Shuri Appreciation: Princess of Wakanda (2018)

[XPac]

So... you try to sell a book targeted to non-comic book readers by marketing to comic book readers? And then cancel the book before the non-comicbook readers can buy it?

(I may be wrong, but has anyone actually seen an ad outside the comics press for some of her comics? Whether it mentions "by the best-selling author of BINTI?" or not?)

Normally you don't bother marketing to non comic book readers. But in specific instances where you have creative teams who have fan bases outside comic readers, then it becomes a possibiity. ie if a person who doesn't read comics likes Coates work, you market to them in hopes they will read a comic Coates as written. That's the upside of occasionally getting a writer outside comics to come in and do stuff. Because otherwise, marketing a comic book to a non comic reader probably won't be all that effective.

But yes... odds are good if a book is relying on non comic book readers to survive it won't survive. That said, if you see some degree of sucess in trades and such, it's possible that character can get a second win. This system won't necessarily save a book the first time around (though it has happened if a book manages to at least survive long enough), but it can potentially give a book a second shot.

[Daniel22]

So maybe using art is bad is the wrong words. I understand that art subjective and I am normally try not be super critical of artist especially when their style is necessary going for realism.

So I will try to rephrase my point DC and Marvel have "house style" and most books artist tend to be in this house style. Lashley is with in the norms for Marvel comics and the artist style is comparable to some of better sellers in genre. Romero is different style which is sometimes good and it makes book stand out from the standard. It works best(imo) in off beat or non standard stories stuff that is darker or more comedic work great with more abstract styles. So I was wrong for saying the style is out right bad that is not my intent . The bigger point is sales and appeal to masses I think it is fair to say that Romero style doesn't appeal to masses but more of a niche. If you are doing a new property trying for mass appeal should be the goal unless you are target a specific niche. What appears to be happening and this just my opinion that Marvel just threw out Shuri book as test Best case MCU fanboy and hardcore comics eat up and with worse case scenario that they have trade to push when movies come out and market along with character. Also they get do a little backdoor Shuri RnD for a possible spin off movie or cartoon.

This Shuri book doesn't have long term appeal in the comic market namely because of the style of art and the writer being unknown to most comic fans. I am hardcore comic fan I will pick up anything by anyone with many different styles .I don't think most fans fit my profile and I have been a fan genre long enough to recognize art that I think is not going to do good. To bring the point home have you seen artist like Romero or Aja or even Kris Anka on an event book? When Marvel or DC is trying to sell books you see the mostly the house style. And that is my point Shuri feels like an experiment,Shuri isn't going attract to comic book fans who just come for cool action art, Shuri isn't going to get fans coming for establish writer in the genre. For new character I don't get why they do this and it is little bit frustrating because after the newness wears off the book is behind. Shuri was set up for success better the first time establish writer in the genre who has built in fans, an artist who will attract a wide base of fans and she was The Black Panther.

The gripe is they seem content to just to use Shuri MCU popularity for a small burst success and not build her for a long term comic run. I wish the current team well I am not cheering for failure I hope to eat my words and next Shuri issue stabilize at high enough amount that keep using her in future. I would rather see a big name writer and big name artist for the first arc and the second arc of the book this team. I think a bigger name team would have given Shuri a bigger cushion starting at say 50,000 because the interest feels there for the character right now

I just want to say it's awesome that you listened to other viewpoints and truly considered them. It's not something you see often online. Usually people get even more entrenched in their corner and double down on their own viewpoint and just swing back harder. I wish more people would be willing to have a conversation as opposed to win an argument...Thank you for being willing to do the former.

I can see your point on house vs indie/niche style and their relative widespread appeal. Maybe their thinking was Shuri is hoping to attract people who don't regularly read comics, so having a more stylized art style is a better fit? In other words a non-traditional target readership might be more into a non-traditional art style? It's definitely more on the cartooney side than realistic, maybe their thinking was a lot of readers would be more familiar with and comfortable with a style that resembles cartoons and animated movies than comics? I don't know, I'm just trying to guess motives.

