The Flash #7 Discussion

[J. D. Guy]

Since no one made a thread, I guess I will. Spoiling this, just to be on the safe side.

spoilers:

It picks up where #6 left off, with August revealing his true golden colors, complete with August doing some of the narrating. August explains himself, including how he instinctual knew that gaining more of the Speed Force power would make him strong enough to accomplish his ideals after his first taste of absorbing someone else's Speed Force, how he's totally doing this for "Barry's own good", and how he never actually meant to kill those Speed Force users when taking their Speed Force, but couldn't take it by himself without doing so. Lastly, we learn that August's ability to be in two places at once isn't as consequence free as some might have assumed, as it casts an enormous and painful strain on him when he does so for too long. Barry takes advantage of that distraction, sucker punches him, and than leaves to regroup himself, though in the end, he slumps down over in despair at the current events. For his part, August as Godspeed (narrating once more) "saves" a group of hostages from some Black Hole goons, doing so in a few of the most immoral and gruesome ways possible, before disturbingly and nonchalantly telling the officers outside that there won't be any need for any arrests (the hostages are safe, but likely more traumatized than they already were). He later then interrogates another Black Hole goon, fails to get anything out of him, before seemingly vibrating him out of existence... Wally finds Barry as Flash slumped over and moping, and brings him out of his funk in a sincerely inspirational manner. He tells Flash that he wants to help him take down Godspeed, citing that when he first got his powers from the residue of his alternate future self, he wasn't quite sure he was ready to do something, as he had grown to admire Flash by this point but wasn't quite willing to be like him. However, after the lightning storm and thanks to Meena, Wally came to a decision, which was further jump-started by Meena's apparent and untimely demise. Barry, in the throes of despair, says he has to do it alone, but Wally reminds him otherwise. This re-enlightenment gives Barry an idea. Though he makes Wally promise not to take on Godspeed, alone or with Barry and in exchange for not telling his Aunt Iris, he asks him for his help with evening the power field. After gathering what seems to be the remaining Speedsters, he asks them for their help by willingly giving up their powers (that solicit summary was purposefully or ignorantly misleading...). He reasons that when Godspeed stole most of his Speed, it was from largely unwilling victims, which is what caused their deaths, having had their Speed Force violently snatched from them. To this end, he deduces that if the rest of the Speedster willingly relinquished their powers to him, the transfer would be safe. He also notes that he needs a second Speedster there, too, to ask as a balancing weight, which is a role that he gives to Wally. It wasn't hard to convince everyone, and Barry and Wally successfully extracted their Speed Force powers (and thus clearing up most of the "toys" from the "floor"). All sans Avery, who really didn't want to lose her powers. Though, she quickly talks herself into doing the heroic thing (unlike August, who rationalizes being selfish as doing the heroic thing), and willingly gives her power to Flash (who himself sates that he would never take her powers against her will, unlike the solicit's implications). Speaking of August, he jealously snatches Avery's powers mid-transfer, with the claim that she doesn't deserve them since she's willing to give them up. And though Avery is safe, he leads Flash out towards the sea and Iron Heights Island. He intends to "bless" Flash once more by killing the inmates of that prison, including one Eobard Thawne...

end of spoilers

Welp, hope I did okay. Feel free to discuss away!

[SkyMason21]

I don't see redemption for Godspeed. He's way to kill happy (and way too pro-torture) for that to happen.

Liked how cleanly we got out of the dozens of speedsters issue. Coming out of this arc with Barry, Wally, Wally, Meena and Godspeed as the only ones left is fine with me. I would have liked Avery to keep her powers since she seemed like a fun sidekick but maybe Williamson will find a way to keep her around regardless.

Di Giandomenico did a great job again, glad to see he'll get a good amount of time off after #8 and hopefully he'll be back for the next big arc.

[J. D. Guy]

I don't see redemption for Godspeed. He's way to kill happy (and way too pro-torture) for that to happen.

Liked how cleanly we got out of the dozens of speedsters issue. Coming out of this arc with Barry, Wally, Wally, Meena and Godspeed as the only ones left is fine with me. I would have liked Avery to keep her powers since she seemed like a fun sidekick but maybe Williamson will find a way to keep her around regardless.

Di Giandomenico did a great job again, glad to see he'll get a good amount of time off after #8 and hopefully he'll be back for the next big arc.

I would have liked some form of redemption in Godspeed, but this issue kinda threw what little theoretical chances there were straight off a skyscraper's roof.

Keeping Avery/w Powers would have been nice, but I do also wish they could have made the Speed Academy thing a wee bit more of a permanent fixture, even if the chances of that being the case were slim from the start.

[JJ!]

I like the dynamic between Godspeed and the Flash. I think it's interesting that Godspeed still wants to be Barry's friend and "help" him. I'm curious to see if Barry can stop GS next issue or if he fails and some of the Rogues Gallery "die."

[Frontier]

Well, I guess now people won't have to worry about the mass-amount of Speedsters now .

Which will also probably draw The Rogues back, once they find out .

Godspeed feels a lot like Zolomon in that he still believes he's a good person, a hero, despite the terrible things he's done and that he ultimately has Barry's best interests at heart (heh). Obviously he also serves as a dark reflection of Barry because he's what Barry could've been if he didn't have his morals or belief in the law.

It's nice seeing Barry and Wally finally coming together as partners, now all that's left is Wally getting his costume, the two taking on Godspeed, and Wally learning Barry's identity .

