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  1. #2911
    Astonishing Member Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    He just wouldn't flake during his shifts.

    I mean he can't REALLY flake from being a reporter either, not in 2020.
    If he hears a dam about to burst or another galactic conquerer land and start tearing up Metropolis, he will. He trusts the MFD as it is to do their jobs, so it'd basically be what's going on now. I think he needs a job he can disappear during, and yeah, it makes less sense in 2020 but the conceit is he can slip away and everyone just assumes he's chasing a story.

    Unless he runs out of the building with a citizen in tow and remains on their radio line, I dunno, I think they'd let him go.

  2. #2912
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    Now that you say it, firefighting really hasn't been used much by cape wearing folks huh? It's definitely a job that would suit Superman, and allow him a flexible schedule to come and go- 24/72 would allow plenty of time to screw off without much explanation beyond "I went to a ball game". Also a supporting cast of fellow workers in friendly/antagonist roles.

    The mild mannered reporter thing has got to go. Journalism can still be something Clark does, maybe under another alias- but as a full time thing it just doesnt make sense in 2020 as a job that would provide an income and not raise suspicions.

    Especially since being a journalist comes with confronting political power and speaking truth to it. Superman as an IP is not allowed to really get ideological or take a true stand on an issue so it constantly renders him impotent.
    There IS a DC comics character that sometimes works as a firefighter.... Killer Frost. Why? well this is the version who fed on heat, so she's literally eating the fires.

  3. #2913
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Another thing to consider is, in today's society, how many working class people just work the same job forever? Barely any at all, unless they do and just never progress. Which happens a lot unfortunately. Wages are stagnant, so unless you find a better paying job the likelyhood that you'll just "get a raise" is equivalent to seeing a unicorn in Central Park.

    The idea that Clark could just walk into a newspaper and get a job by giving the boss a firm handshake, and stay there for the entire future of his status quo- it's flimsy. I mean sure, in 1938- but not now. As a comedy this would work wonderfully, with Clark being a weird enigma, but I don't think most readers are interested in comedy as Superman's go-to.

    This is fine for most characters, Batman doesn't need a job- neither does Wonder Woman. Superman wants to blend in with humans though, he wants to have a life and interact to some degree in the everyday world. So he should have some semblance of variety in his working life. Variety in types of people he knows, and has worked with.

    This would also make him much more working class, without just throwing on the t shirt and jeans and having him yell at the rich- since that status quo would never be able to last. It would be more subtle and relatable.
    Last edited by Flash Gordon; 07-12-2020 at 06:47 PM.

  4. #2914
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    This is fine for most characters, Batman doesn't need a job- neither does Wonder Woman. Superman wants to blend in with humans though, he wants to have a life and interact to some degree in the everyday world. So he should have some degree of variety in his working life.
    I don't really agree. Firstly, I don't think he has to working class (don't mind it in at all, but it doesn't fit with what the DP has become or with really successful reporters, and I want him a successful reporter) and also don't think middle-class people stay at the same place all career long, nor do I think he has to walk in and get a handshake job (a degree and few years on a smaller paper first, as has been done in recent decades is fine). More importantly, that setting, and that supporting cast is established. It's part of pop culture. It's going to be used in future movies, shows, cartoons, etc. So if he doesn't have it, we'll either have movie-synergy changing it (as kinda happened before) or we'll have yet another setup where people see something on screen, then the rare few that go to comics find something totally different with totally different supporting characters in the comics. It's just not a good business move, IMO. Clark Kent, reporter, Daily Planet - it's just iconic, now, IMO.

    Honestly, though I wouldn't prefer it, diminishing the DP to the really good, non-sensationalist paper (whose even headlines don't move papers as well or generate as many clicks) with low-paid reporters would be a better move to lower incomes (which isn't necessarily the same as socioeconomic class). Problem is that I don't think it could hold. Not with them covering the kind of (very big) stories they cover. They'd rise in prominence. And while I can easily accept a CK who doesn't really care about the reporter gig and doesn't turn in the stories (after all, it was just a way to get info for heroing at first for Superman), I cannot accept a Lois and Perry who don't excel, who don't chase those stories and publish them.
    Last edited by Tzigone; 07-12-2020 at 06:58 PM.

  5. #2915
    Astonishing Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    Another thing to consider is, in today's society, how many working class people just work the same job forever? Barely any at all, unless they do and just never progress. Which happens a lot unfortunately. Wages are stagnant, so unless you find a better paying job the likelyhood that you'll just "get a raise" is equivalent to seeing a unicorn in Central Park.

    The idea that Clark could just walk into a newspaper and get a job by giving the boss a firm handshake, and stay there for the entire future of his status quo- it's flimsy. I mean sure, in 1938- but not now. As a comedy this would work wonderfully, with Clark being a weird enigma, but I don't think most readers are interested in comedy as Superman's go-to.

    This is fine for most characters, Batman doesn't need a job- neither does Wonder Woman. Superman wants to blend in with humans though, he wants to have a life and interact to some degree in the everyday world. So he should have some semblance of variety in his working life. Variety in types of people he knows, and has worked with.