On the other side, if they had put Mark Waid and Deodato on the book, some people would have said they aren't trying because they just put long-standing, safe picks on the book and didn't push the envelope or take risks. "More of the same" would have been a popular refrain, I think. Romero was a risk because as you pointed out he's not a classic styled comics artist. I'm almost always going to be in favor of the more outside the box picks, but I take your point on the benefits of going with an artist with widespread appeal. Okorafor as writer is a whole other topic with layers and layers and we could probably do another long thread just on their choosing her.

[butterflykyss]

Not a bad issue, kinda boring. Felt like an info dump issue without much info. Lol

I agree the issue itself wasnt bad but it was boring. but I'm going to support the title as long as it is in print.

[skyvolt2000]

So... you try to sell a book targeted to non-comic book readers by marketing to comic book readers? And then cancel the book before the non-comicbook readers can buy it?

(I may be wrong, but has anyone actually seen an ad outside the comics press for some of her comics? Whether it mentions "by the best-selling author of BINTI?" or not?)

I went to Google & Bing and found-

http://www.kansan.com/arts_and_cultu...3eb43119c.html

Okorafor, a Nigerian-American science fiction author, is best known for her “Akata Witch” novel series, which is about an albino Nigerian-American girl with magical powers. Okorafor has also written issues for Marvel’s “Black Panther” comic books

http://www.dailycal.org/2018/10/23/s...black-panther/

Ultimately, the breezy feel of “Shuri” belies its relative significance for Marvel. The series comes off the heels of the cancellation of two “Black Panther” spinoffs — Roxane Gay’s “Black Panther: World of Wakanda” and Coates’ “Black Panther and the Crew.” The cancellations are a symptom of the highly speculative nature of comic sales and of course, some readers’ resistance to diverse storytelling. To make matters worse, Marvel has often struggled to integrate the popularity of its films into its comic book continuity, resulting in a string of massively unpopular reboots and ill-conceived storylines.

https://dailynorthwestern.com/2018/0...ss-club-event/

https://thegrapevine.theroot.com/bla...s-n-1829836654

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articl...rword-for.html

Nigerian-American author Nnedi Okorafor was widely respected before she set foot within the comics realm, winning praise and awards for sci-fi and fantasy prose work including Binti, the Akata series and Who Fears Death, which is now in development for an HBO television series. She has won the World Fantasy Award, the Hugo Award and the Nebula Award, and is currently writing Shuri for Marvel Comics, starring Black Panther’s genius sister.

https://theglowup.theroot.com/she-go...cor-1829142519

That is, of course, unless your escort for the evening is none other than network darling and best-selling author George R.R. Martin, whose Game of Thrones once again nailed the Outstanding Drama Series award (its 47th Emmy) at this year’s ceremony—oh, and did we mention that Martin is executive producing your series, too?

This is exactly the dream writer Nnedi Okorafor was living on Monday night as she attended the Emmys alongside Martin, whom she says brought her with him for all of his red carpet interviews to promote the upcoming Who Fears Death, a post-apocalyptic coming-of-age story of a young North African woman, based on the Chibok, Nigeria schoolgirls who were kidnapped by terrorist group Boko Haram in 2014.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-44898404

US-based science fiction and fantasy writer Nnedi Okorafor is in high demand. She is the award-winning author of 12 books, the brains behind a forthcoming Black Panther spin-off series, and one of her stories is soon to be adapted for television by the creator of Game of Thrones.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/19/afric...uri/index.html

For the most part she is referenced for Black Panther or her deal with George Martin or her books.

However CNN & BBC have mentioned her doing Shuri. So 2 major media giants have promoted the book-I just don't know if there is any tv talk of the book.

[Realdealholy]

A weird issue. In addition to my criticism of the preview page:

-Shuri is def deaged. She’s practically a teenager here. Again, doesn’t make sense at all if one knows Shuri’s history in the comics. Def not Comics Shuri.

