Controversial Superman Opinions

[Agent Z]

He has a device that terraforms a slab of rock and ice into Krypton on earth, that also teaches him about Krypton, how then can it not teach him to speak his native language?

Learning about it is not being the same thing as being raised on it.

[rpmaluki]

It's fiction, so anything is possible. It depends what the writers and editor think makes the best story.

Superman was supposed to have a super-brain and it makes sense that his brain retains everything from when he was a child on Krypton. In fact, as a baby he should be even more intelligent than what he's shown to be. If birds and turtles and salmon can recall stuff from when they were just born, then it's not impossible that higher lifeforms can do the same.

If you as editor/writer don't want that and you want Clark to know nothing about his roots then fine--that's the story to tell.

But I think of all the children that have been taken away from their native culture and raised without knowing their roots and the language of their people and how they suffered because of that. That's not right. And if Jonathan and Martha are moral people then I think they would do everything to help their son discover where he came from and encourage him to embrace that culture in addition to their own culture. That's the kind of story I would want to tell because it has real life application and is important to us in the here and now.

Since Kal-El arrived in a highly advanced piece of technology that is probably a thousand years ahead of anything on Earth, then it should be possible to access memory files of Krypton on board that spaceship. It seems wrong that Clark or his parents would wait until he's a teen or older before trying to download that information. I like how in the Donner movie, the Jor-El A.I. is already instructing him en route to Earth. The big boo-boo is that later Clark hasn't retained any of that instruction--so what was the point?

Thus, even if you discount his super-brain, there are other ways for Clark at a young age to have learned everything he needs to know about Krypton. Personally I like the idea of a robot super-teacher who guides him as a boy and trains him in Kryptonian science, culture, martial arts and philosophy.

I think it's one of the things that made me not like Smallville Jonathan Kent. Mind you, I watched it when I was young and may have missed some nuance in Jonathan's role in Clark learning about his Kryptonian nature through the AI (they did make Jor-El antagonistic as an added bonus and I hated that so much). Of all the live action Jonathan's he's not my favourite. MoS Jonathan is his own category of questionable choices for his Clark.

[rpmaluki]

Learning about it is not being the same thing as being raised on it.

I'm not arguing about being raised, just Clark knowing how to speak the same language (and more) as his birth parents. And even doing so badly with terrible accents is better than not doing it, or knowing how to do it at all. It robs him of a piece of himself despite how he views himself. There's something to be lamented about cultures being lost because new generations assimilate new (foreign) ones without at least maintain their old (native) ones.

[manwhohaseverything]

Superman has lived an entire life on krypton.He married there.He had kid there.This is scifi.

[Johnny Thunders!]

I definitely prefer the idea that Superman’s super senses make being just human a conscious effort. He has to limit his speed, his touch, and his volume. I also like the idea that his mind and abilities make ideas of time and space irrelevant. When he traveled through time on his own, coupled with his memory and mind, he remembers Krypton more vividly than we perceive the present. Krypton and his heritage are all part of his present.


For me, Superman’s concept of time and space is just like Dr. Manhattan’s (Or Jonathan Hickmans Franklin Richards). The past is kind of just a different space. There’s this great Dave Gibbons page in Warchmen when multiple Dr Manhattan are working in a lab. It looks just like Superman moving at Super-speed to be in more places than one. Anyways, I don’t understand why fans say, unlimited strength sure, unlimited mind, no way. To my mind Superman is a tactile cosmic being. A meat and potatoes evolved being. Things like super hearing, super ventriloquism, even super breath, they let Superman operate almost as a telepath or telekinetic. With his senses, he has a cosmic awareness so to speak.

[The Frog Bros]

It's fiction, so anything is possible. It depends what the writers and editor think makes the best story.

Superman was supposed to have a super-brain and it makes sense that his brain retains everything from when he was a child on Krypton. In fact, as a baby he should be even more intelligent than what he's shown to be. If birds and turtles and salmon can recall stuff from when they were just born, then it's not impossible that higher lifeforms can do the same.

If you as editor/writer don't want that and you want Clark to know nothing about his roots then fine--that's the story to tell.

But I think of all the children that have been taken away from their native culture and raised without knowing their roots and the language of their people and how they suffered because of that. That's not right. And if Jonathan and Martha are moral people then I think they would do everything to help their son discover where he came from and encourage him to embrace that culture in addition to their own culture. That's the kind of story I would want to tell because it has real life application and is important to us in the here and now.

