Zack Snyder's Superman isn't 'Dark,' He's 'Relatable'

[CBR News]

Producer Deborah Snyder has a different idea about whether "Man of Steel" and "Batman v Superman" dragged the hero into grim and gritty territory.


Full article here.

[Sacred Knight]

Superman's relatable already, without forcing it. If you can't find those nuances and subtleties, then that's on you as the creator.

[FlashingSabre]

Superman's relatable already, without forcing it. If you can't find those nuances and subtleties, then that's on you as the creator.

Agreed. Making him clinically depressed is not the answer. All that does is make him a drag to watch.

[Krysmopompas]

Agreed. Making him clinically depressed is not the answer. All that does is make him a drag to watch.

Agreed x2. When Captain America is more Superman than Superman, there's a problem.

[TOTALITY]

"People are complex, we’re not strictly just the good Boy Scout trying to do good".... so close to getting what makes Superman more than his cape and powers, yet so far.

[Cowtools]

Well persoanlly I know I'm constantly worrying about whether I should snap a man's neck to save a family or fight a guy in a big robot suit rather than talk to him for more than 2 seconds. Those are the kind of 'relatable' moral decisions that every human faces, right?

What is so awful about what she says - and the fanboys who spew the same idiocy - is that ultimately it reveals what a low opinion they have of the average viewer. Not only that we need superheroes to be 'relatable' to be interested in them - because we don't have imaginations or our attention spans are shot or whatever it is they think - but also that our moral compasses are so skewed that we'd can identify with the warped morality of the characters they push.

Like, we understand that Superman has to make hard moral choices. But that doesn't mean we're going to agree with the specific moral choices you make him have.

"To me that’s not dark, that’s life. We’re complicated people. And we’re making him in that way more relatable.
People are complex, we’re not strictly just the good Boy Scout trying to do good," she continued. "He does want to do good, and I think all of the the things Superman represents are who he is, but he also stumbles along the way and learns from it. To me, that’s so much more interesting.

Yes, okay, but we can understand that deliberately punching your way through and exploding a gas station with people around it is not good, and nor is stepping gracefully over a thrown gas truck and allowing it to blow up the building behind you, and nor is letting a building full of innocents explode around you and flying off without saying a word, and nor is etc etc.
Most of your viewers don't need to learn that these things are wrong, so why does Superman need to learn them?
Because the people making the movie think the audience are morons.

[Hutchimus Prime]

"People are complex, we’re not strictly just the good Boy Scout trying to do good".

Right, which is why Superman shows us that while complex we can be better, but there's no room for that in Randian-centric world Snyder gave us. Hopefully, it lightens up a bit now.

And last I checked "relatable" and "morose" aren't synonymous.

[Teek]

You spin me right round, baby right round.

[shamus]

Superman as a character has typically reflected what was best in all of us. He shows us the nobler side of humanity. Having to explain that a character is relatable is kind of like explaining to someone why a joke is funny. If you have to do that then it really isn't. I really am disappointed with the way Warner Brothers has given Snyder the lead on the DC Cinematic Universe. I grew up with these characters but he's taken them to a place I don't much enjoy not to mention the lack of storytelling that is going on so far in these films. On the bright side. DC seems to have got it mostly right on TV with the Flash , Green Arrow and even Legends of Tomorrow to some degree. These feel truer to the spirit of the comic books to me than the films (and have actual characters and plots).

[shamus]

"
And last I checked "relatable" and "morose" aren't synonymous."

precisely things don't have to be dark to be grounded and humanized.

[johnnyrocket]

The film is shot colorless and muted. The iconography and organic design of krypton and it's technology is dark. It's an homage to HR Geiger.. The music is majestic but dark. You pay off 2/3s of movie with two father figures (both dead) talking about being a symbol of hope with an ending that highlights a hopeless no win decision. Your second film was even darker. BY DESIGN. Own it for God's sake. Admitting you have problem is the first step to recovery....

[Superlad93]

I understand what she's trying to say, but that really does put the veritable rainbow tones that is life in a little gray box. A film that aimed at a more humanized take on the character didn't NEED to have so drab look and feel. It didn't NEED have an almost constant depressed air about it. Those were all very personal creative choices by Mr Snyder, ma'am. The "real world" didn't demand them.

I give credit where credit is due though. The idea of putting Superman's Campbellian hero's journey at the center of the DCU is a pretty novel idea. The idea of channeling mythological scenes and ideas and updated then in a modern context is quite cool (though ham-fistedly done in MOS and BVS at times).

But as I said above, no one or thing other than Mr Snyder (and Co) himself and his personal taste made the tone and aesthetic a must.

Just in the last few months a modern and sincere take on Superman has been done in the comics in the form of Superman: American Alien. That book runs the freakin gambit on tone while being set in the most realistic DCU I've seen since like like Superman: Secret Identity (literally set in the real world). Oh and AA probably sports the undisputed most relatable Superman/Clark Kent in like the last decade.


This is all just more compelling evidence that Edgar Wright should write and direct the next Superman movie. Why not, right?

[misslane]

Like, we understand that Superman has to make hard moral choices. But that doesn't mean we're going to agree with the specific moral choices you make him have.

What moral choice did Superman make with which you disagreed? Was it morally wrong to kill Zod to protect an innocent family?

Yes, okay, but we can understand that deliberately punching your way through and exploding a gas station with people around it is not good, and nor is stepping gracefully over a thrown gas truck and allowing it to blow up the building behind you, and nor is letting a building full of innocents explode around you and flying off without saying a word, and nor is etc etc.
Most of your viewers don't need to learn that these things are wrong, so why does Superman need to learn them?
Because the people making the movie think the audience are morons.

Um, you're not seriously suggesting Superman wanted to and purposefully chose to take battle Zod and his Kryptonian soldiers to more dangerous and populated areas? You expect me to trust your assessment of Superman's characterization when you watched Man of Steel and genuinely believed that Superman wanted to endanger as many lives as possible and destroy as much property as possible. It never occurred to you that he was inexperienced and scared, which made it difficult for him to manage the situation better? He had literally never been in a fight involving superpowers before. He had never battled anyone of his equivalent ability, yet the expectation is that he execute a strategic battle plan? Ridiculous!

[misslane]

And last I checked "relatable" and "morose" aren't synonymous.

Last I checked, that's not what Snyder is saying. She's saying that it is relatable for someone to be morose in the face of massive public backlash and multiple experiences of trying to do the right thing only to have it literally blow up in your face. I challenge anyone who would argue that someone wouldn't struggle emotionally in the face of that much fear, hatred, and blame directed towards you just because you are different.

[Kilgore Trout]

Agreed x2. When Captain America is more Superman than Superman, there's a problem.

No lie on Marvel's Captain America being a Superman's Superman. But I still don't get how Superman is relatable. Is it just his ability to be depressed? Or because his Mom's name is Martha? Or is it his ability to fly? Or his super speed? Or his super strength? Or the way he shoots fricken laser beams out of his eyes? Or is it because he's from another planet that makes him like us?

I always thought the best Superman portrayal's were INSPIRATIONAL not RELATABLE...