Controversial Superman Opinions

[Tzigone]

My god, the comic book industry still tries to paint stable relationships/marriage as the death of a man, don't they?

When did that start, anyway? While publishers were hesitant/resistant to marrying off their biggest names at one time, plenty of still-used characters did get married. Now, certainly, there were some divorces and relationship difficulties as the bronze age rolled around. Plus Iris got killed. But now they are all that way - I know part of it is just how long-running some characters are, and them wanting to always have drama because it sells better (especially if they want to attract a younger demographic). It's like every single long-term relationship has enough baggage now you have to ignore significant bits to view the relationship as an actual positive thing in the characters' livee. And that's just not my flavor. I'm sure I'm overstating it, and there are exceptions, but it's still far too common.

[marhawkman]

They can just say "MJ",Paul What's-His-Name,and "their kids", are all magical creations by a malevolent deity. They can fade from existence...and Peter can find and reunite with the real MJ.

Lies from mephisto, or some holographic nonsense.

[marhawkman]

When did that start, anyway? While publishers were hesitant/resistant to marrying off their biggest names at one time, plenty of still-used characters did get married. Now, certainly, there were some divorces and relationship difficulties as the bronze age rolled around. Plus Iris got killed. But now they are all that way - I know part of it is just how long-running some characters are, and them wanting to always have drama because it sells better (especially if they want to attract a younger demographic). It's like every single long-term relationship has enough baggage now you have to ignore significant bits to view the relationship as an actual positive thing in the characters' lives. And that's just not my flavor. I'm sure I'm overstating it, and there are exceptions, but it's still far too common.

Just look at what getting married did to Goku.... it made his life WAY more interesting, in a good way. Goku as a grandpa is WAY more interesting than Goku as a kid.

[Will Evans]

I’m not sure with modern multimedia, technology and iPhones and the downsizing of newspapers, is there a way to keep the Daily Planet relevant in comics for another 20 years real world time.

[Vordan]

I’m not sure with modern multimedia, technology and iPhones and the downsizing of newspapers, is there a way to keep the Daily Planet relevant in comics for another 20 years real world time.

There isn’t. At some point they’re going to have to let the traditional take on the Planet go, and rethink what it means for Clark to be a reporter. Could always switch to Clark, Lois, and Jimmy being podcast reporters or something like that.

[Ascended]

I’m not sure with modern multimedia, technology and iPhones and the downsizing of newspapers, is there a way to keep the Daily Planet relevant in comics for another 20 years real world time.

It's not relevant *now!* Who reads the printed paper anymore?

Easy enough to just transition the Planet into a multimedia organization like CNN. Functionally it doesn't make much difference if Clark and Lois are writing articles for a printed paper or a website, Perry is still going to yell about deadlines and chasing a story with legs, and Jim can still be a cameraman. Just switch up the window dressing. Instead of everyone in the elevator reading the same paper with the same big Superman headline, they're using their phones. Say Cat Grant is an anchor for a show, and have that being filmed in the background of some art here and there.

The story can be exactly the same, with the same characters serving the same roles. Just modernize some of the art, give background characters who never matter a slightly different job (Cat being an anchor instead of gossip columnist? Same thing. Lombard doing a sports podcast instead of writing the sports section? Nobody cares) and the Planet will feel like a fairly modern news source.

[Tzigone]

It's not relevant *now!* Who reads the printed paper anymore?

Which is terribly sad in that the newspapers often do the best, most in-depth reporting, and yet make little money off it (regardless of print or online) because everyone screams they want quality journalism, but no one is willing to pay for it (see all the bitching about paywalls from people who aren't willing to pay a subscription, aren't willing to pay a one-off article fee, and use ad-blockers so ads can't pay for it...not that ads could manage it alone, anyway).

[The World]

Why do you guys think manga outsells comics every month?

Bit of an odd comment imo. Manga is generally written at a much higher standard than it's American counterpart. On top of that I'd say storytelling is put on a higher pedestal when it comes to art sensibilities in eastern schools of thought which lends to better fundamentals when it comes to making a decent visual comic experience. Frankly the absurdly generic nature of the average american comic book probably has a lot more to do with why they don't sell well than characters being written as cucks or what not.

Saitama is basically an amalgamation of everything people say Clark should never be (short, bald, detatched to the world around him, no real gf to speak of, goofy, TOO POWERFUL) yet he's been extremely successful none the less while Clark has had an at best bumpy modern existence. Honestly I'd say that people get angry every time a character does something they personally don't agree with shows that the characters in American comics are less people and more of a thin veneer that people project onto to live out fantasies. Meanwhile it's perfectly normal to not like characters, even main characters in manga. So much has been made ado about making Clark likeable and it hasn't gotten him anywhere, meanwhile ONE went out of his way to lead Saitama with a lot of less than desirable characteristics so that he could be an entertaining and interesting character.

I guess the best way to put it is that manga writers seem to actually be trying to writer interesting characters to enjoy while comic writers seem to be trying to write comfortable status quo that a niche group of geeks might find appealing.

Frankly if anybody wants a good autopsy on why modern Supes doesn't really work you should read One Punch Man. Especially compare Saitama's supporting cast to the one the 90's writers tried to create for Clark.

