Should Marvel give us a plus size characters with an ongoing series?

[Grim Ghost]

I'd rather just see artists learn to draw regular people better as in everybody isn't a bodybuilder or a super model. It always annoys me when I see some regular supporting character drawn as being ripped as 80s Arnold.

[Tycon]

In what kind of world is Squirrel Girl "plus size". If that's the case then you guys have become WAY too normalized with over muscular archetypes like almost every Avenger.

[GrandEleven]

Ill get heat for this but: no.

For the same reason I don't feel the need to "include" more smokers. Your weight is completely under your own control and to allow yourself to go "plus size" comes with health risks ... why should I celebrate that? If it fits the character, fine. But as a some "inclusive movement"? Nope.

In what kind of world is Squirrel Girl "plus size".

The same world that has a CDC that identifies 2/3 of Americans overweight or obese. I'm not a fan of "redefining" obesity just because it's become common.

[Tiamatty]

Ill get heat for this but: no.

For the same reason I don't feel the need to "include" more smokers. Your weight is completely under your own control and to allow yourself to go "plus size" comes with health risks ... why should I celebrate that? If it fits the character, fine. But as a some "inclusive movement"? Nope.

Yyyyeeeeaaaahhhh . . . no. That's false. Obesity is complicated. It's not just a matter of "eat less and do some jumping jacks, fatty." A lot of people are fat because of glandular problems. Or a genetic factor that causes them to gain weight quickly. Or they work long hours for low pay, putting them in a situation where they can't afford healthy food, and don't have the time or energy to exercise regularly. Or there's other things going on that make it damned near impossible for them to not be fat.

On top of that, there's plenty of fat people whose weight doesn't really make them less healthy. It's possible to be fat and healthy.

[keeen]

Faith's hero name is Zephyr, the God of the West Wind. Also a reference to a flying blimp. Too on the nose for me.

Is it though? For some reason I thought the same thing but a simple google search shows absolutely no connection between the word zephyr and zeppelin. For me, I think it was that crappy Red Hot Chilli Peppers song that made me think they were the same thing.

[GrandEleven]

Yyyyeeeeaaaahhhh . . . no. That's false. Obesity is complicated. It's not just a matter of "eat less and do some jumping jacks, fatty." A lot of people are fat because of glandular problems. Or a genetic factor that causes them to gain weight quickly. Or they work long hours for low pay, putting them in a situation where they can't afford healthy food, and don't have the time or energy to exercise regularly. Or there's other things going on that make it damned near impossible for them to not be fat.

On top of that, there's plenty of fat people whose weight doesn't really make them less healthy. It's possible to be fat and healthy.

Yeaaaaahh no that's false. You are in control of your own weight, period. So yes it is "eat less and do more jumping jacks, fatty". As a father with 5 boys, I'm exposed constantly to these said "genetic problems" from other families spanning from elementary school to HS, yet in every case these obese kids are ... quite simply ... lazy. My 5 boys have been told very clearly that they HAVE to partake in an athletic team sport that has them active an hour a day minimum. 2 are on their way to scholarships, 2 will probably do no more than AYSO/rec ball because they just aren't gifted in that way. Last kid is a bit of a wildcard (he could be good but hasn't found a sport he loves and he may never). But all of them are active because I made it a point to teach them that physical health is important.

You can use all the tumblr science you want, but the bottom line is "plenty of people have x condition" is actually a very fringe case and 90+% of those people are just overweight. It's clearly identified as a behavioral problem by the CDC, so pretending you're some snowflake who can't lose weight and are still healthy is just you lying to yourself. You're not healthy. It is in your control. That's the bottom line. Willing to sacrifice that health for some other reason (whatever that may be)? That's completely your call, and I wont shame a overweight person for it. But it's still a choice, and not one we should be putting a spotlight on.

[Sutekh]

Yeaaaaahh no that's false. You are in control of your own weight, period. So yes it is "eat less and do more jumping jacks, fatty".

Some things are easier or harder for different people, based on all sorts of factors; genetic, economic, psychological, even what part of the country you live in.

I can do lots of stuff other people can't. I can read a 200 page novel in 2 hours, and retain the information for decades. I can do math in my head faster than my roommate (who is a literal genius and understands all sorts of stuff about computers and electronics that makes my eyes cross when he tries to explain it to me) can work it out on his calculator. But since I'm not a sociopath, and don't judge what other people can do based on my own personal anecdotal data, I don't say 'just read more, moron' to people who can't read as fast as I can. The world's more complicated than that. On topic, after being diagnosed with type 2 diabetes, I lost 70 lbs. in six months of starving myself (I started at 500 calories a day, I was too weak to walk up stairs, and had to sit down and do one step at a time on my butt). I'm *certainly* not going to judge anyone else for not being able to do that, because not only is it sociopathic to expect others to live up to the standards you've set *for yourself,* it also takes away from your own self-esteem, to assume that anything you've done *anyone could do,* and that 'it was nothing special,' and makes it that much less of a personal success (and you much less likely to be able to do it again, as you're setting yourself up for failure by denying your own accomplishment and / or ability to excel).

