Controversial Superman Opinions

[666MasterOfPuppets]

The solar battery thing IMO justs amps his already SUPER physical abilities,plus the side effect of absorbing the energy which is heat vision.

Yeah, I see it as complementary to his innate biology, and not the source of all his powers.

Kryptonite should be a poison type weakness,not a power draining weakness.let Parasite be supermans one true weakness.

Yup. I think of Kryptonite as some sort of poison, which inflicts excruciating pain (and eventually death) on any Kryptonian exposed to it. A poison that in my headcanon was designed by Kryptonians themselves.

[Ascended]

The Flash is WAY to powerful,he should have the speed,have the vibration,and cool speed tricks,but NOT time or multiverse travel abilities,that is insane without some form of strict rules or consequences if he uses them.

Eh, I got no problem with it as long as the story is good.

I dont believe in "X is too powerful" arguments. Power is a relative concept. People say Superman is over powered, but when he's fighting creatures like Darkseid, Brainiac, Imperiex, Solaris, Myx, Zod, etc, he's actually the underdog in those fights. Batman on the other hand, is smarter, stronger, and a better fighter with better resources than most of his rogues so in a lot of stories he ends up being the overpowered one; once he figures out the one gimmick the villain has, they're no longer a threat at all.

Flash, yeah, he's crazy powerful but so are a lot of his villains (like Zoom). Waid, Morrison, and Millar wrote the most powerful Flash I have ever seen and they made it work beautifully.

I do agree that Superman should be the pinnacle of raw physical power in the DCU; its the role he was created to fill and the concept is built into the central themes of the character. But just because Clark is the top of the mountain (someone has to be) doesnt mean the other big names can't do crazy high-concept stuff too. If you go by Morrison's pantheon concept, then each member of the Big 7 needs to have their own domain where they are king; the best of the best at that particular thing. Superman is the cosmic guy; he's the one who deals wth higher dimensional beings and cosmic manifestations. Diana is the one who deals with gods and mythological threats and the supernatural. Batman is the ultimate street level/noir guy. And Flash is the ultimate explorer. None of that is a threat to Clark or his standing as "best there is."

[stephens2177]

How do you arrive at such a relationship? I ask because you said "SHOULD" which for me always conjures notions of factual accuracy or some authoritative source. And from a historical real world perspective I don't know how you arrive at anything like that for Wonder Woman. She is the one superhero who was conceived from the start with the notion of physical dominance or supremacy in place (her original name was "Suprema, the Wonder Woman" in fact).

If that is a preference, fine. But saying 'should', like that is 'right' or 'correct', I have to challenge that. Even though it is 2017, the design for Wonder Woman is still quite a bit ahead of society.

I thought it was obvious that it was my opinion,and yeah she really should be,and most times she is showed as less powerful,but more skilled in fighting than him.OPINION

So Flash is too powerful but your Superman isn't?

Flash would be as fast as superman,even faster on foot,so I don't see the problem here.

Yeah, I see it as complementary to his innate biology, and not the source of all his powers.



Yup. I think of Kryptonite as some sort of poison, which inflicts excruciating pain (and eventually death) on any Kryptonian exposed to it. A poison that in my headcanon was designed by Kryptonians themselves.

This is how I hypothized how kon-els powers work,and how to meld the comic and TV show versions together also.

It's silly to think his powers come from just the sun IMO.

Kryptonite makes kryptonians sick,not weak IMO,that's how I see it.

Eh, I got no problem with it as long as the story is good.

I dont believe in "X is too powerful" arguments. Power is a relative concept. People say Superman is over powered, but when he's fighting creatures like Darkseid, Brainiac, Imperiex, Solaris, Myx, Zod, etc, he's actually the underdog in those fights. Batman on the other hand, is smarter, stronger, and a better fighter with better resources than most of his rogues so in a lot of stories he ends up being the overpowered one; once he figures out the one gimmick the villain has, they're no longer a threat at all.

Flash, yeah, he's crazy powerful but so are a lot of his villains (like Zoom). Waid, Morrison, and Millar wrote the most powerful Flash I have ever seen and they made it work beautifully.