-Art is okay.

-No much happened. The plot barely moved.

On top of everything else, I’m clearly not the target audience for the book. At least I gave it a shot.

[skyvolt2000]

I just want to say it's awesome that you listened to other viewpoints and truly considered them. It's not something you see often online. Usually people get even more entrenched in their corner and double down on their own viewpoint and just swing back harder. I wish more people would be willing to have a conversation as opposed to win an argument...Thank you for being willing to do the former.

I can see your point on house vs indie/niche style and their relative widespread appeal. Maybe their thinking was Shuri is hoping to attract people who don't regularly read comics, so having a more stylized art style is a better fit? In other words a non-traditional target readership might be more into a non-traditional art style? It's definitely more on the cartooney side than realistic, maybe their thinking was a lot of readers would be more familiar with and comfortable with a style that resembles cartoons and animated movies than comics? I don't know, I'm just trying to guess motives.

On the other side, if they had put Mark Waid and Deodato on the book, some people would have said they aren't trying because they just put long-standing, safe picks on the book and didn't push the envelope or take risks. "More of the same" would have been a popular refrain, I think. Romero was a risk because as you pointed out he's not a classic styled comics artist. I'm almost always going to be in favor of the more outside the box picks, but I take your point on the benefits of going with an artist with widespread appeal. Okorafor as writer is a whole other topic with layers and layers and we could probably do another long thread just on their choosing her.

To me the art says a book that I will have no trouble finding the trade of be in stores or my school or the library. That is who they are aiming for.

If they had put Waid on the book-the line starts to the left behind you know who and others taking issues with a nonblack person writing a black woman. Abbott, Goldie Vance, Vixen, Riri Williams & Moon Girl chuckle in the background.

Waid does the book-you are appealing to comic book fans and not the rest of the planet who might not know who he is. I think more folks would know him from Archie since that failed reboot got attention. Although that might change since he is working with the guys from Black next Summer.

You could get away with Deodato. Was Khary Randolph or Ray Anthony Height that busy?

[butterflykyss]

A weird issue. In addition to my criticism of the preview page:

-Shuri is def deaged. She’s practically a teenager here. Again, doesn’t make sense at all if one knows Shuri’s history in the comics. Def not Comics Shuri.

-Art is okay.

-No much happened. The plot barely moved.

On top of everything else, I’m clearly not the target audience for the book. At least I gave it a shot.

i thought the issue was pretty slow myself but i did like her interactions with Ororo. Shuri does seem pretty "young" in her behavior like super silly. I didn't mind that but it's definitely different from how she was written in the past. I also like Goddess-Storm making an appearance. Hopefully the story picks up because if it doesn't i don't imagine this being a series much longer.

[DigiCom]

I went to Google & Bing and found-

http://www.kansan.com/arts_and_cultu...3eb43119c.html



http://www.dailycal.org/2018/10/23/s...black-panther/



https://dailynorthwestern.com/2018/0...ss-club-event/

https://thegrapevine.theroot.com/bla...s-n-1829836654

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articl...rword-for.html



https://theglowup.theroot.com/she-go...cor-1829142519



https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-44898404


https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/19/afric...uri/index.html

For the most part she is referenced for Black Panther or her deal with George Martin or her books.

However CNN & BBC have mentioned her doing Shuri. So 2 major media giants have promoted the book-I just don't know if there is any tv talk of the book.

Thank you. However, none of those are actually ADVERTISING her comics work, which is what I asked for. Instead, almost all of them mention the comics as an afterthought. Still, it's better than nothing.

[9th.]

Lol. Is that for from "Fences"?

Can't be, he's too young in the gif

[Killerbee911]

Shuri issue 2 -Quick Thoughts

- Solid issue not to great a lot of set up and exposition

- The art is still not my cup of tea but coloring fits the tone and create the vibe so it works

- This book is probably not aimed at me, As comic fans we have a little big of an ego about stuff like this when criticizing a book in looking at it now I am probably not the primary audience . I think I have seen it above mention but they are probably going after the same market as Ms Marvel and Moon Girl. I can't hate that is probably a smart strategy going after elementary students and teenage girls.

