Death of X #4 spoilery spoiler thread - IDEAS NEVER DIE

[Arthas]

Also I would've ended that book one panel early. Calculating Emma laying out a plan to honor the man she loved by making him die a hero is much better than Emma snaps. I like to think that Emma and Scott balance each other out, but I don't like the idea that without him she falls apart. Goes back to a more morally ambiguous character sure (she always was that), but I didn't like how that last panel has her looking like she's being set up to go completely over the deep end.

I don't know. Perfect characters in any form can become boring. While I like characters who can take emotional setbacks (to put it very lightly) without despairing, if they do that 100% percent of the time they become boring. It's the same with a person who 100% never misses a shot or one who 100% always misses a shot.

In Emma's case she remained calculating enough to pull the wool over the whole worlds eyes literally. The strain of having to do so for weeks or days all by herself while mourning over Scott's loss?

I can accept her 'snap' here.

Now if Marvel made that 'snap' permanent then I would have complaints.

[CyclopsWasRight2]

I really wanted to like this mini series and I was very hyped about it. I enjoyed issue 1 and issue 2. But now after issue 4 I’m simply disgusted and utterly shocked. This was extremely bad comic book writing overall. None of it makes any sense. No character interaction makes any sense. I haven’t seen the X-Men boards online so united in ‘our’ opinion since Remender’s glory ‘hobo piss’ moment that revealed the sad reality of male, white, straight privilege of an ‘supposedly’ liberal comicbook writer who knows NOTHING about ‘identity politics’ and how to speak about minority issues. Same happened in my eyes in the last months with the X-books. I sometimes wonder if the authors actually responded to this former online outcry angrily with the new direction they gave to the X-books: “You want to see mutants as a metaphor for discrimination and marginality, we will give you eternal discrimination!” They gave us genocide after genocide after genocide after genocide without any 'mutant empowerment' left. At this point a mutant revolution is the only thing that makes sense! I still cannot believe Kieron Gillen's AMAZING Cyclops set up of AVX: Consequences was sabotaged by Bendis' bad writing. These authors basically tell minorities through the x-books to better stay down and remain obedient even in a state of horrible discrimination and marginality.

about Death of X issue 4:

These Inhuman people downrightly assassinated Scott Summers in front of everybody and the X-Men stand there and do NOTHING? WHY? WHAT THE HELL? What has Scott Summers done that explains why everybody hated him after this series? He destroyed a poisonous cloud and this is why he deserved to be assassinated (!) by the royal king and queen? Medusa and Black Bolt are truly inhumane monsters in this book: 'Genetic' supremacists assassinated a mutant rights activist for defending his people?!?!?! AM I REALLY READING THIS?! Marvel, you are disgusting and as much as I love the X-Men. I have to find a way to stop reading them because they really make me sad.

We knew that Emma Frost was behind all of it since issue 1. And this was the big reveal for this entire mini series? What about trying to be less up our noses about it? There is NO reason why the other X-Men and Inhumans do not try to stop the terrigen cloud from POISIONING AND KILLING MUTANTS. NONE! It kills mutants for crying out loud. Why are the mutants not starting a riot right away? Why did Magneto or Storm doing nothing in the last months? Why is Magik so angry with Sunfire that she tried to kill him in Extraordinary X-Men? Nothing is explained here.

Gosh, I was super hyped to read this series but this last issue was soooo offensive. This mini series was simply ridiculously bad and gave us NO new explanation whatsoever what happened in the last months. If I would start to interpret the political subtext of the X-Men comics in the last months/years in more detail, I honestly could cry. Because this is Trump’s America in comicbook form and the political subtext of the X-Men books just died.

The author of this comicbook should be ashamed!

In brief, WTF! #CyclopsWasRight #MagnetoWasRight #EmmaWasRight

p.s. I do not regret the hyperbole in my post.

