Should Supeman get the classic suit back?

[stephens2177]

That sounds more like using a different idea than screwing up, though. Screwing up would be going in one direction and then coming to believe it was a mistake. In that case, while some may like him having "golden age" powers without a strong connection to sunlight or sunlight storage, it also kinda defeated the point of depowering him.

I liked the aura because it kept his costume largely safe but didn't stop him from changing imagery in dramatic moments. It would say, extend to the people he carried close to his chest or large strucres he'd lift, and of course led to Superboy having probably my favorite power ever. Along the idea of changing costumes, I liked that Superman would adopt looks and gear according to adventure. Dunno how Kenner didn't go nuts with that.

My one true gripe is the change in shield. I'll always think the pre-crisis shield was perfect and a significant improvement on any design.

Ok mistake wasnt the right word,more like missed opportunity for clear and concise awesomeness I'm.

Green kryptonite should make him sick,red kryptonite should takeaway the aura amp abilities,but he is a being from a super evolved species,1 that not only had millennium of scientific advancedment that should make them far superior to us,but also living on a **** hole like Krypton pushed them into evolving or dying.so Superman should ALWAYS be superior to us imo.

Tactile telekinesis is my favorite power of course,a mix of kesels and lobdells version would be a dream for me.having the aura as a answer to his clothes staying intact and lifting things that should crumble under him was brilliant to me.it also plays into how the yellow sun amps him from his normal state.

What was the difference with the shield from pre to post crisis?

[JAK]

I liked the bioaura personally. But then, it folds nicely into my fan-canon that Clark's actually a reality warping psychic who manifests his powers through physical might because its what comes naturally to him.

Makes sense to me.

This is why I think he should have a few costumes for different occasions. Briefly in the New52 he'd wear the t-shirt while patrolling Metropolis, but put on the armor when with the League or when he was expecting a fight that would do more than leave a couple bullet holes in his shirt.

I'm of two minds about this idea. On the one hand, makes total sense. On the other, seeing how many super-people there are, having one VERY recognizable costume makes sure people who've never seen him up close before know who he is. Like, if they don't recognize the suit that day, they don't go "Are you a cousin or something, or the man himself?"

And its true that Superman could walk into any room in the universe wearing rags and still own it like the ultimate badass that he is.

But that isn't a costume that's going to entice a potential new fan to drop 3 bucks either. And that's the name of the game.

Well, actually a cover with a Superman in rags surrounded by fancy people in a nice room probably *would* sell a few copies, but you get what I mean.

Definitely agree with this. Taking that thought into the context of the topic theme: my personal take, which could very well be wrong, is that the classic vs non-classic doesn't make that much of a difference to someone who may pick up a Superman book. If he got it back tomorrow, would sales increase or decrease? That'd be an interesting question that we may never fully get an answer to.

If I had to choose between the bioaura and his suit being made from his baby blankets, I'd totally chose the bioaura. It makes more sense that way. I just found it a little too convenient. Not that it was a bad idea. I like the New 52 idea of his cape being his baby blanket though. That makes a little more sense. For one thing, it explains why his cape doesn't tear and it doesn't involve trying to take apart the blanket.

I like the cape/blanket idea, as well. The bioaura might have seemed convenient to me as well, except that it doesn't just serve the one purpose. It's basically half of his invulnerability.

I liked the aura because it kept his costume largely safe but didn't stop him from changing imagery in dramatic moments. It would say, extend to the people he carried close to his chest or large strucres he'd lift, and of course led to Superboy having probably my favorite power ever. Along the idea of changing costumes, I liked that Superman would adopt looks and gear according to adventure. Dunno how Kenner didn't go nuts with that.

Yeah, I'm surprised by that, too, now that you mention it. Good call! Would have been great for the "Man Of Steel" figure series in the 90's.

My one true gripe is the change in shield. I'll always think the pre-crisis shield was perfect and a significant improvement on any design.

Size, font, or both? Just curious.

What was the difference with the shield from pre to post crisis?

iirc, he didn't have a shield in Pre-Crisis. Others may know more, however.

