Why does Alan Moore hate Grant Morrison

[Mr.Majestic]

I recall hearing that Millar swiped some ideas from Morrison for "Red Son". (Morrison made a few suggestions that helped polish the book, and has never been credited by Millar.)

Shoulda known. Red Son was too damn good to just be from Millar.

Could it be Brexit?

Anything that goes awry in Great Britain for the next 20 years will be blamed on Brexit.

[dancj]

I feel that he is justified in his opinion as the comic book world has barely moved forward since he helped revolutionize it in the 80's, thirty years later and DC and Marvel are no further than the Killing Joke or Watchmen

I think comics have evolved hugely in that 30 years. Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns (not so much The Killing Joke IMO) were massively ahead of their time in many ways and works by incredibly talented writers. There's no way you can expect the average writer to be churning out work of that quality on a regular basis. You also probably shouldn't be looking at superhero comics for works that do push up the quality. In general though, I can't look at works from 30 years ago and then look at things like Locke and Key, Saga, Final Crisis, WE3, Descender and Punisher Max without thinking the medium has definitely moved forward.

[dancj]

I recall hearing that Millar swiped some ideas from Morrison for "Red Son". (Morrison made a few suggestions that helped polish the book, and has never been credited by Millar.)

As far as I'm aware, it's just the spoilers:

time travel ending

end of spoilers - which never really fitted with the rest of the book anyway - and I was under the impression that the idea was a gift from Morrison. It might have had something to do with it though.

[Judge Dredd]

As far as I'm aware, it's just the spoilers:

time travel ending

end of spoilers - which never really fitted with the rest of the book anyway - and I was under the impression that the idea was a gift from Morrison. It might have had something to do with it though.

That is correct he did get that part from Morrison, I do not think that it had anything to do with the fall out. It sounds more like Morrison suggested it to him then it being swiped.

[Vilynne]

This Millar/Morrison rivalry has become far more interesting to me. I was always under the inpession the two were good friends. They did many projects together.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

This Millar/Morrison rivalry has become far more interesting to me. I was always under the inpession the two were good friends. They did many projects together.

They did and some of it was amongst the best stuff either or them produced because they negated each other's weaknesses. Morrison can sometime get so in his head with crazy ideas, he forgets to give his readers a lifeline to follow everything that's happening. This is why a lot of Morrison's stuff gets better with subsequent re-reads. Whereas Millar is often too concerned with playing to the most juvenile parts of his readership when he's clearly a very intelligent and thoughtful writer.

The yin & yang of Morrison's trippy high concepts and Millar's shameless populism was a great combination.

[dancj]

They did and some of it was amongst the best stuff either or them produced because they negated each other's weaknesses. Morrison can sometime get so in his head with crazy ideas, he forgets to give his readers a lifeline to follow everything that's happening. This is why a lot of Morrison's stuff gets better with subsequent re-reads. Whereas Millar is often too concerned with playing to the most juvenile parts of his readership when he's clearly a very intelligent and thoughtful writer.

The yin & yang of Morrison's trippy high concepts and Millar's shameless populism was a great combination.

I've always thought the opposite. I like their collaborations, but with the exception of the glorious Big Dave, I've always found that their individual work was better.

[Brave Sir Robin]

Anything that goes awry in Great Britain for the next 20 years will be blamed on Brexit.

And chances are, it would be accurate in part. You can't blame it for everything, by economic suicide based on bigotry and a naïve belief that your empire still exists is kind of a recipe for disaster.

BTW, I was originally somewhat dismayed but intrigued by the thread because some people still think Watchman is a great work of fiction and that its author is some kind of genius. I think we sell the medium short when we do that.

[The Beast Of Yucca Flats]

BTW, I was originally somewhat dismayed but intrigued by the thread because some people still think Watchman is a great work of fiction and that its author is some kind of genius. I think we sell the medium short when we do that.

What the hell, I'll ask: Why is this so?

Seriously, what is wrong with Watchmen having the status it does? How are genres or entire storytelling-mediums supposed to last without producing works of serious merit somewhere along the line?

I mean, if I'm right here, and this is yet another "Watchmen ruined comics'-argument that's being made, let me pose another question: what's so magical about the superhero genre if it's largely just stewing in it's own juices? Really, what is the value in all that? What's it worth to keep this stuff 'pure' if it's mostly just rote dross produced for die-hard fans?

[JackDaw]

And chances are, it would be accurate in part. You can't blame it for everything, by economic suicide based on bigotry and a naïve belief that your empire still exists is kind of a recipe for disaster.