Since Kal-El arrived in a highly advanced piece of technology that is probably a thousand years ahead of anything on Earth, then it should be possible to access memory files of Krypton on board that spaceship. It seems wrong that Clark or his parents would wait until he's a teen or older before trying to download that information. I like how in the Donner movie, the Jor-El A.I. is already instructing him en route to Earth. The big boo-boo is that later Clark hasn't retained any of that instruction--so what was the point?

Thus, even if you discount his super-brain, there are other ways for Clark at a young age to have learned everything he needs to know about Krypton. Personally I like the idea of a robot super-teacher who guides him as a boy and trains him in Kryptonian science, culture, martial arts and philosophy.

Good point.

I seem to recall reading Waid's notes for Birthright that this was partially what he was trying to get at with Martha studying up on UFOs, outer space, and whatnot. Granted, it wasn't like she was teaching anything about Krypton and its culture, but at least the effort was there from her. This struck me as pretty unique when I first read it since it seemed to stand out.

[PCN24454]

I think it's one of the things that made me not like Smallville Jonathan Kent. Mind you, I watched it when I was young and may have missed some nuance in Jonathan's role in Clark learning about his Kryptonian nature through the AI (they did make Jor-El antagonistic as an added bonus and I hated that so much). Of all the live action Jonathan's he's not my favourite. MoS Jonathan is his own category of questionable choices for his Clark.

I feel like it makes them more human imo. He and Martha were scared of losing their son.

[marhawkman]

I definitely prefer the idea that Superman’s super senses make being just human a conscious effort. He has to limit his speed, his touch, and his volume. I also like the idea that his mind and abilities make ideas of time and space irrelevant. When he traveled through time on his own, coupled with his memory and mind, he remembers Krypton more vividly than we perceive the present. Krypton and his heritage are all part of his present.


For me, Superman’s concept of time and space is just like Dr. Manhattan’s (Or Jonathan Hickmans Franklin Richards). The past is kind of just a different space. There’s this great Dave Gibbons page in Warchmen when multiple Dr Manhattan are working in a lab. It looks just like Superman moving at Super-speed to be in more places than one. Anyways, I don’t understand why fans say, unlimited strength sure, unlimited mind, no way. To my mind Superman is a tactile cosmic being. A meat and potatoes evolved being. Things like super hearing, super ventriloquism, even super breath, they let Superman operate almost as a telepath or telekinetic. With his senses, he has a cosmic awareness so to speak.

Then you have the versions of Kara who were teens when leaving Krypton, and had a proper, if limited, education on Krypton.

[The World]

I'm fine with "Clark being who I am, Superman is what I do" sentiment but that's just the Marvel fan in me.

What you do IS who you are. Your actions define your character far more than titles or names. "Clark is who I am, Superman is what I do" is a completely empty saying. A meaningless platitude which is one of the core problems with the modern Superman.

Beyond that it's steeped in John Byrne's view of how it's disrespectful to hold a great fondness for you home country when you live in another. He had some odd beef with the idea that Superman cherished his Kryptonian heritage and held it's customs dear long after it was gone. I would have figured after a while we would all sit back and understand how stupid a viewpoint that was to hold and let Superman go back to being comfortable with himself again but I guess not.

Frankly it just doesn't have any relevancy to his character, he's doesn't indulge in humanities child like paranoias.

[rpmaluki]

I feel like it makes them more human imo. He and Martha were scared of losing their son.

That's true but that's not how it was frame throughout the show which is what annoyed me.

[Agent Z]

I think it's one of the things that made me not like Smallville Jonathan Kent. Mind you, I watched it when I was young and may have missed some nuance in Jonathan's role in Clark learning about his Kryptonian nature through the AI (they did make Jor-El antagonistic as an added bonus and I hated that so much). Of all the live action Jonathan's he's not my favourite. MoS Jonathan is his own category of questionable choices for his Clark.

I remember reading that they got Jor-El confused with Zod somehow which is why the AI was depicted as it was. We later met the real Jor-El and he wasn't anything like the AI.