[Kuwagaton]

I meant how the symbol on his chest was stretched out like the Reeves one. These pictures give an idea of what I mean. i like the smaller one with softer edges. Somehow to me it changes the way he looks, makes him look taller and leaner and also has a better color balance because I don't like huge amounts of yellow and there's already so much read when you look at him. Kane, Garcia-Lopez, and Swan are the most prlific artists to touch him before and after crisis, so it'd probably have been smarter to compare one artist as a before and after, but... these pictures were easier to find, lol.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rH3MkzNsVp...0/scan0003.jpg
and
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZUXCE3nbM...swanderson.gif
pre crisis. Post:

http://art.cafimg.com/images/Categor...3140741311.jpg
and
http://comicmegastore.com/images/man...f-steel-65.jpg

[jimmy]

I meant how the symbol on his chest was stretched out like the Reeves one. These pictures give an idea of what I mean. i like the smaller one with softer edges. Somehow to me it changes the way he looks, makes him look taller and leaner and also has a better color balance because I don't like huge amounts of yellow and there's already so much read when you look at him. Kane, Garcia-Lopez, and Swan are the most prlific artists to touch him before and after crisis, so it'd probably have been smarter to compare one artist as a before and after, but... these pictures were easier to find, lol.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rH3MkzNsVp...0/scan0003.jpg
and
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZUXCE3nbM...swanderson.gif
pre crisis. Post:

http://art.cafimg.com/images/Categor...3140741311.jpg
and
http://comicmegastore.com/images/man...f-steel-65.jpg

That last one really takes the cake !!!

[JAK]

I meant how the symbol on his chest was stretched out like the Reeves one. These pictures give an idea of what I mean. i like the smaller one with softer edges. Somehow to me it changes the way he looks, makes him look taller and leaner and also has a better color balance because I don't like huge amounts of yellow and there's already so much red when you look at him. Kane, Garcia-Lopez, and Swan are the most prolific artists to touch him before and after crisis, so it'd probably have been smarter to compare one artist as a before and after, but... these pictures were easier to find, lol.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rH3MkzNsVp...0/scan0003.jpg
and
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZUXCE3nbM...swanderson.gif
pre crisis. Post:

http://art.cafimg.com/images/Categor...3140741311.jpg
and
http://comicmegastore.com/images/man...f-steel-65.jpg

Ah, gotcha. Love those, too. Generally I like a mid-size emblem, myself.

Ironically, the emblem on my suit started out mid-size, but the multi-layer latex muscle suit I use now stretches it out a bit more than I'd like (even though the overall effect is good).

[Ascended]

I'm of two minds about this idea. On the one hand, makes total sense. On the other, seeing how many super-people there are, having one VERY recognizable costume makes sure people who've never seen him up close before know who he is. Like, if they don't recognize the suit that day, they don't go "Are you a cousin or something, or the man himself

Well, within the context of the narrative it made more sense. At the time (early New52 timeline) there weren't a lot of super people around. There was basically Clark, the other six members of the League, possibly a Robin, and Steel, who only had one adventure that we know of. So there wouldn't be a lot of confusion if Clark showed up in t-shirt or the armor.

Definitely agree with this. Taking that thought into the context of the topic theme: my personal take, which could very well be wrong, is that the classic vs non-classic doesn't make that much of a difference to someone who may pick up a Superman book. If he got it back tomorrow, would sales increase or decrease? That'd be an interesting question that we may never fully get an answer to.

I dont think sales would be impacted at all, honestly. Regular people dont care about the trunks. Sure, they'll laugh at a joke at the trunk's expense, but they're not offended by them or anything. Now, if Superman is standing next to his peers and looks like a chump because he's wearing a cheap Halloween costume while they're all in crazy cool gear, that could be an issue for his "cool factor" but the trunks themselves are a non-issue. Superman looking modern and contemporary and not like a throwback to an age gone by that refuses to die, and Superman wearing the red trunks are two separate things.

[JAK]

Well, within the context of the narrative it made more sense. At the time (early New52 timeline) there weren't a lot of super people around. There was basically Clark, the other six members of the League, possibly a Robin, and Steel, who only had one adventure that we know of. So there wouldn't be a lot of confusion if Clark showed up in t-shirt or the armor.

Ah, yeah that would make a difference. And if he establishes a round-robin of costumes early enough, that'd be more fine (most likely).

I dont think sales would be impacted at all, honestly. Regular people dont care about the trunks. Sure, they'll laugh at a joke at the trunk's expense, but they're not offended by them or anything. Now, if Superman is standing next to his peers and looks like a chump because he's wearing a cheap Halloween costume while they're all in crazy cool gear, that could be an issue for his "cool factor" but the trunks themselves are a non-issue. Superman looking modern and contemporary and not like a throwback to an age gone by that refuses to die, and Superman wearing the red trunks are two separate things.