BTW, I was originally somewhat dismayed but intrigued by the thread because some people still think Watchman is a great work of fiction and that its author is some kind of genius. I think we sell the medium short when we do that.

Not (bigotry and naive belief) what most "Out" voters based their decision on!

The economic forecasts that were produced by various "authorities" were incredibly biased...I took the trouble to look at the assumptions under-pinning several of them, and came to conclusion that the ones I looked at made assumptions that would not be used by competent economists UNLESS they wanted to exaggerate adverse impact of UK leaving Brexit.

Look at it this way...the EU by itself produces no goods or services that benefit its member states directly...the EU bureaucracy takes substantial amounts from member states and uses a large part of the take to maintain its own staff in great luxury.

The remainder goes back in grants to member states...but the grant decisions are not decided by anybody responsible to voters in that state. It's an absurdly undemocratic institution. What was the great cry that helped to fuel the USA? Answer: "No taxation without representation"! Seriously Americans out to be natural supporters of Brexit.

[Vilynne]

They did and some of it was amongst the best stuff either or them produced because they negated each other's weaknesses. Morrison can sometime get so in his head with crazy ideas, he forgets to give his readers a lifeline to follow everything that's happening. This is why a lot of Morrison's stuff gets better with subsequent re-reads. Whereas Millar is often too concerned with playing to the most juvenile parts of his readership when he's clearly a very intelligent and thoughtful writer.

The yin & yang of Morrison's trippy high concepts and Millar's shameless populism was a great combination.

I follow that. And I agree. I enjoy their writing as a team than anything they've written separately. I wonder what sparked a feud.

[GigiFusc]

And chances are, it would be accurate in part. You can't blame it for everything, by economic suicide based on bigotry and a naïve belief that your empire still exists is kind of a recipe for disaster.

We've just had news here in the UK that the economy has had a major boost. But no-one knows how or why? Funny that. No-one blamed a positive thing on the Brexit result. You're wrong in your assumption BTW. It would not be accurate that most bad things that will happen in the UK over the next 20 years wil be because of the Brexit vote. Sorry.

BTW, I was originally somewhat dismayed but intrigued by the thread because some people still think Watchman is a great work of fiction and that its author is some kind of genius. I think we sell the medium short when we do that.

I can understand if you personally don't like Watchmen and you obviously don't think Moore is a very good writer - that's fine, no problems with that at all. But your 'dismay' that the vast majority of people hold the work and the author in such high regard is a little... Arrogant and self important tbh. Again, sorry for my bluntness.

Much love.

[Coin Biter]

If Alan Moore hadn't written Watchmen there would still be among others, his work on Swamp Thing and Superman; Marvelman and V for Vendetta; Halo Jones, and Skizz, and DR and Quinch; Supreme, League of Extraordinary Gentleman, Top 10, Promethea and Tom Strong; From Hell; and his Avatar horror work, which I haven't read, but understand to be quite good.

In short, I'd say the theory that Alan Moore is quite a good writer is relatively sound I don't personally particularly like the word "genius" to describe anyone - well, maybe Don Bradman. He was probably a bit of a genius in his own specialised field. But I think that, at the least, Alan Moore has been responsible for some pretty good work.

[Aioros22]

Eh, don't get me wrong I lilke Moore's old DC stuff, it's phenomenal, it's not my intent to trash him, just trying to think of reasons why he wouldn't like a fellow writer. As far as I know Morrison hasn't done anything to intentionally offend the guy, so really I can't imagine why Moore would have any legitimate disdain for Morrison unless it was something petty like Jealousy or somesuch.

Basically Moore is just a cranky old fart that can't accept he's not considered the best comic writer of all time by everyone & their mother anymore. Which don't get me wrong, that doesn't change the fact he had some great works in the past, but yea.....

Not to point out, but you did.

This is just a silly gossipingly question to make. Why doesn`t he? Well, buggers, why does he do anything? Is anyone obliged to enjoy everyone else just because they would all seat at the top of quality writers this company has ever have? Apart of some criticism from More targetted at Morrison`s earlier work or so, we don`t even know much about it and frankly it shouldn`t be a concern for us unless it creates distaste in the office and the death of some expected project to come out.

They`re still human beings, not machines. Just because he seems to like Neil Gaiman more doesn`t mean he should like Morrison the same amount. They`re not the same person.

[Buried Alien]

Maybe it's a hair thing; Moore has too much of it, and Morrison has none of it.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)