[Agent Z]

I'm not arguing about being raised, just Clark knowing how to speak the same language (and more) as his birth parents. And even doing so badly with terrible accents is better than not doing it, or knowing how to do it at all. It robs him of a piece of himself despite how he views himself. There's something to be lamented about cultures being lost because new generations assimilate new (foreign) ones without at least maintain their old (native) ones.

That's fair, but a lot of the time this comes up, it feels like most fans simply hate the idea of Superman identifying as human because they scapegoat it for the character's issues with staying relevant. How people deal with their native cultures is a very complicated subject and I say this as someone who isn't American to be clear.

[Baron of Faltine]

What you do IS who you are. Your actions define your character far more than titles or names. "Clark is who I am, Superman is what I do" is a completely empty saying. A meaningless platitude which is one of the core problems with the modern Superman.

Beyond that it's steeped in John Byrne's view of how it's disrespectful to hold a great fondness for you home country when you live in another. He had some odd beef with the idea that Superman cherished his Kryptonian heritage and held it's customs dear long after it was gone. I would have figured after a while we would all sit back and understand how stupid a viewpoint that was to hold and let Superman go back to being comfortable with himself again but I guess not.

Frankly it just doesn't have any relevancy to his character, he's doesn't indulge in humanities child like paranoias.

In part you are right, we are the result of our actions. And in fact if anything else this highlight that the duality Clark/Superman is pretty much overblown. They are the same person. Remove Clark from Superman and you have just a other evil Superman. Now it cam argued that rejecting completely one original culture is wrong, but keep in mind that even at the best over time separation will warp the perception of it. After all american colonies are very very different from British culture right now. Something is always there, but is changed, deeply.
(On side note is odd how when talking about rediscovering one own heritage, there is always focus on the positive aspect, but there is no mortal culture that i's 100% positive good. And re-learning your heritage from third parties with only half understood tidbits of notions tha that to be contextualised in time and space can be dangerous. Would be funny if Superman knowledge of kyrpton is only 50% correct)

[manwhohaseverything]

if you want a human.why not read batman?If you want an american idealist,cap is there to fight for freedom and all that jaz.If you want a god..you got wonder woman and her fantasy stuff.Why should superman be any of the things?Naturally there are other aliens..but,none of em put being an alien on the map like clark did.Nor will they.

he is an american alien.He is a gladiator fighting on behalf of the common folks for truth and justice.Earth is his second home he loves.He is a dreamer and a hopless romantic.Now, that's interesting.that's just me.

On side note,Any superman has to do superman#141 justice.So far moore did with for the man who has everything.But, preflashpoint godfall was underwhelming.


It's funny how people are saying clark never lived on krypton.He did.Siegel's superman did. mort weisinger's whom according to moore had a hand in creation of modern superman was based on immigrant experience.There is no room "superman would be evil without clark" nonsense.Superman fought for those who can't fight for themselves and then it was revealed to be clark in first issue.kal el is a good person.Siegel might have explicitly chose to make superman alien because he was cynical of humanity with that much power being good.man of action is defined by action.Not platitudes of "wisdom".

[Jim Kelly]

My sense of the publishing history is that Mort Weisinger knew that bringing Krypton into the comics would open up Superman stories for more science fiction ideas--Mort being a science fiction guy. It stuns me that Jerry Siegel pretty much left Krypton out of the Superman stories between 1938 and 1947--since it's such an interesting concept to explore.

But to do this most simply, Mort had to bring stuff from Krypton into the present stories. He couldn't have Superman going back in time constantly, because that would get tired. And comic book stories are set in the present tense.

So that's why you get so much stuff arriving on Earth from Krypton, even though that defies logic.

However, I think there's a lot simpler way to have Krypton present in the stories, without always having more stuff arriving on Earth. And that's the rocketship itself. So long as it didn't blow up and it's intact, that's the key to having lots of Krypton stuff happening in Clark's present life. And that seems to be what the writers discovered in the late 1980s and through the 1990s. You don't need other stuff or people to have come from Krypton by other means. It was all there on board the rocket. Jor-El sent his son to an unknown world, so he provided for him.

Even if it was last minute, the rocket ship would have had all that technology for any traveller--because it was invented to travel through hyper-space at great distances and it needed to have very advanced technology to do that. So, of course, it would contain all the information about Krypton in its computer banks--and that information would have been easily accessible for those on board the ship. The rocket wouldn't be this mystery box that's nearly impossible for Clark to access.