[somacula]

I really wanted to like this mini series and I was very hyped about it. I enjoyed issue 1 and issue 2. But now after issue 4 I’m simply disgusted and utterly shocked. This was extremely bad comic book writing overall. None of it makes any sense. No character interaction makes any sense. I haven’t seen the X-Men boards online so united in ‘our’ opinion since Remender’s glory ‘hobo piss’ moment that revealed the sad reality of male, white, straight privilege of an ‘supposedly’ liberal comicbook writer who knows NOTHING about ‘identity politics’ and how to speak about minority issues. Same happened in my eyes in the last months with the X-books. I sometimes wonder if the authors actually responded to this former online outcry angrily with the new direction they gave to the X-books: “You want to see mutants as a metaphor for discrimination and marginality, we will give you eternal discrimination!” They gave us genocide after genocide after genocide after genocide without any 'mutant empowerment' left. At this point a mutant revolution is the only thing that makes sense! I still cannot believe Kieron Gillen's AMAZING Cyclops set up of AVX: Consequences was sabotaged by Bendis' bad writing. These authors basically tell minorities through the x-books to better stay down and remain obedient even in a state of horrible discrimination and marginality.

about Death of X issue 4:

These Inhuman people downrightly assassinated Scott Summers in front of everybody and the X-Men stand there and do NOTHING? WHY? WHAT THE HELL? What has Scott Summers done that explains why everybody hated him after this series? He destroyed a poisonous cloud and this is why he deserved to be assassinated (!) by the royal king and queen? Medusa and Black Bolt are truly inhumane monsters in this book: 'Genetic' supremacists assassinated a mutant rights activist for defending his people?!?!?! AM I REALLY READING THIS?! Marvel, you are disgusting and as much as I love the X-Men. I have to find a way to stop reading them because they really make me sad.

We knew that Emma Frost was behind all of it since issue 1. And this was the big reveal for this entire mini series? What about trying to be less up our noses about it? There is NO reason why the other X-Men and Inhumans do not try to stop the terrigen cloud from POISIONING AND KILLING MUTANTS. NONE! It kills mutants for crying out loud. Why are the mutants not starting a riot right away? Why did Magneto or Storm doing nothing in the last months? Why is Magik so angry with Sunfire that she tried to kill him in Extraordinary X-Men? Nothing is explained here.

Gosh, I was super hyped to read this series but this last issue was soooo offensive. This mini series was simply ridiculously bad and gave us NO new explanation whatsoever what happened in the last months. If I would start to interpret the political subtext of the X-Men comics in the last months/years in more detail, I honestly could cry. Because this is Trump’s America in comicbook form and the political subtext of the X-Men books just died.

The author of this comicbook should be ashamed!

In brief, WTF! #CyclopsWasRight #MagnetoWasRight #EmmaWasRight

p.s. I do not regret the hyperbole in my post.

Welcome to the forums, I'm sorry you had to register at such sad times for the franchise... I know the story doesn't make any sense even tough is written by the same guy that writes extraordinary... The problem is editorial that enforced this plot line and Lemire that couldn't care less about X men as long as he can write OML or Thanos. But fear not, hopefully this will all be over soon and resurrXion will bring a writer that either knows what he is doing, loves the X men and hopefully both :l

And regarding marvel overall, I think it's been infiltrated by Nazis, I mean, hydra cap, gestapo Carol, auschwitz inhumans and somehow the only guy fighting that is considered Hitler

[CyclopsWasRight2]

thank you! I doubt that we will get a political shift but let's stay optimistic for another 10 years or so...

well, Captain America as a Nazi actually makes a lot of sense to...lol whoever remain dressing in the America flag after everything the United States has done as a colonial/neo-colonial power globally and locally...?! There is really no need for any patriotism in 'Western' societies at all...

[somacula]

thank you! I doubt that we will get a political shift but let's stay optimistic for another 10 years or so...

well, Captain America as a Nazi actually makes a lot of sense to...lol whoever remain dressing in the America flag after everything the United States has done as a colonial/neo-colonial power globally and locally...?! There is really no need for any patriotism in 'Western' societies at all...

