Nightwing #4 Preview/Discussion

[ABH]

Great ending. Fantastic art.

I hope we see more of Raptor soon.

[SiegePerilous02]

Glad to see the PoO swept under the rug quickly. Loved the appearance of Tiger, and having Dr. Levictus with the God Garden might mean we'll be seeing more of both in the future, so that makes me happy.

So...Bruce raised the same issues as Babs did last issue. Are we going to be seeing any comments about how he is a shrieking, irrational harpy that is tying Dick down?

[DGraysonWorldsGreatestSpy]

Glad to see the PoO swept under the rug quickly. Loved the appearance of Tiger, and having Dr. Levictus with the God Garden might mean we'll be seeing more of both in the future, so that makes me happy.

So...Bruce raised the same issues as Babs did last issue. Are we going to be seeing any comments about how he is a shrieking, irrational harpy that is tying Dick down?

No because the Batman problems are a different issue of getting out of his shadow by not asking him for approval constantly.

[Godlike13]

Not bad. Things with the PoO were tied up rather quickly, but we got more teases about Raptor. Overall it doesn't seem like Seeley is that interested in the Owls and is trying to move on from that plot line rather quickly. Could have done with out the Bruce/Dick spat, but i guess part of the point of Raptor is to throw a wrench into his relationships.

[Aahz]

I still don't get why the "Gray Son of Gotham" is so important for the PoO.

[DGraysonWorldsGreatestSpy]

I still don't get why the "Gray Son of Gotham" is so important for the PoO.

Because Scott Snyder Retconned it to make Dick have a special connection with Gotham because apparently an Eccentric Billionaire who dresses up as a Bat and witnesses the murder of a childs parents in a identical fashion to his own parents death and decides to take him in and train him is not enough of a backstory. The POO just don't have much legs due to how they went out in a wimper as the COO and are very much tied to Gotham and the Wayne Family. Seeley and most fans knew this which is why it took 4 issues to take them down.

[OWL45]

Because Scott Snyder Retconned it to make Dick have a special connection with Gotham because apparently an Eccentric Billionaire who dresses up as a Bat and witnesses the murder of a childs parents in a identical fashion to his own parents death and decides to take him in and train him is not enough of a backstory. The POO just don't have much legs due to how they went out in a wimper as the COO and are very much tied to Gotham and the Wayne Family. Seeley and most fans knew this which is why it took 4 issues to take them down.

You know...there are fans who do like the COO and the recon of Dick's origin to include them.

[WhipWhirlwind]

Not bad. Things with the PoO were tied up rather quickly, but we got more teases about Raptor. Overall it doesn't seem like Seeley is that interested in the Owls and is trying to move on from that plot line rather quickly. Could have done with out the Bruce/Dick spat, but i guess part of the point of Raptor is to throw a wrench into his relationships.

And its not even really a wrench, just a disagreement. I'm fine with them not seeing eye to eye on everything. I personally wish Seeley would have taken it a bit further, highlighting how batman in general is pretty hypocritical when it comes to the rules. Like a catwoman crack from Dick would have been great during that convo.

[DGraysonWorldsGreatestSpy]

You know...there are fans who do like the COO and the recon of Dick's origin to include them.

Oh I know that, my feeling are mixed because there is story potential but due to the Owls taking a backseat in Scott Snyder's run to multiple Joker stories & with him still saying that he feels they are his characters and there is a story to tell with them it leaves Dick in an position of least importance where that retcon can easily be ignored like it was in Batman v Robin and if Scott Snyder gets around to doing the Owls it will be a Bruce focused story that will probably leave little for him to do beyond support.

[OWL45]

I feel you and your not wrong. Although I don't think it can nessarily be ignored due to Robin War, Night of the Owls, etc. I agree they will be more connected to Batman in a bigger way. I think they have more connection to the Grayson's though given all of the Talons are produced through Haleys Circus. It's kind of complicated now that we are discussing it especially since I heard the podcast when Snyder said they were originally created for Dick but he had to shift them to Bruce because of the NU52 and Bruce taking back the cowl. I just think it adds an Intresting dimension to Dick's overall story and has immense potential.

[K. Jones]

Good comic. Fun stuff. Themes of Dick Grayson being the Theseus of labyrinth stories are things that used to come up a lot in the Morrison run discussions. Lots of Labyrinth talk back when Otto Netz was still alive, for instance. Nightwing still feels like an extension of the Morrison run in the same way Grayson did, though it's funny because it's kind of wearing a "Vintage Nightwing" costume. But hey, there's Damian Wayne, the St. Hadrian's suicide batgirls, Spyral, etc ...

I like this quite a bit. Didn't think of George Grayson myself, though I was definitely fishing in the "who from publication history would have historical links to Dick?" pool, albeit shallowly. George Grayson would be perfect. Whatever happened to Aunt Clara? George was one scrubby character. Compare to when they introduced Bruce's uncle Silas and he was just like, a stuffy old git, George was a proper sleaze. And hey, Kobra! Nightwing hopping between evil organizations could be a running theme here ...

[Alycat]

Good issue and I'm glad we are getting out of the Owl stuff so soon. I hate them and their relationship with Dick. Still really interested in Raptor and bonus points for a Best buddy Tiger cameo. Really lik the scene with Dick in the cave, especially with Damian watching him and Bruce argue. Now all I need is my Helena cameo.

[Batgirll]

I've congrats to Tim Seeley, in only 4 insues he made a good and solid charcater, but to me is clear since the begining que Raptor is manipulating Dick Grayson, and I wanna understand Why, and how he knows so much about him.

[Orujo-man]

Glad to see the PoO swept under the rug quickly. Loved the appearance of Tiger, and having Dr. Levictus with the God Garden might mean we'll be seeing more of both in the future, so that makes me happy.

So...Bruce raised the same issues as Babs did last issue. Are we going to be seeing any comments about how he is a shrieking, irrational harpy that is tying Dick down?

Bruce doesn't chase Dick around the world, he waits for him to finish the mission. He doesn't shout in his face that he is doing wrong. He doesn't question that Dick work with criminals. In fact he admits that sometimes they have to work with criminals. All he questioned Dick is that trusts Raptor and once the work finished, he didn't stop Raptor.

But hey, it's exactly the same, you're right. I wish Seeley had done the same thing with Babs instead of Bruce.

Leaving this aside, good issue. I'm curious to see who will make Raptor with Kobra.

[Atlanta96]

Glad to see the PoO swept under the rug quickly. Loved the appearance of Tiger, and having Dr. Levictus with the God Garden might mean we'll be seeing more of both in the future, so that makes me happy.

So...Bruce raised the same issues as Babs did last issue. Are we going to be seeing any comments about how he is a shrieking, irrational harpy that is tying Dick down?

Bruce wasn't literally screaming at Dick about what a screw-up he was. Also it makes more sense for Batman to be cynical and mistrusting than Barbara, who's character should be a bit more understanding. If it was Kate Kane giving Grayson that blasting last issue, I think it would've been tolerated better since Kate is more cynical like Bruce.