Someone who jumps on the wagon and then hectors friends who still drink? Someone who stops smoking and then is an insufferable jerk to friends who aren't having as easy a time of it as they did? If they had any moral authority from their laudable accomplishment, they've just given it up by choosing to be jerks, instead of supporting people who are still on that journey. Bad enough to be a sore loser, but some people are sore *winners.*

People are different, and circumstances are different. Best not to judge, when you don't have all the facts.

[Username taken]

Yeaaaaahh no that's false. You are in control of your own weight, period. So yes it is "eat less and do more jumping jacks, fatty". As a father with 5 boys, I'm exposed constantly to these said "genetic problems" from other families spanning from elementary school to HS, yet in every case these obese kids are ... quite simply ... lazy. My 5 boys have been told very clearly that they HAVE to partake in an athletic team sport that has them active an hour a day minimum. 2 are on their way to scholarships, 2 will probably do no more than AYSO/rec ball because they just aren't gifted in that way. Last kid is a bit of a wildcard (he could be good but hasn't found a sport he loves and he may never). But all of them are active because I made it a point to teach them that physical health is important.

You can use all the tumblr science you want, but the bottom line is "plenty of people have x condition" is actually a very fringe case and 90+% of those people are just overweight. It's clearly identified as a behavioral problem by the CDC, so pretending you're some snowflake who can't lose weight and are still healthy is just you lying to yourself. You're not healthy. It is in your control. That's the bottom line. Willing to sacrifice that health for some other reason (whatever that may be)? That's completely your call, and I wont shame a overweight person for it. But it's still a choice, and not one we should be putting a spotlight on.

Exactly.

I've struggled with my weight for a long time. I'm not obese but I'm not trim, I have a rather large physique and I do pack on pounds faster than the average person.

However, changes in my diet and some exercise have ABSOLUTELY yielded results. Diet is very key simply because I pack on pounds easier.

If one has a child who's big, feed them less. As an adult, absolutely watch what you eat and exercise more. It's a complete myth that people can't lose weight because of certain conditions. It's not easy but nothing good comes easy in life.

[Carbon Based Stickler]

Yeaaaaahh no that's false. You are in control of your own weight, period. So yes it is "eat less and do more jumping jacks, fatty". As a father with 5 boys, I'm exposed constantly to these said "genetic problems" from other families spanning from elementary school to HS, yet in every case these obese kids are ... quite simply ... lazy. My 5 boys have been told very clearly that they HAVE to partake in an athletic team sport that has them active an hour a day minimum. 2 are on their way to scholarships, 2 will probably do no more than AYSO/rec ball because they just aren't gifted in that way. Last kid is a bit of a wildcard (he could be good but hasn't found a sport he loves and he may never). But all of them are active because I made it a point to teach them that physical health is important.

You can use all the tumblr science you want, but the bottom line is "plenty of people have x condition" is actually a very fringe case and 90+% of those people are just overweight. It's clearly identified as a behavioral problem by the CDC, so pretending you're some snowflake who can't lose weight and are still healthy is just you lying to yourself. You're not healthy. It is in your control. That's the bottom line. Willing to sacrifice that health for some other reason (whatever that may be)? That's completely your call, and I wont shame a overweight person for it. But it's still a choice, and not one we should be putting a spotlight on.

Wooptie-fucking-doo. Way to pat yourself on the back there. Mr. Father Of The Year, ladies & gentlemen. Your parenting philosophy aside, choice or not, what does it matter? Even some professional athletes struggle with their weight. Hell, every NFL linemen is overweight. Why can't a superhero? That poor wild card.

[lordozone]

Yyyyeeeeaaaahhhh . . . no. That's false. Obesity is complicated. It's not just a matter of "eat less and do some jumping jacks, fatty." A lot of people are fat because of glandular problems. Or a genetic factor that causes them to gain weight quickly. Or they work long hours for low pay, putting them in a situation where they can't afford healthy food, and don't have the time or energy to exercise regularly. Or there's other things going on that make it damned near impossible for them to not be fat.

On top of that, there's plenty of fat people whose weight doesn't really make them less healthy. It's possible to be fat and healthy.

It's a minority who has glandular problems. Normalize obseity for a minority is definitely not a good idea. Show different body type yes, but saying that being fat is totally healthy and you can do physically the same things that everybody... I'm not sure it's the right message.