Actually invading Utopia with unreliable information to take a citizen and provoke an stupid war is very very American... So it's fitting for captain American and and capitalist (Tony Stark may he rest in peace) to do it

[raidensix]

You know, as an event on its own without the month's of "OMG memba what Scott did?!" this would've really been something special. I loved this issue, I felt Emma's plan was brilliant. It was clear something was going on but even knowing that didn't lessen the impact this issue had. I'm not even bothered by Black Bolt killing Cyclops. The Inhumans aren't the X-Men in that they're not just super-powered people. They are their own masters, ones who have repeatedly shown that they're not to be messed with. Remember these are the same people who decided to overthrow the Kree Empire and make themselves its rulers. There have to be consequences to crossing them, or else why fear them? They've been done a disservice though in this event because while I understand that terrigen is sacred, they did release it onto a world with no consequences and don't really seem to care all that much that its wiping out an entire subset of people. "Your gas is killing and sterilizing us" should warrant more action than a shoulder shrug and offering to stick a mad scientist onto the problem.

Its a huge problem. Marvel went out their way to repeatedly hammer home that Scott Summers was a villain but this mini showed none of that. If anything the Inhumans come across as uncaring to the concerns of non-Inhumans. I don't get why Young Cyclops is so worried about turning into his older self, I don't get Magik's anger at Sunfire. None of the many issues that led to this point make any sense now that the story has been told. The initial plan had to have changed at some point, cause what we ended up with here doesn't jive with what was set up and this story suffers greatly as a result of it.

Also I would've ended that book one panel early. Calculating Emma laying out a plan to honor the man she loved by making him die a hero is much better than Emma snaps. I like to think that Emma and Scott balance each other out, but I don't like the idea that without him she falls apart. Goes back to a more morally ambiguous character sure (she always was that), but I didn't like how that last panel has her looking like she's being set up to go completely over the deep end.

This! Prior to DoX the other books were describing Cyclops as a madman who attacked the Inhumans and got what he deserved.
One thing about Emma's illusion though, how would it have worked on other telepaths or the Inhuman royals who supposedly had
psychic defenses. It shouldn't have worked on Magik either unless she was in on it.

[Triniking1234]

What I read: Death of X

What I expected: Casualties for both the X-Men and the Inhumans.

What I got: Two of the greatest X-Men getting killed off-field, an old character coming back to die a hero and character assassination.

[The tall man]

I never got that mutant metaphor stuff to begin with. Why use mutants as a metaphor for minorities when there is actual minorities in the MU. Five Lilly-white teenagers in the 60's is soppose to stand in for racial discrimination and prejudice, really? Is one to believe that there is no racism against blacks, antisemitism against jews, sexism against women, homophobia against gas or islamaphobia against Muslims in the Marvel universe. Is it only mutants that suffer those experiences? I think the rest of the MU gets thrown under the bus to highlight how awful the poor mutants gets treated as opposed to any other minority group. I would love to see Cyclops walk up to Blue Marvel or Luke Cage or Sam Wilson and tell them they don't know what's it like to experience racism, prejudice or discrimination because they are not mutants; yeah that would go over real good. This whole hated and feared angle of the xmen is getting real old, stale and boring. Hopefully resurrxion will be a fresh start for the franchise.

[cranger]

I never got that mutant metaphor stuff to begin with. Why use mutants as a metaphor for minorities when there is actual minorities in the MU. Five Lilly-white teenagers in the 60's is soppose to stand in for racial discrimination and prejudice, really? Is one to believe that there is no racism against blacks, antisemitism against jews, sexism against women, homophobia against gas or islamaphobia against Muslims in the Marvel universe. Is it only mutants that suffer those experiences? I think the rest of the MU gets thrown under the bus to highlight how awful the poor mutants gets treated as opposed to any other minority group. I would love to see Cyclops walk up to Blue Marvel or Luke Cage or Sam Wilson and tell them they don't know what's it like to experience racism, prejudice or discrimination because they are not mutants; yeah that would go over real good. This whole hated and feared angle of the xmen is getting real old, stale and boring. Hopefully resurrxion will be a fresh start for the franchise.

