Superman issue #8 discussion: DINOSAUR PUNCHING!!! (spoilers)

[My Two Cents]

Pander me D C
PANDER ME

[beetee]

I held back cos there seemed to be a bit of aggravation flying about and I didn't want to be seen as 'That Guy'....

BUT.......!

Really didn't like it.

It was boring and nothing happened.

Sure, the Losers stuff was nice, but the story didn't move an inch forward from landing on Dinosaur Island and what action did happen (giant fish monster, Krypto gets eaten) had happened only a few issues previously.

It's nice that Fans are enjoying it. But if DC keeps pandering to a specific audience (just my opinion) this stuff isn't going to last.

My most favorite bit was the Blink-And-You'll-Miss-It cameo from the Multiversal Box.

Otherwise, I thought this was a whole lot of nothing.

Please don't hurt me :P

Here's some fake glasses with a big nose and mustache..... No one will recognize you.....

[sandmountainslim]

DC must have been pandering directly to me because I LOVED this issue. Plenty of action for the money and the page count in my opinion.

[Sacred Knight]

I held back cos there seemed to be a bit of aggravation flying about and I didn't want to be seen as 'That Guy'....

BUT.......!

Really didn't like it.

It was boring and nothing happened.

Sure, the Losers stuff was nice, but the story didn't move an inch forward from landing on Dinosaur Island and what action did happen (giant fish monster, Krypto gets eaten) had happened only a few issues previously.

It's nice that Fans are enjoying it. But if DC keeps pandering to a specific audience (just my opinion) this stuff isn't going to last.

My most favorite bit was the Blink-And-You'll-Miss-It cameo from the Multiversal Box.

Otherwise, I thought this was a whole lot of nothing.

Please don't hurt me :P

I actually agree. I liked #7 waaay more. #7 is a great example of an issue where a whole lot of action doesn't have to take place for it to be a really fun read. This one though, I was kinda bored. Maybe its because I'm not getting all the New Frontier references (I know, I'm terrible, I've only seen the movie, which I hear and totally believe doesn't hold a candle to the series), but like I said, I was just kinda bored. We'll see where it goes though. I did like Superman, in a sense, putting the bodies he found to rest.

[Jadeb]

I wasn't entirely sold either, as I posted earlier in the thread. But, boy, I'm happy this book is in such a solid state that even the weak issues are still pretty good.

[Superlad93]

I wasn't entirely sold either, as I posted earlier in the thread. But, boy, I'm happy this book is in such a solid state that even the weak issues are still pretty good.

I remember you post from early in the thread. I totally respect your interpretation of book, and I know we'll all get something a little different out of a read, but I found it odd that you said this issue could've done without the callback to the New Frontier Losers. I mainly say this because if we hadn't had that callback then the book would've just been strictly dino punch (lord knows I would've been more than cool with that). And I think I remember you saying that didn't have as much meaning if you didn't read NF. I can see you points, but I feel like the book was handled in such a way where the NF callbacks acted as more of a mystery to be solved, and it added texture to the world beyond the dinos. I don't think one needs to have read NF to appreciate the mystery aspect. We're coming at this world from Superman and Superboy's point of view, and since they no nothing about NF yet are able to function in the story then so can we, I feel. I can say without hesitation that, as a reader, you don't need to have any information related to NF to enjoy this book for what it was. But I do think that, like any supplementary information, it can help you appreciate things from a new perspective (the Losers' as opposed to Superman and Superboy's). I'd also add that if you read/knew of Multiversity, you'd have an even greater appreciation for the situation (Jon's dream, the cube, and New Frontier being a world in the multiverse thus opening up the possibility of this being dimensional travel), but on it's own the story is easily appreciated as just a fun adventure in a strange land filled dinos and WWII remains.

I'm not "coming after you" or anything like that. You're enjoyment or lack of doesn't stop me from enjoying something (and honestly you didn't even dislike it), but I just wanted to give my two cents on the idea is. I've mainly heard this criticism of people who have read NF and assume there may be too many callbacks to it for new readers.

[Earth-2 Refugee]

I held back cos there seemed to be a bit of aggravation flying about and I didn't want to be seen as 'That Guy'....

BUT.......!

Really didn't like it.

It was boring and nothing happened.

Sure, the Losers stuff was nice, but the story didn't move an inch forward from landing on Dinosaur Island and what action did happen (giant fish monster, Krypto gets eaten) had happened only a few issues previously.

It's nice that Fans are enjoying it. But if DC keeps pandering to a specific audience (just my opinion) this stuff isn't going to last.

My most favorite bit was the Blink-And-You'll-Miss-It cameo from the Multiversal Box.

Otherwise, I thought this was a whole lot of nothing.

Please don't hurt me :P

I'll just say this issue did good at setting up while being entertaining to me. We get to see the relationship between Superman and Superboy, we get to see their reactions to the island, we see the mystery unfold as they find WWII tech on the island, we get Dinosaur fights, then we end with them finding the last stand of these troops. It felt like the perfect first act to a story to me. If you didn't like it, I hope you can find something you do like.