True on all counts. Though, in the right drawing hands (or even live), it doesn't have to seem cheap - even with other heroes/heroines in full-techy gear (which I know I'm preaching to the choir on, just saying for completeness). DC would be smart to start pushing ideas like:

1: "That's Superman?"
2: "Yep."
1: "Why's he in that when we have all this?"
2: "Because he doesn't need it."
1: ...oh....

Spinning it could be a really cool, "in-their-face" way to almost counter-promote Superman as unique, but I don't expect that to happen. lol

[jimmy]

Ok mistake wasnt the right word,more like missed opportunity for clear and concise awesomeness I'm.

Green kryptonite should make him sick,red kryptonite should takeaway the aura amp abilities,but he is a being from a super evolved species,1 that not only had millennium of scientific advancedment that should make them far superior to us,but also living on a **** hole like Krypton pushed them into evolving or dying.so Superman should ALWAYS be superior to us imo.

Tactile telekinesis is my favorite power of course,a mix of kesels and lobdells version would be a dream for me.having the aura as a answer to his clothes staying intact and lifting things that should crumble under him was brilliant to me.it also plays into how the yellow sun amps him from his normal state.

What was the difference with the shield from pre to post crisis?

This may help...
SupermanS2.jpg
I didn't include the earlier versions 1938-40 since they were really crude works in progress!

[Ascended]

1: "That's Superman?"
2: "Yep."
1: "Why's he in that when we have all this?"
2: "Because he doesn't need it."
1: ...oh....

Spinning it could be a really cool, "in-their-face" way to almost counter-promote Superman as unique, but I don't expect that to happen. lol

It would require putting more "swagger" in Superman than a lot of people at DC seem comfortable with.

This is sort of the "folk tale" approach I was talking about earlier, where I'd like to see them use the t-shirt and jeans costume from Morrison's run. Just really go all out and rock that "blue collar badass" vibe. All these people in their armor and glowing space uniforms taking orders from a dude in a pair of Levis would be intimidating all on its own, and actually work really well in the marketing and promotion. But.....yeah, I think DC is afraid of it.

[Kuwagaton]

For me it's backwards, haha. Impressive in that it's the original. He's got the costume and everyone else just sorta dresses like him. Maybe they don't even know why, but Superman does it so that's how it's done.

Really with DC I wish it was mixed up more, so we saw all sorts of different looks as characters are really too different to say, coincidentally make a bunch of shiny, high collared shirts apart from each other. Superman could have his strongman suit, and that's his thing so no one expects him to update. Unfortunately with the New 52, the first major costume change, everyone else came from his mold and then made the same jump into new school outfits, so Superman would have looked really weird holding the old style by himself.

Ironically, the emblem on my suit started out mid-size, but the multi-layer latex muscle suit I use now stretches it out a bit more than I'd like (even though the overall effect is good).

I imagine. It looks just as it was worn by Reeve, Cain, and the Superboys. Then Routh had that leathery plastic thing going on.

[JAK]

This may help...
SupermanS2.jpg
I didn't include the earlier versions 1938-40 since they were really crude works in progress!

OH! LOL... I thought he meant shield as in aura/bioaura. Geez, my bad. lol

It would require putting more "swagger" in Superman than a lot of people at DC seem comfortable with.

I'd like more of that - where he was at the start of Rebirth could work well.

This is sort of the "folk tale" approach I was talking about earlier, where I'd like to see them use the t-shirt and jeans costume from Morrison's run. Just really go all out and rock that "blue collar badass" vibe. All these people in their armor and glowing space uniforms taking orders from a dude in a pair of Levis would be intimidating all on its own, and actually work really well in the marketing and promotion. But.....yeah, I think DC is afraid of it.

Glad you like that, and I agree. I actually did really like the t-shirt/jeans look. One thing I just thought about for consideration: the more detailed and complicated costumes get, the more Superman's usual suit becomes rife for "folklore-vibe" by comparison. That could work as well. Especially in the hands of a Frank Quietly or a Tim Sale.

It's a shame DC is afraid of it, too, as they could very well have been on that road (possibly) back in '86 (with the "roots-ier" feel)

[JAK]

For me it's backwards, haha. Impressive in that it's the original. He's got the costume and everyone else just sorta dresses like him. Maybe they don't even know why, but Superman does it so that's how it's done.

