Scarlet blood drops on the stone - Kaine the Scarlet Spider (and Hummingbird) appreciation

[MASTER-OF-SUPRISE]

The thing is, you're saying that Kaine is going to see through his own deception. For this to be true, you'd have to say that people aren't capable of change. It's a status quo that you can keep going, because Kaine can work at becoming a better person. The part that should keep you coming back is the long road ahead to becoming a better person. That's a status quo that can keep going. Think about it: In Scarlet Spiders, Ben may officially pass the torch, and finally prove to Kaine that he can actually have a life to call his own. I don't see why people want him to just revert. If he goes back to just being old Kaine, he's a character that will never be seen again. Why would someone write a character that never changes in the end? It would be an insult to all of the work that's been put into him changing so far.

I agree. character's need to progress and regression hurts the characters.

[Pav]

I don't see why people want him to just revert. If he goes back to just being old Kaine, he's a character that will never be seen again. Why would someone write a character that never changes in the end? It would be an insult to all of the work that's been put into him changing so far.

Copying what I said in the Ben thread:

I get what you're saying, but at the same time, I don't think it's so cut and dry as you make it. First, some parts of a character's identity shouldn't change much if at all due to their importance. You don't see anyone ask, "Does Peter STILL believe that with great power comes great responsibility?! Jeez! Get over it already!" The concept is integral to the character; similarly, the idea of clone degeneration is what made Kaine special and different from his "brothers". Now, he's just presented as "Grumpier Ben Reilly".

Furthermore, being "stuck" with his original status won't stop Kaine from growing and changing as a character. Characters, like real people, grow and change in some ways and stay the same in other ways. Not ever becoming a woman hasn't stopped me from aging. Kaine never escaping from clone degeneration doesn't mean he can't learn to be a better human being - and in fact, if you are invested in his growth and redemption, wouldn't you rather see him trying to be better while still struggling with his greatest fear? Easy to try to reform when you're no longer a scarred monster.

So, while I totally agree that stagnation is certainly something to be avoided, there are still certain qualities that become ingrained as vital to a character's identity that shouldn't be ignored and done away with.

-Pav, who doesn't think it's necessary to act like wanting to see Kaine with more of his original characterization is illogical...

PS: I really, really feel that "the change" in Kaine you've seen is merely him becoming just an angrier Ben; I would rather read about Ben AND Kaine instead of a Kaine trying to be Ben. I've said it before and I'll say it again: I liked Kaine in the Frankenstein role, and sure, his character has progressed - but he doesn't exhibit the same archetype anymore, and there isn't really anyone to fill the hole his change has left.

I believe you keeping making the same flaw in logic: you assume that, if clone degeneration was reintroduced, it would then be impossible for the character to change in any way, and that's simply not true. And you use the word "revert" as though a reintroduction of the degeneration might not be a natural place to take the character of Kaine. Personally, I would like a story where Kaine is afraid at the emergence of his old self: a scarred clone struggling with mental illness, anger, betrayal, and all the other things that Kaine formally dealt with on a regular basis, and yeah - I also want a Scarlet Spider comic. I just want Ben Reilly in it. I want Ben back rather than having Kaine masked as Ben. But I don't want Kaine to simply "revert." I want a heart-wrenching "Flowers for Algernon" -type of a thing, to give respect to the work Yost has done (and because I want good stories!).

I totally get your side of things, and I don't disrespect your opinion on enjoying Kaine's growth. I've liked Yost's take on Kaine's redemption, too. I just don't super duper love it, is all. I miss the old Kaine and what he brought to the table.

[MASTER-OF-SUPRISE]

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...eview&id=23423

[Highland Chicken]

So I was re-reading scarlet spider 15(where kaine becomes the other) and I came across this page. I can't tell whether this is linked to Mictlan rising or Spider-verse, is it possible that the two are linked?Scarlet Spider 015-018.jpg

[Wellman]

I would love to see a mini series or digital tale where Hummingbird teamed up with Anya/Spider-Girl.

There is potential so much potential in Aracely at this point that it would be a shame if it is never explored both with Kaine at her side and as the most non-insulting version of a over talkative Marvel fan-girl turned super hero Marvel will likely ever see for a decade.

[MarioHerald]

I would love to see a mini series or digital tale where Hummingbird teamed up with Anya/Spider-Girl.

489154There is potential so much potential in Aracely at this point that it would be a shame if it is never explored both with Kaine at her side and as the most non-insulting version of a over talkative Marvel fan-girl turned super hero Marvel will likely ever see for a decade.

I agree with your assessment. It would be a shame if she isn't heard of again.

That said, I would like to see her befriend Ms. Marvel.

______________________________

Some new (and not so new) images!

Sketches from NYCC

If you follow me you know I love the New Warriors and Aracely (AKA Hummingbird) is one of my favorite characters at Marvel right now. Well in one issue she wanted to try and lift Thor’s hammer, so I got Marcus To, artist of New Warriors and all around really cool guy, to draw her wearing Thor’s helmet. It was his idea to make the helmet really big on her and it’s an adorable idea, it came out so cute.

http://professorthorgi.tumblr.com/po...-me-you-know-i

Scarlet Spider - Kaine [Parker]

http://runmonsterun.tumblr.com/post/...t-spider-kaine

[MASTER-OF-SUPRISE]

So I was re-reading scarlet spider 15(where kaine becomes the other) and I came across this page. I can't tell whether this is linked to Mictlan rising or Spider-verse, is it possible that the two are linked?Scarlet Spider 015-018.jpg

It might be possible.

I would love to see a mini series or digital tale where Hummingbird teamed up with Anya/Spider-Girl.

