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  1. #61
    Junior Member Bosch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    The bad guy was also non-African, though, so there is kind of a symmetry to it. But I see where you are going here.
    Huh? Cadulo's an African warlord, and Urzkartaga's an African plant god. Are you referring to Cheetah?
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  2. #62
    Relic Seeker Pinsir's Avatar
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    For those interested, it was primarily this scene that 'triggered' my reaction;



    A few months ago I finished reading all of WW's Golden Age stories and the issue of race comes up frequently. Whenever Wonder Woman visited some non-white group they would normally refer to her as a 'white goddess.' Not to mention blacks in those Golden age stories were always depicted poorly, either as minstrel characters or as well...like this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    The bad guy was also non-African, though, so there is kind of a symmetry to it. But I see where you are going here.
    He isn't Sub-Saharan, but he could still be an African. If I am right as to the ethnicity of the captured women (Himba) a large portion of them reside in Angola, a former Portuguese colony.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bosch View Post
    Not that it makes up for the African characters' lack of agency, but the B-plot with Etta has yet to be resolved. I'm sure our mastermind will inevitably be a Westerner profiteering in foreign affairs.

    But generally speaking, Diana as white messiah is a problem DC's invited on themselves by pegging her as an "international" hero. I think they might be able to skirt the issue by disentangling her mythos from the US government some and making her a more equal opportunity interventionist, but that doesn't seem likely to happen.
    I think Superman has this issue too and of course there are Superman stories that argue for the opposite.

    Quote Originally Posted by Silvanus View Post
    I agree with just about all of this, though, to be honest, I think it's also clear that the attempt to give these women agency was about as minimal as it could possibly be without disappearing altogether. Delete that one panel of the women mutely holding the lasso, and that whole attempt goes away, right?
    When WW rescues the women she does praise their courage (as seen in the above image), but it isn't until that final scene that they have a clear demonstration of their own 'power.' A group of them are shown being lead to safety by a group of primarily African-American soldiers, but they themselves don't help fight off the hyena monsters.
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  3. #63
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    Wow.....we're really having this convo

  4. #64
    Mighty Member RealWonderman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bosch View Post
    But generally speaking, Diana as white messiah is a problem DC's invited on themselves by pegging her as an "international" hero. I think they might be able to skirt the issue by disentangling her mythos from the US government some and making her a more equal opportunity interventionist, but that doesn't seem likely to happen.
    How can Wonder Woman be a "white" savior when she's Mediterranean?

    Also, I think this whole line of conversation is a reach. I'm as sensitive and sympathetic as anyone, but come on. This is a Wonder Woman story and, though over the last few years, we've gotten use to Wonder Woman NOT being the hero of her stories, this is what we should expect. Whether she's in Africa, Asia, the US, Austria, or Space, she'll hopefully be be the savior in every story.
    Last edited by RealWonderman; 10-06-2016 at 06:13 AM.
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  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealWonderman View Post
    How can Wonder Woman be a "white" savior when she's Mediterranean?

    Also, I think this whole line of conversation is a reach. I'm as sensitive and sympathetic as anyone, but come on. This is a Wonder Woman story and, though over the last few years, we've gotten use to Wonder Woman NOT being the hero of her stories, this is what we should expect. Whether she's in Africa, Asia, the US, Austria, or Space, she'll hopefully be be the savior in every story.
    True that.

    This is just political correctness going overboard. Cheetah and the Plant God both have long standing links to Africa. The only logical extension of this argument that I can see is that Wonder Woman should be purple, because then she cannot be associated with any racial stereotypes that might be triggered by a story she is in.
    If ten years of recording The Young and the Restless for my mother have taught me anything, it's that characters in serial dramas are always happily in love...until they're not

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  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealWonderman View Post
    How can Wonder Woman be a "white" savior when she's Mediterranean?
    She's be considered white by, for example, the U.S. Census Bureau definition, which includes, among others, people from all around the Mediterranean:

    "White. A person having origins in any of the original peoples of Europe, the Middle East, or North Africa. It includes people who indicate their race as "White" or report entries such as Irish, German, Italian, Lebanese, Arab, Moroccan, or Caucasian." https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/me..._RHI205210.htm

  7. #67
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    I can see where the white savior interpretation is coming from, but it is also unavoidable when we're paying for a book that features a white woman as the lead and hero, especially in a story involving mythological elements in Africa. Doesn't seem like a huge deal compared to other examples

  8. #68
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    In general, in superhero comics, the people the superheroes save have little agency. In this case, the people being saved happened to be Africans. Whatever.

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