Hell, every NFL linemen is overweight. Why can't a superhero?

https://consumer.healthday.com/fitne...rt-707482.html

excerpt:
"Physicians who work with overweight National Football League and college-level football players should be aware of the potential for elevated blood pressure, diabetes and abnormal cholesterol levels"

[Tiamatty]

Yeaaaaahh no that's false. You are in control of your own weight, period. So yes it is "eat less and do more jumping jacks, fatty". As a father with 5 boys, I'm exposed constantly to these said "genetic problems" from other families spanning from elementary school to HS, yet in every case these obese kids are ... quite simply ... lazy. My 5 boys have been told very clearly that they HAVE to partake in an athletic team sport that has them active an hour a day minimum. 2 are on their way to scholarships, 2 will probably do no more than AYSO/rec ball because they just aren't gifted in that way. Last kid is a bit of a wildcard (he could be good but hasn't found a sport he loves and he may never). But all of them are active because I made it a point to teach them that physical health is important.

So, you're presumably making decent money. Able to feed your kids well? And either you or your wife has the time to make healthy meals. And you've got enough money to enroll your kids in athletic programs.

See, for a lot of people? Those aren't options. For a lot of people? The money for healthy food isn't there. The time and energy to cook healthy meals isn't there. The money for athletic programs isn't there.

Our bodies have not evolved to modern society very well. So it's very, very easy to gain weight, and very, very difficult to lose it (and to keep it off).

Anyway, having plus-size characters isn't about "glorifying" obesity. It's about acknowledging that not everyone looks like a goddamn supermodel. That, hey! Some people are fat! And it's not some grand moral failing or something they deserve to be mocked for! The current Jem & the Holograms comics are actually a golden example of how to go about it. Aja and Stormer are both fat. Neither are viewed as less because of their size, nor are their sizes treated as ideals to aspire to. They're just cute women who are fat.

Superhero comics are absolutely frigging awful at body diversity. Most artists don't even try. You get three body types for men, and one for women. This year, during the Summer Olympics, someone put together this infographic of Olympic body types. (Worth noting: The weightlifters, the people whose bodies are built primarily for strength? They're pretty fat.) There's a whole lot of different body types in there, and superhero comics need to start frigging looking at this shit. They need to stop going solely and exclusively off bodybuilders for male characters and bodies that don't even exist for female characters, and get some goddamn body diversity, and yeah, you're damned right that includes some fat characters.

[Kieran_Frost]

Something worth point out, people with zero body fat aren't "healthy" either; but 95% of heroes have exactly that. So while I understand the arguement "don't glorify obesity", at the same time, maybe we should tone back on glorifying excessive gym bunny bodies? Esp. in heroes who have no need of them/powers aren't athletic in origin.

P.S. that said the best way to lose weight is to convert fat into muscle (this is easier for guys). That doesn't require a) a gym membership or b) healthy eating. YES healthy eating is good, but it's not the core requirement. It doesn't even require very much time. 20 sits ups a day, 30 push-ups a day, 40 squats a day. Do it five days a week; and everyone will see results. You don't even need cardio (though, like healthy eating, cardio is a bonus). It just takes time, A LOT of time (as in months and years, it's not a quick fix). While it takes very little "time" in your day, it will be a slow process for results, and that requires commitment. Doing that routine won't turn anyone over night but overtime it will make a hell of a lot of difference. Then, when someone can do those easier, they up the number. Simples.

In what kind of world is Squirrel Girl "plus size".

Errrr... in the world of Marvel comics, where every female has a size 0 waist; and boobs up the heavens; she's plus size. Sad, but true.

[Sutekh]

Something worth point out, people with zero body fat aren't "healthy" either; but 95% of heroes have exactly that. So while I understand the arguement "don't glorify obesity", at the same time, maybe we should tone back on glorifying excessive gym bunny bodies? Esp. in heroes who have no need of them/powers aren't athletic in origin.

That's a good point. To have 'washboard abs,' which many superheroes have by default, even if they are never shown exercising or dieting, you have to have less than the recommended 'healthy' amount of body fat.

It's hardly as egregious as the unhealthy/unrealistic body images being sold to young women as 'normal,' but it's still not great.

[PyroTwilight]

I've loved the few I've seen, Butterball in particular springing to mind.

Volcana was an odd case in that she was basically treated as overweight but really just had a relatively average build (isn't she pretty tall as well? And she didn't even weight much from what her handbook entry said if I recall). So I never really understood why she was viewed as plus size etc... But I loved her all the same. Though the stories I saw her in had a tendency to basically call her a "fat cow" at random, man that was odd.

Butterball amusingly looking back had a bit of an odd name but it helps that in universe he was initially the Boulder but decided to go with Butterball because everyone made fun of him for his size and he basically said OK I'm Butterball. And kinda turned it back on them. "I guess I'm Butterball good luck!"

Over at DC they had the main star of Dial H be a really out of shape guy. It wasn't ever really about his weight though which is a key thing.


Just create a character who has that as part of their look or design. There's no real need to address their weight unless you have a good story to make with it. I read the first issue of Faith for example and her weight is pretty much not even touched on (though there's quick stuff mentioned).

[The Velour Fog]

blob solo plz