    This would also make him much more working class, without just throwing on the t shirt and jeans and having him yell at the rich- since that status quo would never be able to last. It would be more subtle and relatable.
    Who said anything about 'same job forever'? Sliding timeline and constant reboots means he tends to have the job between 5-10 year at any given time. We've read him for 80 years, but to lois time hasn't moved that far from when she first met him.

  6. #2916
    Astonishing Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    If he hears a dam about to burst or another galactic conquerer land and start tearing up Metropolis, he will. He trusts the MFD as it is to do their jobs, so it'd basically be what's going on now. I think he needs a job he can disappear during, and yeah, it makes less sense in 2020 but the conceit is he can slip away and everyone just assumes he's chasing a story.

    Unless he runs out of the building with a citizen in tow and remains on their radio line, I dunno, I think they'd let him go.
    The way Dick Grayson did it when working as a cop was that he changed costume in the building in the middle of a raid, save people and beat the villains, changed back to his cop uniform, then walked out of the building after everything was over saying he got lost, trapped, or buried.

    In burning buildings and Clark's super-speed it's even more believable.

  7. #2917
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    I don't really agree. Firstly, I don't think he has to working class (don't mind it in at all, but it doesn't fit with what the DP has become or with really successful reporters, and I want him a successful reporter) and also don't think middle-class people stay at the same place all career long, nor do I think he has to walk in and get a handshake job (a degree and few years on a smaller paper first, as has been done in recent decades is fine). More importantly, that setting, and that supporting cast is established. It's part of pop culture. It's going to be used in future movies, shows, cartoons, etc. So if he doesn't have it, we'll either have movie-synergy changing it (as kinda happened before) or we'll have yet another setup where people see something on screen, then the rare few that go to comics find something totally different with totally different supporting characters in the comics. It's just not a good business move, IMO. Clark Kent, reporter, Daily Planet - it's just iconic, now, IMO.

    Honestly, though I wouldn't prefer it, diminishing the DP to the really good, non-sensationalist paper (whose even headlines don't move papers as well or generate as many clicks) with low-paid reporters would be a better move to lower incomes (which isn't necessarily the same as socioeconomic class). Problem is that I don't think it could hold. Not with them covering the kind of (very big) stories they cover. They'd rise in prominence. And while I can easily accept a CK who doesn't really care about the reporter gig and doesn't turn in the stories (after all, it was just a way to get info for heroing at first for Superman), I cannot accept a Lois and Perry who don't excel, who don't chase those stories and publish them.
    The term "middle class" is a mythical one, it's as fictitious as the Fortress of Solitude. In the US it has shrank into nonexistence exponentially over the past several decades, since the 80s really.

    I'm advocating Superman to be of the working people, which I do think is pretty important to the character. I do not see him being part of the managerial class. He doesn't need capital to live his life, just a passable alias so he can devote his time to the needs of others. So I guess if you don't see him that way that's fine, but that's what I'm talking about.

    That, and ya know, newspapers are straight up dead. Lois Lane can remain a journalist in some capacity, just not newspapers (I also think the online media outlet thing is kinda tired too), the connection to that cast can remain through her- Clark just needs to do something else.
    Last edited by Flash Gordon; 07-14-2020 at 07:46 AM.

  8. #2918
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Restingvoice View Post
    The way Dick Grayson did it when working as a cop was that he changed costume in the building in the middle of a raid, save people and beat the villains, changed back to his cop uniform, then walked out of the building after everything was over saying he got lost, trapped, or buried.

    In burning buildings and Clark's super-speed it's even more believable.
    Yeah totally, if anything it gives more of a reason to make dramatic appearances/disappearances. Plus he gets to help people with his might, in costume and out.

  9. #2919
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom1592 View Post
    Who said anything about 'same job forever'? Sliding timeline and constant reboots means he tends to have the job between 5-10 year at any given time. We've read him for 80 years, but to lois time hasn't moved that far from when she first met him.
    I mean sure, but it's boring. It's dated and boring. Superman is dwindling in popularity because it's harder to make him feel modern and exciting. Some changes would be for the better, especially set dressings. Fresh contexts might do the character some justice in 2020.

  10. #2920
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    I don't think you need to change Clark's job, you just need to change how the job is written.

    The Daily Planet has been a "online" outlet since the early 00's. But you'd never know it, because they still publish a printed newspaper you see people reading and nothing about the setting, the characters, or how they do the job has changed at all. But technically? The Planet is primarily a online format now and has been for twenty years.

    Journalism is a hot button topic these days; it's modern and current and topical and has been the focus of a whole lot of attention in this country. Hell, now is a better time for Clark to be a journalist than ever.....but DC can't do it right. They keep falling back into old patterns, probably because none of the writers know how the inner workings of news media functions today.