There is potential so much potential in Aracely at this point that it would be a shame if it is never explored both with Kaine at her side and as the most non-insulting version of a over talkative Marvel fan-girl turned super hero Marvel will likely ever see for a decade.

I agree with your assessment. It would be a shame if she isn't heard of again.

That said, I would like to see her befriend Ms. Marvel.

______________________________

Some new (and not so new) images!



Why not have Kaine and Aracely team up with both? I think there's room for a few team up stories for both.

http://professorthorgi.tumblr.com/po...-me-you-know-i





http://runmonsterun.tumblr.com/post/...t-spider-kaine

[Venomous Mask]

I always though this scene was clever as it relates to canon. In the past, it was usually Spiderman or Scarlet Spider trying to reign in Venom and lecture to him about how one should properly act as a hero, but here the roles were reversed:

[MarioHerald]

I'm just going to leave this here :P

So Marcus To made a Kaine and Faira commission…

http://baumguy.tumblr.com/post/99769...ira-commission

EDIT:

I always though this scene was clever as it relates to canon. In the past, it was usually Spiderman or Scarlet Spider trying to reign in Venom and lecture to him about how one should properly act as a hero, but here the roles were reversed:

Quite the observation! I may add a thought I had when looking at this scene: that in some way, Kaine is projecting a little bit of himself into Carnage and that his "solution" is the manner he thinks (or feels) he should be (or should have been) dealt with. And also, that if he were to be found guilty of the murders he committed when his mind was corrupted by the genetic-influenced madness that governed most of his life and sentenced to death, he wouldn't fight it.

He won't jump at it nor intentionally cause a situation where that outcome is possible - his running off gives me that impression - but he wouldn't fight it if he were in prison and shown the chair or injection chamber...

Dreadful thought. Thankfully, he has Aracely to eat his ear off and drag him from there (plus the sense of responsibility he feels for her) if that were to happen.

[Venomous Mask]

EDIT:

Quite the observation! I may add a thought I had when looking at this scene: that in some way, Kaine is projecting a little bit of himself into Carnage and that his "solution" is the manner he thinks (or feels) he should be (or should have been) dealt with. And also, that if he were to be found guilty of the murders he committed when his mind was corrupted by the genetic-influenced madness that governed most of his life and sentenced to death, he wouldn't fight it.

He won't jump at it nor intentionally cause a situation where that outcome is possible - his running off gives me that impression - but he wouldn't fight it if he were in prison and shown the chair or injection chamber...

Dreadful thought. Thankfully, he has Aracely to eat his ear off and drag him from there (plus the sense of responsibility he feels for her) if that were to happen.

This is an interesting thought. Reading the Scarlet Spider series, Kaine's guilt comes through quite strongly and he probably is projecting some of that guilt onto Carnage. He definitely does not feel that he deserves to be put in the same category as Spiderman and makes it very clear every time someone tries to do so.

What I also find interesting is how straight and narrow flash is in his analysis of the situation. Given how hostile symbiotes are to one another, I would imagine at least some of that would have come out. Maybe it was due to the drugs which neutered the symbiote.

[AJpyro]

Managed to read Yost's 2 tpbs. I officially like this series more than current Spiderman. Need to get my hands on New Warriors to keep following Kaine and Aracely.

[normanosborn]

I am so sad that Kaine won't be appearing regularly in a book. Yost totally turned a 90's style-over-substance character into a well-defined, multidimensional, interesting personality. Hope he gets another chance to finish those plotlines started in the Scarlet Spider book, still.

There should be a team book with all the spider characters of Earth 616 who can't sustain solos.

[MarioHerald]

http://runmonsterun.tumblr.com/post/...rawlie-doodles

New Warriors is out today and ****’s going down so drawings cute things was very necessary.

http://whittingtonb.tumblr.com/post/...-going-down-so



http://dimaiv-nov.tumblr.com/post/10...of-you-who-are

Scarlet Spider (Kaine) from the 12 Spiders series by Dima. Others include Spider-Woman (Jessica), Miguel O'Hara (Spider-man 2099), Mayday Parker, Spider-Assassin, Ben Reilly's Spider-man, Spider-UK and Superior Spider-man, Spider-Gwen and Silk and Spider-man (Peter Parker) and Miles Morales.

Spider-Verse y’all!

Those of you who are following me on instagram already knows that I’ve been posting spider-sketches all the week. My goal was to draw 10 spiders in 10 days. As a result it’s 12 spiders in 9 days. Not so bad, huh?

Hope you’ll find here your favourite one!

- Dima.

[MarioHerald]

Previews of Spider-verse's "Scarlet Spiders" with Kaine, Ben Reilly and Ultimate Jessica Drew against the science-focused brother of Morlun called Jennix.

Scarlet Spider #1 (Supposedly comes out next week on November 19).
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...eview&id=24270

Scarlet Spider #2 (December 10).
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...eview&id=24642

Also, Amazing Spider-man #10, where Silk shares her... impressions of Kaine. It is listed as #9, but that is an error.
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...eview&id=24609


New Warriors #12, the final issue, should be coming next week, on November 26.

[Pav]

I am so sad that Kaine won't be appearing regularly in a book. Yost totally turned a 90's style-over-substance character into a well-defined, multidimensional, interesting personality. Hope he gets another chance to finish those plotlines started in the Scarlet Spider book, still.

There should be a team book with all the spider characters of Earth 616 who can't sustain solos.

Disagree with your assessment of Kaine's character back in the '90s. Didn't you read "The Lost Years"? In fact, Kaine's pain and what it led him to do / who to be during the Clone Saga was, in my mind, one of the storyline's greatest strengths.

Agree that Marvel should put out a Spider-Team book. It seems so obvious; I'm sure it's only a matter of time.

-Pav, who can't believe John Byrne's Spider-Woman series is the closest we've had to such a thing so far...