[Jadeb]

I remember you post from early in the thread. I totally respect your interpretation of book, and I know we'll all get something a little different out of a read, but I found it odd that you said this issue could've done without the callback to the New Frontier Losers. I mainly say this because if we hadn't had that callback then the book would've just been strictly dino punch (lord knows I would've been more than cool with that). And I think I remember you saying that didn't have as much meaning if you didn't read NF. I can see you points, but I feel like the book was handled in such a way where the NF callbacks acted as more of a mystery to be solved, and it added texture to the world beyond the dinos. I don't think one needs to have read NF to appreciate the mystery aspect. We're coming at this world from Superman and Superboy's point of view, and since they no nothing about NF yet are able to function in the story then so can we, I feel. I can say without hesitation that, as a reader, you don't need to have any information related to NF to enjoy this book for what it was. But I do think that, like any supplementary information, it can help you appreciate things from a new perspective (the Losers' as opposed to Superman and Superboy's). I'd also add that if you read/knew of Multiversity, you'd have an even greater appreciation for the situation (Jon's dream, the cube, and New Frontier being a world in the multiverse thus opening up the possibility of this being dimensional travel), but on it's own the story is easily appreciated as just a fun adventure in a strange land filled dinos and WWII remains.

I'm not "coming after you" or anything like that. You're enjoyment or lack of doesn't stop me from enjoying something (and honestly you didn't even dislike it), but I just wanted to give my two cents on the idea is. I've mainly heard this criticism of people who have read NF and assume there may be too many callbacks to it for new readers.

Really, I didn't mind the callback to NF; as a Cooke fan, I quite like the tribute to him. But there's just so much of it. As you mentioned, take out the NF references and there's not a whole lot else. The first time we got a reference, I thought it was a nice nod. But then it kept happening -- whole scenes built on a story from years and years ago. Then even the cliffhanger hung on it, and that struck me as odd. For people like me who've read NF, it's not much of a mystery (and not much of a cliffhanger). For those who haven't, I can't see it being that involving. The mystery isn't even established as a mystery -- there's nothing in the issue to indicate that these seemingly long-dead soldiers from WWII aren't actually long-dead soldiers from WWII. They're just there, which is kinda creepy, I guess, but not much else. They could have established that with much less page space, and they would have served the story better with a stronger cliffhanger.

My overall assessment of the story will really depend on how well all this comes together. To me, this issue felt disconnected, more tribute than story, but maybe the next one will bring everything together in a big, satisfying way.

[Superlad93]

The first time we got a reference, I thought it was a nice nod.

But you were working off an assumption based off having already read the book. What you're describing is in direct opposition to just reading the story in front of you for what it is.

whole scenes built on a story from years and years ago.

This is true, but it being an old story only matters if you look at it from the Losers' perspective, but that's not the perspective we're coming to this island with. We're learning and understanding as Superman and Superboy. These two weren't there for NF, and they don't know the events that went down. It would be another thing if Clark somehow knew the events and was on a mission to save anyone still alive on the island. But that's not the deal here. Clark and Jon are investigating this island same as us.

For those who haven't, I can't see it being that involving. The mystery isn't even established as a mystery -- there's nothing in the issue to indicate that these seemingly long-dead soldiers from WWII aren't actually long-dead soldiers from WWII.

This seems to be what readers of NF assume that new readers feel, but you're still not divorcing completely you're knowledge of the NF from the situation. I don't understand how it's not a mystery. You a have WWII battle that went down on an island full of dino! Also this island seems to be able to screw with Superman's senses, and they were sent here back what they assumed was a school project. The last mystery is why these dinos are scared of that mountain. They'd just tried to eat Krypto and Jon, but now they're too spooked by their location to try again? That's pretty strange. Then we go up and find this sort of last stand fortress, and a final message. All of this screams "what's going on here" to me.

My overall assessment of the story will really depend on how well all this comes together. To me, this issue felt disconnected, more tribute than story, but maybe the next one will bring everything together in a big, satisfying way.

I respectfully disagree. I think it worked as both a tribute and a story set up. But I do agree that what comes next will be the real meat of the story.

[Jadeb]

This is true, but it being an old story only matters if you look at it from the Losers' perspective, but that's not the perspective we're coming to this island with. We're learning and understanding as Superman and Superboy. These two weren't there for NF, and they don't know the events that went down. It would be another thing if Clark somehow knew the events and was on a mission to save anyone still alive on the island. But that's not the deal here. Clark and Jon are investigating this island same as us.

But why are we supposed to care about characters we've never met? I've read New Frontier and still don't care. It has no real impact on the main storyline, which is why and how Superman and Jon got there and what's happening to them. At best, it's a little added color. But as a cliffhanger, it doesn't work for me at all. Would have been much more effective had there been something to tie it all together. Maybe next issue.

[Superlad93]

But why are we supposed to care about characters we've never met? I've read New Frontier and still don't care. It has no real impact on the main storyline, which is why and how Superman and Jon got there and what's happening to them. At best, it's a little added color. But as a cliffhanger, it doesn't work for me at all. Would have been much more effective had there been something to tie it all together. Maybe next issue.

You're not supposed to care about the Losers as characters in the same way you would Clark, Jon, Lois, or Kathy. This story never gives you characters other than Jon, Clark, and Krypto to care about. The Losers are an abstract, and to Clark's mind it may be a way off the island for him, his boy, and dog. For Clark, Jon, and Krypto, the WWII stuff and the Losers last will meas that other people have been on this island, so there's a way on and possibly off it. From Clark's POV these WWII people might be linked to the school project Jon made, because it brought them as outsiders there, and that's why he looks for the project in the cave. For all he knows a similar device may have brought these other humans here.

At best we're supposed to respect them as solders in roughly the same way Clark does with the dead tank men. But no, the comic never gives you characters aside from Clark, Jon, and Krypto to identify with and care for.

[Lightning Rider]

I enjoyed the issue as Superman continues to be a perfectly natural father figure. Dinosaur Island and the WW2 relics were a cool setting for an adventure, and I liked the Losers tribute at the end. My one critique is that the story never seemed to progress anywhere or set up an intriguing mystery beyond "we're suddenly in this new place" but that didn't stop me from enjoying it.