- Storm, Rocket Raccoon and Groot, Iron man I guess that is decent support, To make people who aren't the primary audience pick up the book

Elephant in the Room

A fairly consistent theme in the thread and something that doesn't get counter point enough "Is not my Shuri". To which my reply is oh well so what the MCU Shuri is better. Of course people will disagree with this I don't blame them for liking what they like but doom of dread of Shuri being more like the MCU Shuri is not something everyone shares. In terms of potential MCU Shuri is basically a female Spiderman now will she hit right beats to fulfill that potential ? I don't know that is still a hard road but the Black Panther movie create a character that has extremely high likability and it is worth the effort to try to capture that imo.

In a perfect world Marvel has a seperate movie comic line or does a better job of merge the two concepts and that leaves the older fans more happy but unapologetically it is amazingly easy to see for whoever was in charge to go let's put MCU Shuri in the comics. And yeah yeah movie goers don't run out and buy monthly comics BUT that doesn't mean movies don't have a positive effect. Marvel and DC have made the adjustment with the trades which do get boost when movie come out and the closer trade is to movie the better it sells. Something like GoG and someone can correct me if I am wrong but Guardian of Galaxy 1 and 2 tpb sold out on Amazon when the movie came out in 2014. Is that enough to justify a change I don't know the comic companies have metrics.

Anyways just want the counter of point out here that because it is like Movie Shuri I am picking up the book, Because it is a movie like Killmonger I am going to pick up that book. I see a little bit of echo chamber omg they make Shuri more like MCU this a bad thing I just want other point of view of I don't mind that MCU shuri is focal point. Also I think NNedi Okorafor kept enough of old Shuri around for another writer to come in and write her more like the old version if they wanted. Lastly in the current Black panther cartoon which was created independently of the movie the Shuri that they created land closer to movie version than comic one. Which supports idea the things being highlighted about Shuri is the right direction to go in,Yes younger,yes little more inexperienced,Yes She might be smarter than T'Challa,etc. I have seen Spiderman gazillion times bounced back to being more of teenager and taking away his feats and progression this type of thing isn't new and it isn't always bad.

[Realdealholy]

A fairly consistent theme in the thread and something that doesn't get counter point enough "Is not my Shuri". To which my reply is oh well so what the MCU Shuri is better. Of course people will disagree with this I don't blame them for liking what they like but doom of dread of Shuri being more like the MCU Shuri is not something everyone shares. In terms of potential MCU Shuri is basically a female Spiderman now will she hit right beats to fulfill that potential ? I don't know that is still a hard road but the Black Panther movie create a character that has extremely high likability and it is worth the effort to try to capture that imo.

In a perfect world Marvel has a seperate movie comic line or does a better job of merge the two concepts and that leaves the older fans more happy but unapologetically it is amazingly easy to see for whoever was in charge to go let's put MCU Shuri in the comics. And yeah yeah movie goers don't run out and buy monthly comics BUT that doesn't mean movies don't have a positive effect. Marvel and DC have made the adjustment with the trades which do get boost when movie come out and the closer trade is to movie the better it sells. Something like GoG and someone can correct me if I am wrong but Guardian of Galaxy 1 and 2 tpb sold out on Amazon when the movie came out in 2014. Is that enough to justify a change I don't know the comic companies have metrics.

Anyways just want the counter of point out here that because it is like Movie Shuri I am picking up the book, Because it is a movie like Killmonger I am going to pick up that book. I see a little bit of echo chamber omg they make Shuri more like MCU this a bad thing I just want other point of view of I don't mind that MCU shuri is focal point. Also I think NNedi Okorafor kept enough of old Shuri around for another writer to come in and write her more like the old version if they wanted. Lastly in the current Black panther cartoon which was created independently of the movie the Shuri that they created land closer to movie version than comic one. Which supports idea the things being highlighted about Shuri is the right direction to go in,Yes younger,yes little more inexperienced,Yes She might be smarter than T'Challa,etc. I have seen Spiderman gazillion times bounced back to being more of teenager and taking away his feats and progression this type of thing isn't new and it isn't always bad.

