unlike Jean Grey, Hulk is used in the MCU.

Seeing as Teen Jean has been back in the MU for quite some time now with no sign of leaving, I don't think Jean fans can say that Marvel is ignoring the character because she isn't in the Marvel movie-verse. It might not be the adult Jean but it's still Jean.

And we know Bruce Banner will be back because it's Bruce Banner. In what world would this iconic character be left for dead forever? And Bruce's inevitable resurrection has nothing to do with the movies. Comic characters have been killed and brought back on a regular basis long before they had any special cache in film.

[ed2962]

I don't think the issue is that they aren't coming back - anyone who reads comics knows that with the 'cycle of life' heroes die then come back to life, hit the lowest of lows and then rise to greatness again. Some fans like their characters at their greatest or at least on the rise, I can understand that. Right now you'd be hard pressed to say the Steve is at his greatest or on the rise - isn't he being mind-controlled? That is a difficult position to rise from. Thor has been absent for a while now and I assume his new book will be about his rise to greatness but that hasn't begun yet (unless missed something).

Sure but that's the narrative that some fans are trying to push...that all our white male heroes are being taken away never to be seen again and that this is all due to a secret cabal of extreme leftists on tumblr that is holding Marvel hostage. Of course, not everyone thinks this, some are just bummed that their fav hero has to share the spotlight for a moment, but there are folks out there who do.

[macattack]

Where in that segment does it say that everyone who prefers Whatshisface to Kamala Khan is sexist?

It is not so much what is said as can be inferred considering the way fans against the new direction have been treated on Twitter, Tumblr, CBR, and elsewhere.

I suggested that Michiko Musashi, Pepper Potts, and Lila Rhodes all would have made more sense for the new storyline than creating Riri from scratch and I have been called sexist and racist by the rabid defenders despite suggesting three women and one of them is the same race as Riri.

So forgive me for getting a little defensive when the SOP is to lump everyone together as a sexist/racist/Trumpkin cabal.

[Frontier]

And we know Bruce Banner will be back because it's Bruce Banner. In what world would this iconic character be left for dead forever? And Bruce's inevitable resurrection has nothing to do with the movies. Comic characters have been killed and brought back on a regular basis long before they had any special cache in film.

Well, considering pretty much every major return and revival seems timed with when the character has a new movie coming out...

[CaptCleghorn]

Gaiman's Miracleman: the Silver Age and Hickman's SHIELD remain unfinished. That's how Marvel p!$$e$ me off.

That there is some justified fanboy rage.

[sifighter]

Am I completely happy with what Marvel is doing right now? No I'm not, CWII to me is just bad and I'm simply choosing to ignore it until Marvel Now 2.0 starts while I'm simply not interested in the Hail Hydra story arc and dropped Sam Wilson because of it.

However I'm never going to tell marvel to go to hell and that I'll stop reading them, because I've been reading long enough to know that things will change and that not all of these storylines won't last forever. Not to mention some of the things that they are releasing are either interesting or have some potential, that includes the new legacy/replacement hero series. That's my opinion any way.

[Child of the Past]

No one likes to see their favorite characters sidelined just to make way for someone else. I myself am fine with most of the changes (Robbie Reyes, Kamala Khan, Miles Morales, Sam Wilson) while others seem illogical, (Jane Foster, Riri Williams). I have nothing against the characters themselves but some of the narrative leaps that were made to explain their taking of an established mantle bothered me. Did they need to kill Bruce Banner and Jennifer Walters? Absolutely not. Did they need to make Thor Unworthy with no explanation? Absolutely not. Some of these decisions imo were clear attempts to get rid of established characters so that the new heroes could shine. Theoretically this isn't a bad tactic but when it's done numerous times in he span of a couple of months/years people will start noticing and they will get mad. Some will get mad because they simply don't like change while others just don't like Marvels attempts to manipulate them. Either way a part of the fan base feels jaded and that can hurt sales lower general interest in the brand itself. The key to this whole thing is communication between the fans and Marvel to let them know what we want and also to buy the books if and when they give us what we want. I hope we can get to a point where all or most of the characters we love are respected and represented in some form that way all parties are happy.

[CrimsonEchidna]

Am I completely happy with what Marvel is doing right now? No I'm not, CWII to me is just bad and I'm simply choosing to ignore it until Marvel Now 2.0 starts while I'm simply not interested in the Hail Hydra story arc and dropped Sam Wilson because of it.

What does one have to do with the other?

[sifighter]

What does one have to do with the other?

Because both are written by the same writer, and both characters are not only Captain America but also close friends so soon enough Sam will learn about Steve being a hydra agent and it will influence his ongoing.

[Pat Thomas]

Because both are written by the same writer, and both characters are not only Captain America but also close friends so soon enough Sam will learn about Steve being a hydra agent and it will influence his ongoing.

You sure that's why you're not reading Sam's book? That just sounds like a convenient excuse for an ulterior motive.

[sifighter]

You sure that's why you're not reading Sam's book? That just sounds like a convenient excuse for an ulterior motive.

Huh? No I dropped the book, so far I've been enjoying the series and thought that Sam has made an interesting captain America but I'm just not interested in the big Hail Hydra story at the moment that will no doubt be some big crossover event, not mad at it just have no interest in it what's so ever. So when I redid my pull list I just dropped him, maybe I'll add him again afterwords.