Anyone else think Thawne might have some knowledge of Manhattan and the changes made to the DCU, given his killing Nora was one of the bigger, darker, changes to The Flash's history and set the stage for Flashpoint and the New 52?

[K. Jones]

I like that the speed-storm ends up being Godspeed's origin, and that it's a story that serves both an interesting hook for Barry as well as a hook for the origin, as well as a hook to bring Wally and Barry together. I noticed the resolution there as well. Feels very Flashy, too.

[SkyMason21]

I would have liked some form of redemption in Godspeed, but this issue kinda threw what little theoretical chances there were straight off a skyscraper's roof.

Keeping Avery/w Powers would have been nice, but I do also wish they could have made the Speed Academy thing a wee bit more of a permanent fixture, even if the chances of that being the case were slim from the start.

I agree, the Speed Academy and really Godspeed's identity could have lasted longer. I really wish Williamson had at least tried to throw everyone off by having Barry and August fight Godspeed together.

[scribbleMind]

One has to compare him to The Punisher, and imo, he's worse. The Punisher doesn't disregard the need for evidence. It's the Punishment part he doesn't agree with, so in that regard Punisher is morally superior. The Punisher usually only breaks into prisons to kill people when it's personal. I don't believe he would walk into a prison and kill everyone even if he could. For the most part, he'd rather take out what's out there in the streets. I think this makes the Punisher morally superior to Godspeed. Punisher does not try to justify any mistakes he's made. If he accidentally kills someone he carries that weight on his shoulders. He doesn't try to deflect it by saying, "Not my fault, they were in a War Zone." The Punisher would often give goons the opportunity to live. As many people as he kills, there is a number of times he lets go either by giving them the option to leave before things get messy, or by just choosing not to hunt them down should they escape through his fingers. Thus far, Godspeed has not done such a thing, and since he is unlikely to do the research like the Punisher, he would never stop and think, "This guy's record was clean before this, he just screwed up, probably needed the money. Let him go." the way Punisher sometimes does.

So, while Godspeed is clearly the Punisher to Barry's Daredevil, I really think he is far less redeemable as an individual.

[J. D. Guy]

I like the dynamic between Godspeed and the Flash. I think it's interesting that Godspeed still wants to be Barry's friend and "help" him.

August is on a power high right now, but he and Barry were indeed close friends, so he still considers themselves friends, and he see himself doling out a twisted form of "tough love" on Barry.

I agree, the Speed Academy and really Godspeed's identity could have lasted longer. I really wish Williamson had at least tried to throw everyone off by having Barry and August fight Godspeed together.

I definitely would have liked the Academy part to have stuck around longer.

Still, not too sure on how they could have spread out Godspeed any longer than this. This feels pretty organic as is, and them stretching it out further may have made it look kinda hard to believe that Barry could be fooled by someone that close to him for such an extended period.

I suppose they could have shortened August's transition into Godspeed, but the speed of it happening lends a great deal to August's character. He picks up these powers as he does, with only the basic ropes taught to him by Barry, because he is a very instinctual person. One thing this story seems to show is that the power of the Speed Force is very much instinctual in nature, so someone like August who relies on their instincts, while also not being shy about exploring the depths of their abilities, would be able to pick up what he did as natural and with a such clip pace as August did, and that's taking into account that August's instincts aren't always the best or right way to go about something.

The other thing is that I wonder how he would have pulled off being in the same room with Godspeed without the two giving each other away? Let alone trade blows to the point of looking legit.

One has to compare him to The Punisher, and imo, he's worse. The Punisher doesn't disregard the need for evidence. It's the Punishment part he doesn't agree with, so in that regard Punisher is morally superior. The Punisher usually only breaks into prisons to kill people when it's personal. I don't believe he would walk into a prison and kill everyone even if he could. For the most part, he'd rather take out what's out there in the streets. I think this makes the Punisher morally superior to Godspeed. Punisher does not try to justify any mistakes he's made. If he accidentally kills someone he carries that weight on his shoulders. He doesn't try to deflect it by saying, "Not my fault, they were in a War Zone." The Punisher would often give goons the opportunity to live. As many people as he kills, there is a number of times he lets go either by giving them the option to leave before things get messy, or by just choosing not to hunt them down should they escape through his fingers. Thus far, Godspeed has not done such a thing, and since he is unlikely to do the research like the Punisher, he would never stop and think, "This guy's record was clean before this, he just screwed up, probably needed the money. Let him go." the way Punisher sometimes does.

So, while Godspeed is clearly the Punisher to Barry's Daredevil, I really think he is far less redeemable as an individual.

Interesting perspective here.

I admit that I didn't quite mean to turn this into a "popularity comparison". That, and I don't see Flash as similar to Daredevil as Godspeed could be seen to Punisher.

But yes, August has a lot of pent up frustrations and grievances with the police and law system that's been stewing since he lost his brother. That's why he goes by his own colored perspective when he's doing "Judging" and "Jurying". That darkness had been festering within him for years, and now that he has powers, it's pretty much guiding his every action.

At the end of the day, though, I'm not sure if I could say that one was more "morally superior" than the other, at least not without feeling some awkwardness of condoning a murderer, even if just a little.

[Waterfall]

yaaay barry finally has his own hunter zolomon now!....i would be impressed if i wasn't busy yawning at this mediocre book.

[Lightning Rider]

Yeah, it feels very Zolomon-esque. But less compelling.