[manwhohaseverything]

You don't have to like saitama..mumenrider4life

[marhawkman]

Bit of an odd comment imo. Manga is generally written at a much higher standard than it's American counterpart. On top of that I'd say storytelling is put on a higher pedestal when it comes to art sensibilities in eastern schools of thought which lends to better fundamentals when it comes to making a decent visual comic experience. Frankly the absurdly generic nature of the average american comic book probably has a lot more to do with why they don't sell well than characters being written as cucks or what not.

Saitama is basically an amalgamation of everything people say Clark should never be (short, bald, detatched to the world around him, no real gf to speak of, goofy, TOO POWERFUL) yet he's been extremely successful none the less while Clark has had an at best bumpy modern existence. Honestly I'd say that people get angry every time a character does something they personally don't agree with shows that the characters in American comics are less people and more of a thin veneer that people project onto to live out fantasies. Meanwhile it's perfectly normal to not like characters, even main characters in manga. So much has been made ado about making Clark likeable and it hasn't gotten him anywhere, meanwhile ONE went out of his way to lead Saitama with a lot of less than desirable characteristics so that he could be an entertaining and interesting character.

I guess the best way to put it is that manga writers seem to actually be trying to writer interesting characters to enjoy while comic writers seem to be trying to write comfortable status quo that a niche group of geeks might find appealing.

Frankly if anybody wants a good autopsy on why modern Supes doesn't really work you should read One Punch Man. Especially compare Saitama's supporting cast to the one the 90's writers tried to create for Clark.

well, that distinction is in the now, not in the early days of comics. In the old days, there was far less focus on a static status quo. And that's what made the Corps war so interesting in Green Lantern. Stuff CHANGED!!!! There was no guaranteed status quo.

[DochaDocha]

From waaaaaay out left field: animation needs to find a better way depict Superman's hovering. Animation artists have collected decided that Superman remaining completely still makeis the visual look flat, so they add a little bit of an up and down bob, like he's a fishing floater bobbing on the surface of the water. I find this animation technique lacking and want to see an updated take.

[DABellWrites]

I’m not sure with modern multimedia, technology and iPhones and the downsizing of newspapers, is there a way to keep the Daily Planet relevant in comics for another 20 years real world time.

There's no real reason to get rid of the Daily Planet. Just keep it around. There's way more unrealistic stuff going on in DC Comics than the Daily Planet.

[DABellWrites]

Why do you guys think manga outsells comics every month?

The CEO of Barnes & Noble has stated manga is one of their biggest sellers. I read an article from comicbeat showing that "adult" manga (however the writer defined that) takes up about 53% of the market share. And the recent industry report from IC2V and Comicrhon showed us that manga and graphic novels has skyrocketed in recent years. When I worked at Amazon, I saw more manga being shipped than comic books. I think, TMNT was the only comic book I remember seeing.

[DochaDocha]

Why do you guys think manga outsells comics every month?

My general feeling is that there's a beginning, middle, and end for most manga, which is clearly not true for Big Two US comics. As a result, Big Two US comics kind of have a "So what?" feel to them in comparison.

That said, once a manga ends, it's over, so there's some give and take. Batman goes on indefinitely; a manga series is finite and has to be replaced by another property.

[Agent Z]

Bit of an odd comment imo. Manga is generally written at a much higher standard than it's American counterpart. On top of that I'd say storytelling is put on a higher pedestal when it comes to art sensibilities in eastern schools of thought which lends to better fundamentals when it comes to making a decent visual comic experience. Frankly the absurdly generic nature of the average american comic book probably has a lot more to do with why they don't sell well than characters being written as cucks or what not.

Saitama is basically an amalgamation of everything people say Clark should never be (short, bald, detatched to the world around him, no real gf to speak of, goofy, TOO POWERFUL) yet he's been extremely successful none the less while Clark has had an at best bumpy modern existence. Honestly I'd say that people get angry every time a character does something they personally don't agree with shows that the characters in American comics are less people and more of a thin veneer that people project onto to live out fantasies. Meanwhile it's perfectly normal to not like characters, even main characters in manga. So much has been made ado about making Clark likeable and it hasn't gotten him anywhere, meanwhile ONE went out of his way to lead Saitama with a lot of less than desirable characteristics so that he could be an entertaining and interesting character.

I guess the best way to put it is that manga writers seem to actually be trying to writer interesting characters to enjoy while comic writers seem to be trying to write comfortable status quo that a niche group of geeks might find appealing.

Frankly if anybody wants a good autopsy on why modern Supes doesn't really work you should read One Punch Man. Especially compare Saitama's supporting cast to the one the 90's writers tried to create for Clark.

I really wish people, especially on this forum, would stop putting manga on a pedestal. There is a lot of crap in that medium, especially in the stuff that gets praised to high heaven. There are a number of factors as to why manga outsells western comics that are more complex than Saitama being allowed to be as ridiculously powerful as Superman fans think he's not allowed to be.

My general feeling is that there's a beginning, middle, and end for most manga, which is clearly not true for Big Two US comics. As a result, Big Two US comics kind of have a "So what?" feel to them in comparison.

That said, once a manga ends, it's over, so there's some give and take. Batman goes on indefinitely; a series is finite and has to be replaced by another property.

On the other hand, having a beginning, middle and end means a better chance at more consistent quality. But to connect this to what I said, this isn't limited to manga and applies to other stories and media. In fact, the Big 2 have been outsold by several comic series that weren't designed to continue indefinitely. The first Wonder Woman movie made more money for Warner Brothers than the comics have done in decades.