When people complain that its “not my Shuri”, they are essentially saying this isn’t the Shuri of the past 13 years (and as recently as 8 months ago). Those are 100% valid criticisms, especially when we were told that this Shuri book is in the Coates continuity. Adjustments via the MCU were expected but a continuation of the character via Comics continuity was also expected. This isn’t a reboot akin to Hudlin’s Black Panther run, which came two years after Priest’s run. The Coates run isn’t even over, it’s happening right now. From that perspective, it’s only natural that we will criticize the book from that angle. The current Shuri is a completely different person than who she was even 8 months ago, when we last saw her in Coates’ BP. How are we supposed to accept that she’s suddenly “younger” and “little more inexperienced” and has a major personality shift when she literally wasn’t that 8 months ago in the same continuity? And it’s done with little to no explanation? Are we supposed to ignore that and pretend the past 13 years didn’t happen?

Also, I can say with certainty that damn near all of us who have criticism of the book actually like MCU Shuri. Speaking for myself, I like her a lot and I think she has a lot of potential waiting to be fulfilled. However, Comics Shuri is a great character imho (tied for first place with T’Challa in my character rankings), and has lots of potential of her own to be fulfilled as well. Both versions are inspiring in their own right. Which why I was looking forward to a good blend of both.

Thus, there’s nothing wrong with liking MCU Shuri. We do as well. If you feel that this current comics version is better than the previous comics versions, that’s perfectly fine. Speaking for myself, I am not naive. I know why Marvel went the direction they did (you alluded to a lot of said reasons in your post). That said, there are better ways to blend Comics and MCU Shuri together than what we are getting in the book. The Panther’s Quest cartoon is doing a much better job of that at the moment. This current comics version, imho, tried to lean heavily towards the MCU version, but doesn’t even have the strengths of MCU Shuri, save the tech genius aspects. Add Shuri’s history being barely glossed over or outright ignored and we are were we are as far as criticism of the portrayal is concerned.

Gotta disagree on enough elements of Old Shuri being kept so that it could be brought back. This version is far too different imho. The only way Old Shuri comes back in some legit fashion is if the MCU uses elements of Old Shuri (could happen as MCU Shuri continues to age). After all, it appears that the comics is following the lead of the MCU as far as Shuri is concerned. Not the other way around.

[MindofShadow]

- This book is probably not aimed at me, As comic fans we have a little big of an ego about stuff like this when criticizing a book in looking at it now I am probably not the primary audience . I think I have seen it above mention but they are probably going after the same market as Ms Marvel and Moon Girl. I can't hate that is probably a smart strategy going after elementary students and teenage girls.

I don't really agree if that is their goal. It is stuck in this middle ground just like Shuri is stuck in this middle ground.

MG was straight fun. Totally aimed at the younger crowd. MM was fun and also dealt with teenage muslim issues. Both of these books also were really really stand alone. Both characters were new and fresh.

So far, Shuri book isn't really fun, it is way too wordy, it relies too much on current continuity and characters. It is also trapped between Shuri, which is muddling things in a book that is purely aimed at the "new" crowd that doesn't give a **** about griot stuff.

Elephant in the Room

A fairly consistent theme in the thread and something that doesn't get counter point enough "Is not my Shuri". To which my reply is oh well so what the MCU Shuri is better. Of course people will disagree with this I don't blame them for liking what they like but doom of dread of Shuri being more like the MCU Shuri is not something everyone shares. In terms of potential MCU Shuri is basically a female Spiderman now will she hit right beats to fulfill that potential ? I don't know that is still a hard road but the Black Panther movie create a character that has extremely high likability and it is worth the effort to try to capture that imo.

