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  1. #4726
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheKryptonMan View Post
    I do like what you say about the duality between Clark and Superman. Another reason to bring back the Secret Identity.
    Honestly you don't even need the secret identity in place to use the duality, it just draws a clear line between the two that's easier for people to write around without having to think too hard about it. The lack of the ID could even fuel a lot of really great stories as Clark learns, for the first time in his life, how to live a single life instead of two.

    That's the trap I think DC falls into a lot with this; the secret identity exists because of the duality, not the other way around. There was no duality in post-Crisis when the ID was still secret ("Clark is who I am..."), there's no duality now that it's public. And that's wrong. The duality exists regardless of whether people know who Clark is or not. That's the way Clark has lived his entire life, it's not a consequence of his being Superman it was there from the start; the moment young Clark realized that not everyone could see and hear and do the things he can, the dual existence was born.

    Some writer, I think it might've been Yang, said that the true character is found in the tension between Clark and Superman. The secret identity helps to visualize and compartmentalize that for readers (and short-sighted writers), but this goes deeper than just whether people know who Clark is or not; this is how the man experiences his entire life.
    "We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another, as if we were one single tribe."

    ~ Black Panther.

  2. #4727
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Krypton's flaws, Superman having a more manageable power level, the expanded Daily Planet staff, even Superman Blue was used fairly well by Morrison. If you add that to what you listed, it's around the same number of ideas as the Silver Age.
    Eh, Krypton having flaws, Superman's power level being more manageable and the Daily Planet/WGBS having a larger staff all started in the Bronze age. Even the marriage is just the next logical step for a romance that was present since day 1.

    Superman Blue didn't stick around though and shows no signs of ever coming back like all the concepts and characters from the Silver/Bronze Age. It's pretty much a dated relic from the 90s.

  3. #4728
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Did i mention i like goldenage powerlevels or silverage over the top powerlevel? postcrisis powers are bland and supes is a brick
    "People’s Dreams... Have No Ends"

  4. #4729
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    The Silver Age has all but completely overtaking any new ideas introduced afterwards.

    Also, I suspect a certain segment of the Superman fandom would be much more happy if they weren't so damn insecure over some people not liking Superman.
    That's a fairly good point.

  5. #4730
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Did i mention i like goldenage powerlevels or silverage over the top powerlevel? postcrisis powers are bland and supes is a brick
    Yeah, it's kind of a bland middle-of-the-road level. I think Bronze Age is a way better scaled down level, plus he still has all the lore of the Silver Age with him.

  6. #4731
    Astonishing Member TheRay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheKryptonMan View Post
    I've come to like Calvin Ellis as President Superman
    That is not what I meant. I was talking only about Superman uniform designs.

  7. #4732
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRay View Post
    I wouldn’t mind if there was a lineup of Supermen with different uniforms that was sort of a retcon and that might make people who would prefer he had different designs happy.

    Well since this is the controversial Superman thread. I personally am not crazy about seeing multiple Supermen around the Multiverse.
    I feel that it takes away from Clark's uniqueness as being one of the few Supermen in the Multiverse.
    If there's only maybe 2 or 3 at most in the Multiverse I'm fine with that.
    But I will admit that when talking about a Multiverse, then there's an infinite amount of Krypton's and possibly not all exploded . Also some may have exploded , but no one survived.
    Other Kal-El's could be in a position like the Flashpoint Superman who was captured by the government.
    I like to think that Clark's landing on Earth and being adopted by the Kent's was one in a million thing.
    It didn't necessarily happen with all who fled Krypton.
    Last edited by TheKryptonMan; 01-18-2022 at 01:00 PM.

  8. #4733
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    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil1 View Post
    I do like Silver Age Superman, but not what Johns brought to it, which was 99% Donner/Krypton stuff. The Krypton obsession is what I dislike most about the pre-Crisis version and tend to agree with Byrne on it (I even think they rebooted the character because the Krypton longing was just too baffling and all consuming), but I'm not the hugest fan of the Donner movies since they don't really adapt the comics at all, and yet, that was what Johns shoveled us. It's kind of bizarre, like giving us the pre-One More Day Spider-Man back, but making everything about it be references to the Tobey Maguire series... okay, I guess? I'd much rather get pre-Crisis Superman back entirely, but Johns' hybrid was kind of offensive to everyone at the time.
    Yeah, this is somewhere else where are tastes seem to part ways. To an extent, I can see why some readers can get sick of seeing Krypton, but to make it a place that "deserved to blow up" is pretty much throwing the baby out with the bath water.

    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    There weren't that many great or enduring ideas afterwards.

    The ones that are comparable to what we got in the Silver/Bronze age can be counted on one hand, with some fingers left over.
    In fact, the best Superman stories that came after MOS were mostly (if not all) Elseworld-style stories.
    Keep in mind that you have about as much chance of changing my mind as I do of changing yours.

  9. #4734
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    I prefer a higher powered Superman but I'm not opposed entirely to a lower powered version. The Bronze Age is still awesome, and I loved Morrison's Action vol 2, which for the first half features a very low-powered Supes. I give Byrne's Man of Steel more grief today less because of the lower power levels, but more the other changes stacked on top and also because Clark's characterization overall has aged really bad, imo.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

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  10. #4735
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    I prefer a higher powered Superman but I'm not opposed entirely to a lower powered version. The Bronze Age is still awesome, and I loved Morrison's Action vol 2, which for the first half features a very low-powered Supes. I give Byrne's Man of Steel more grief today less because of the lower power levels, but more the other changes stacked on top and also because Clark's characterization overall has aged really bad, imo.
    Yeah, I think the power level isn't even in the top 5 of problems with Byrne's MOS. It's just one more thing to add to the pile though.

  11. #4736
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    Superman will never have a good video game because Superman fans don't know what makes a good video game to begin with.

  12. #4737
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    Lar-on is a pretty cool concept that could bring mythical side to Superman. Plus werewolves are cool.

  13. #4738
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCN24454 View Post
    Superman will never have a good video game because Superman fans don't know what makes a good video game to begin with.
    Interesting take, though I think the bigger issue is always that a proper Superman simulator is often at odds with what most people look for in video games. If you recall those old Game Genie commercials, they would emphasize things like more firepower, jump higher, live forever... sounds a bit like modding your character to be more like Superman. It's a tough balance to achieve.


  14. #4739
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCN24454 View Post
    Superman will never have a good video game because Superman fans don't know what makes a good video game to begin with.
    I don't see how that works when the fans aren't the ones making the (bad) Superman games.

  15. #4740
    Extraordinary Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DochaDocha View Post
    Interesting take, though I think the bigger issue is always that a proper Superman simulator is often at odds with what most people look for in video games. If you recall those old Game Genie commercials, they would emphasize things like more firepower, jump higher, live forever... sounds a bit like modding your character to be more like Superman. It's a tough balance to achieve.

    Funny thing is that Superman isn't invincible in the comics.... so making him immune to damage in games doesn't really make sense.

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