Ah, good point. In my head, the characters in my dialogue example are younger heroes with no sense of context: they don't realize that his was the starting point - that kinda thing, to give a "younger audience perspective" cheat and address it head on.

Really with DC I wish it was mixed up more, so we saw all sorts of different looks as characters are really too different to say, coincidentally make a bunch of shiny, high collared shirts apart from each other. Superman could have his strongman suit, and that's his thing so no one expects him to update.

I am in love with this idea. Very much so. Feels a lot more organic, too.

Unfortunately with the New 52, the first major costume change, everyone else came from his mold and then made the same jump into new school outfits, so Superman would have looked really weird holding the old style by himself.

Replace "new school outfits" with "spares from Tony Stark's garage sale" and.. nah, I'm kidding. I do agree - though it's funny how the costumes come from so many different methods of making yet look SO similar.

I imagine. It looks just as it was worn by Reeve, Cain, and the Superboys. Then Routh had that leathery plastic thing going on.

Speaking of that "plastic thing" (which looked like he skinned Man-Bat for the cape, lol)... take the SR suit and give it the deeper blue of the BvS/JL suit (and the oval buckle, the S feels like 'advertising'/accessorizing which seems foreign to Superman) and I think it would have looked a LOT better. Red's the more vibrant/active color anyway, so making it the brighter contract one works much better, imo.

[Kuwagaton]

Yeah, that was the weird thing to me, too. Just fix the colors and it seems like it'd give a much different impression. Digging the 'S' into a belt without making it seem like a real buckle could have been scrapped. But the basic idea of what Routh had going on was a clever, noninvasive tweak.

Along the same lines, I liked what the legendary Neal Adams came up with when he was given a little bit of personal space.



With the black around the 'S' and the belt into a metal look of the belt. I suppose putting his wannabes in high collars was coincidental, haha.

[jimmy]

If I had to choose between the bioaura and his suit being made from his baby blankets, I'd totally chose the bioaura. It makes more sense that way. I just found it a little too convenient. Not that it was a bad idea. I like the New 52 idea of his cape being his baby blanket though. That makes a little more sense. For one thing, it explains why his cape doesn't tear and it doesn't involve trying to take apart the blanket.

Why not choose both like the Adventures of Superman episode called "The Deadly Rock" - which had Superman extended his invulnerability aura to an unconscious person who was; Slugged, Stabbed with a knitting needle, and Shot at point blank range.

Grant Morrison also explored this "Bio-Electric Aura" in All Star Superman

Yeah, I watched that episode a while back and that was what I had in mind when I mentioned it.



It was a curious choice to just outline the \S/ in yellow instead of filling it in. Especially in that when Superman showed up, his shield was filled in with yellow. It does make her distinct though.
I can understand the over the knee boots because Melissa does a lot of sliding and other action and so she needs some sort of knee protection in real life. Supergirl is more of a brawler now than
in previous live action versions. Notice that in the Wonder Woman movie Wonder Woman also has over the knee boots. Probably for the same reason, slides on her knees a lot. Lynda Carter's
Wonder Woman just mostly tossed the bad guys away if she fought them at all, she never really got into knock down drag out fights. And just about every other female action hero wears pants
so over the knee boots aren't needed for knee protection. Same with Superman, he has pants to protect his knees so never needed over the knee boots.

The absence of Yellow in the symbol makes it looks "not right" - I wish they'd color it in, unless they, "the producers" are trying to be different for what ever reason, that is known only to them.

Although, Supergirl's "S" would work on the back of the cape nicely

That's logical - I give M.B. a lot of credit, as she is not afraid to "mix it up" alright as the last "mid season finale" proved out ala Reign recently.

[jimmy]

Yeah, that was the weird thing to me, too. Just fix the colors and it seems like it'd give a much different impression. Digging the 'S' into a belt without making it seem like a real buckle could have been scrapped. But the basic idea of what Routh had going on was a clever, noninvasive tweak.

Along the same lines, I liked what the legendary Neal Adams came up with when he was given a little bit of personal space.



With the black around the 'S' and the belt into a metal look of the belt. I suppose putting his wannabes in high collars was coincidental, haha.

Yeah as mark of distinction, belt buckle aside the "overall" look and feel of the costume is maintained as the pattern is there.