    The basic concept is fine; Clark hunting down mysteries with his investigative skills, going up against corrupt politicians who threaten to sue him, bringing justice to those who deserve it.....there's good drama in journalism, and it allows Clark to participate in a different kind of justice; one that actually leads to changes in policy and society instead of just putting monsters in prison cells. The problem is in how DC handles the Planet. Lobdell had the right idea of taking Clark into the realm of online news blogging and DC cut that out from under him, but that development had mountains of potential and a similar track could and would be successful.

    It's not a problem with Superman or his world; nothing about the fundamentals need fixing. The problem, as always, is DC and their inability to handle Superman.

    Let me edit the Super books and I'll show you how badass and interesting journalism can still be.
    Higher, Faster, Further....More.

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  11. #2921

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    thoughts i had in another thread-

    Man of Steel's Pa Kent moments could've worked if they approached it like how Smallville and Birthright handled it. In both stories Pa kent is reluctant to have Clark step out and be Superman or more critical than Martha was and by both stories end he supports Clark as Superman. That's an oversimplification but its something that audience might enjoy and a believable arc to reverse engineer for him.

    Superman killing an opponent could work but it needs buildup and consequences that Man of Steel never dealt with nor did the films that came after. So it felt pointless outside of giving Luthor a body to experiment on.

  12. #2922
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    They should've kept the N52 universe because this Superman was much more grounded in terms of morality for someone his age with that kind of power. It would've been fun seeing Superman flex his powers without thinking through the consequences of not only to the city but also to the villains he is fighting, which would gradually have him evolve into the Superman we all knew.

    Also, I do agree that he shouldn't be all-powerful just a well rounded Superhero.
    Last edited by ToeKnee; 07-16-2020 at 03:46 PM.

  13. #2923
    Astonishing Member Robanker's Avatar
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    I think you can keep the Daily Planet as long as you treat it printing on paper as an anomaly; something of a local flavor. They're the world's biggest news publication with such a storied history, the locals in Metropolis support it because it's just a part of their culture; think about local chains that are so huge that citizens of that city can't imagine life without it. We all have them. When you travel, they disappear and you feel like a piece of your jigsaw puzzle of America is missing.

    Moreover, because they're the biggest and last print newspaper, they are carried to other places for older people and those who prefer print. They're the exception to the rule, something akin to how bookstores disappeared but Barnes and Noble lingers. They are mostly an online publication now, but they keep the presses rolling for prestige and tradition which their community supports. Having a private owner like spoilers:
    Jimmy Olsen
    end of spoilers certainly helps in that respect.

    As for Clark's job, I don't think you need to lose it. Journalism does not pay, especially if you don't take sponsorships or bribes. He and Lois shouldn't really have a high-rise apartment, either. I know Bruce pays for it, but once Lois becomes a published author as well as the world's most trusted journalist, they can move to a nicer place but I don't like them having a penthouse suite or something. Hell, I like the idea of them having a home in a really cheap part of the country that Clark just supercommutes them to/from, but Superman should never be affluent (not that anything stops him, really). It's just not at all necessary for him and decoupling any of DC's IP from any dependence on Batman is a boon. They all need to stand on their own and Batman being their boss/landlord really doesn't help anyone.

  14. #2924
    Mighty Member Ra-El's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    I think you can keep the Daily Planet as long as you treat it printing on paper as an anomaly; something of a local flavor. They're the world's biggest news publication with such a storied history, the locals in Metropolis support it because it's just a part of their culture; think about local chains that are so huge that citizens of that city can't imagine life without it. We all have them. When you travel, they disappear and you feel like a piece of your jigsaw puzzle of America is missing.

    Moreover, because they're the biggest and last print newspaper, they are carried to other places for older people and those who prefer print. They're the exception to the rule, something akin to how bookstores disappeared but Barnes and Noble lingers. They are mostly an online publication now, but they keep the presses rolling for prestige and tradition which their community supports. Having a private owner like spoilers:
    Jimmy Olsen
    end of spoilers certainly helps in that respect.

    As for Clark's job, I don't think you need to lose it. Journalism does not pay, especially if you don't take sponsorships or bribes. He and Lois shouldn't really have a high-rise apartment, either. I know Bruce pays for it, but once Lois becomes a published author as well as the world's most trusted journalist, they can move to a nicer place but I don't like them having a penthouse suite or something. Hell, I like the idea of them having a home in a really cheap part of the country that Clark just supercommutes them to/from, but Superman should never be affluent (not that anything stops him, really). It's just not at all necessary for him and decoupling any of DC's IP from any dependence on Batman is a boon. They all need to stand on their own and Batman being their boss/landlord really doesn't help anyone.
    Yes, isn't Clark capable of turning coal into diamonds? He should be rich.

  15. #2925
    Astonishing Member Robanker's Avatar
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    He could but doesn't. I don't think it really crosses his mind to do it for himself because he probably thinks it's a cheat. Truthfully, anything he needs would be at the Fortress. Creating diamonds is essentially just him chasing the dollar which is pretty antithetical to his character.

    I can see him doing it for a very poor family hit by some natural disaster or someone drowning in hospital bills.

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