Most of this has nothing to do with the concept of the X-Men as it has been used to deal with stories of discrimination but everything to do with how out of touch current Marvel editorial is with how it was able to work as that for so long.

Most of your questions about the 'metaphor' are actually addressed in some very well told stories. I mean, if you started reading the X-Men in that last 5-10 years, I could see how it failed to come across, but wow-oh-wow don't toss out some of the best stories told in comics dealing with those very issues because of the current crop.

[somacula]

I never got that mutant metaphor stuff to begin with. Why use mutants as a metaphor for minorities when there is actual minorities in the MU. Five Lilly-white teenagers in the 60's is soppose to stand in for racial discrimination and prejudice, really? Is one to believe that there is no racism against blacks, antisemitism against jews, sexism against women, homophobia against gas or islamaphobia against Muslims in the Marvel universe. Is it only mutants that suffer those experiences? I think the rest of the MU gets thrown under the bus to highlight how awful the poor mutants gets treated as opposed to any other minority group. I would love to see Cyclops walk up to Blue Marvel or Luke Cage or Sam Wilson and tell them they don't know what's it like to experience racism, prejudice or discrimination because they are not mutants; yeah that would go over real good. This whole hated and feared angle of the xmen is getting real old, stale and boring. Hopefully resurrxion will be a fresh start for the franchise.

Dude, that's why it is a metaphor... It's supposed to not directly present the issue or present it in a way that readers can relate to it at many different levels... It works for minorities, for LGBT, for loners, for people that simply want a good story, etc...

And mutants also had it hard in the MU, they had been slaves in genosha, legacy virus, genocide in genosha, no more mutants, 52 states initiative that kicked em from America, invasion by the avengers when they were at the brink of extinction including guys like Luke cage or the Falcon with actual anti mutants weapons, and terrigen mists without any of those guys moving a finger to help mutants because they're probably to busy to help mutants that are dying... It's not a competition of who had it harder but a continuous fight to defend their respective people, each one does it at different levels, Falcon fights the police, cage tackles Street level crime and helps his community with Danny... Blue marvel well he protects the whole earth... As for the X men they protect themselves and the humans that hate them and fear them wether you like it or not

Your move

[Sardorim]

So, Rachel got screwed over in yet another event that system should have been a part of. Sigh.

[somacula]

So, Rachel got screwed over in yet another event that system should have been a part of. Sigh.

Rachel only problem is that writers forget she exists or find her to problematic to use... I'm sure if gillen or Bunn had written DoX Rachel would've been present at Cyclops funeral

[People Of The Earth]

Gist :
Even with what happened here there's no logical explanation for Cyclops being considered Hitler, the worst villain ever or the rest of the world and the X men hating him... There's no collateral damage or mass deaths... Nice job X editors

Also... Don't forget that IDEAS NEVER DIE

Faux-Scott said that he would see to it that both clouds would be neutered, to his followers and to the Inhumans royals.
Effectively causing the extinction of the Inhumans as a species down the line.
The logic of why would anyone knowing this would perceive him as a monster really fails you ? Really ? Think harder.

[CyclopsWasRight2]

Faux-Scott said that he would see to it that both clouds would be neutered, to his followers and to the Inhumans royals.
Effectively causing the extinction of the Inhumans as a species down the line.
The logic of why would anyone knowing this would perceive him as a monster really fails you ? Really ? Think harder.

the Inhumans will be fine, don't worry. The only thing they cannot do anymore is producing new slaves to serve the royal family...

[CyclopsWasRight2]

...but I guess poor queen Medusa cannot be expected to comb all her hair on her own.