In a perfect world Marvel has a seperate movie comic line or does a better job of merge the two concepts and that leaves the older fans more happy but unapologetically it is amazingly easy to see for whoever was in charge to go let's put MCU Shuri in the comics. And yeah yeah movie goers don't run out and buy monthly comics BUT that doesn't mean movies don't have a positive effect. Marvel and DC have made the adjustment with the trades which do get boost when movie come out and the closer trade is to movie the better it sells. Something like GoG and someone can correct me if I am wrong but Guardian of Galaxy 1 and 2 tpb sold out on Amazon when the movie came out in 2014. Is that enough to justify a change I don't know the comic companies have metrics.

Anyways just want the counter of point out here that because it is like Movie Shuri I am picking up the book, Because it is a movie like Killmonger I am going to pick up that book. I see a little bit of echo chamber omg they make Shuri more like MCU this a bad thing I just want other point of view of I don't mind that MCU shuri is focal point. Also I think NNedi Okorafor kept enough of old Shuri around for another writer to come in and write her more like the old version if they wanted. Lastly in the current Black panther cartoon which was created independently of the movie the Shuri that they created land closer to movie version than comic one. Which supports idea the things being highlighted about Shuri is the right direction to go in,Yes younger,yes little more inexperienced,Yes She might be smarter than T'Challa,etc. I have seen Spiderman gazillion times bounced back to being more of teenager and taking away his feats and progression this type of thing isn't new and it isn't always bad.

IMO, like I stated before, if they wanted to do pure MCU shuri they should have just freaking done it as a prequel. Stop making new readers (who this is aimed at) know about current continuity in regards to BP, Mute Zones, Storm, Eden, Griot, ect. You are alienating both groups.

I understand wanting the new crowd but they should have thought more about the transition and smoothed it over.

I like MCU shuri. This version isn't her. She isn't fun loving techy sass teenager who is calm under stress. MCU shuri really needs someoen to bounce off of like she does in the movie to meet her full potential. this version has no one to bounce off of except for being bitched out by her mom or talking to muti? or crying to storm or someshit.

[Realdealholy]

IMO, like I stated before, if they wanted to do pure MCU shuri they should have just freaking done it as a prequel. Stop making new readers (who this is aimed at) know about current continuity in regards to BP, Mute Zones, Storm, Eden, Griot, ect. You are alienating both groups.

I understand wanting the new crowd but they should have thought more about the transition and smoothed it over.

I like MCU shuri. This version isn't her. She isn't fun loving techy sass teenager who is calm under stress. MCU shuri really needs someoen to bounce off of like she does in the movie to meet her full potential. this version has no one to bounce off of except for being bitched out by her mom or talking to muti? or crying to storm or someshit.

A prequel book would’ve been a win/win for all parties. It worked for Rise of the Black Panther. It would’ve worked for Shuri.

[MindofShadow]

A prequel book would’ve been a win/win for all parties. It worked for Rise of the Black Panther. It would’ve worked for Shuri.

Prequel announced as a mini ahead of time.

Worked perfectly for Rise. If it sells well for a mini, then you entertain a future Shuri series set in the present time.

I'll be curious how the Killmonger mini sells.

[XPac]

A prequel book would’ve been a win/win for all parties. It worked for Rise of the Black Panther. It would’ve worked for Shuri.

I think the point of it though was to make comic Shuri a bit more like the movie version (which for the record is something I don't agree with). If that's the case (and obviously I'm just speculating), then this probably needed to happen in a book taking place in the present. Yeah, you can easily say the comic Shuri in the past was a lot like the movie version (given how little we've seen of her that's very easy to do), but I think they wanted her more like the movie version going foreward as well.

Again, for the record I'm not a fan of movie synergy. I'm perfectly fine with comic Shuri, M'Baku, and Nakia the way they are, without having to transform into their movie counter parts. But we'll see. The bigger test is what Shuri will be like the next time we see her in the main book.