I do agree that Superman should be the pinnacle of raw physical power in the DCU; its the role he was created to fill and the concept is built into the central themes of the character. But just because Clark is the top of the mountain (someone has to be) doesnt mean the other big names can't do crazy high-concept stuff too. If you go by Morrison's pantheon concept, then each member of the Big 7 needs to have their own domain where they are king; the best of the best at that particular thing. Superman is the cosmic guy; he's the one who deals wth higher dimensional beings and cosmic manifestations. Diana is the one who deals with gods and mythological threats and the supernatural. Batman is the ultimate street level/noir guy. And Flash is the ultimate explorer. None of that is a threat to Clark or his standing as "best there is."

I like how you gave them a area to excel at.

I don't care how powerful a character is.if you want superman pushing planets or just able to pick up a mountain,doesn't matter,but there should be a consistent scale for him and the other characters

[DochaDocha]

You know how maligned the end of the theatrical cut of Superman the Movie is because he simply goes back in time and undoes the threat? I would have to agree it's probably not a good thing if it's that easy to travel in time. Flashpoint probably hit a good medium; these characters are powerful enough to time travel, but not without massive consequences.

For standalone stories, I think it's a lot easier to uncap powers and abilities, but if you're talking about decades of continuity, maybe reasonable caps should be put in place.

[Jim Kelly]

I kind of doubt that most people malign SUPERMAN (1978) the Donner movie. It's more likely a small segment that actually bothers to think about such things and point them out. Just like the people who point out problems in STAR WARS (1977) or RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK (1981). Most people don't get stuck on this stuff--they just want to sit back and enjoy a good popcorn movie, accepting that a lot of things won't make sense, because it's supposed to be a thrill ride not a documentary. I say that as someone who used to be in that small segment that couldn't just enjoy a movie but always had to poke holes.

Of course, in 1978, the DC Superman could never have done what his movie counterpart did. There were rules in place that restricted what could and couldn't be done in time travel--and the DC Multiverse stayed whole as a result. It's abandoning those rules that has probably undermined the Multiverse, which keeps falling apart because of time travel run amok. But, in the old days when a single time traveller couldn't destroy the fabric of existence, time travel stories frequently happened at random in virtually any DC title, regardless of category.

Maybe the failure of the DCU timeline is the result of those maligning hole pokers getting jobs at DC.

[DochaDocha]

I think part of it is that there's a certain tongue-in-cheek element to the film that a hokey ending like going back in time sort of falls in line with the scope of the film. If anyone tried to do that ending today, I think it wouldn't be as well-received. On the other hand, if it happened on Justice League Action, I wouldn't complain at all. In fact, I'd appreciate it as a nod to a classic film while also being good fantasy (assuming the episode was written well).

[666MasterOfPuppets]

This is how I hypothized how kon-els powers work,and how to meld the comic and TV show versions together also.

It's silly to think his powers come from just the sun IMO.

Kryptonite makes kryptonians sick,not weak IMO,that's how I see it.

Yeah, a la Man Of Steel. Kryptonite tears down a Kryptonian's cells. As for the sun, I agree. And it wouldn't mean that Superman's "sun god" status would go away.

[Netherman14]

Yeah, a la Man Of Steel. Kryptonite tears down a Kryptonian's cells. As for the sun, I agree. And it wouldn't mean that Superman's "sun god" status would go away.

It just means that though Superman still retains his "sun god" status as you've said, if some of Clark's powers are made innate to his biology he doesn't end up completely depowered on a planet with a red sun.

[Ascended]

I like how you gave them a area to excel at.

Thanks, but I cant take credit, its not my idea. I dont even think Morrison can get the credit for this, he just put into words something that, as far as I can see, evolved naturally over time.

It makes sense though. If I need to catch a twisted serial killer Hal Jordan is probably not the person I want looking into it. He's powerful, but Hal's not a detective and he's kind of an idiot. Superman and Flash? They're both skilled detectives and powerful but they're big and bright and flashy and loud and that serial killer is going to bolt as soon as they show up (because stealth is not what they do at all). But Batman? He's got the skillset I want to employ for this particular job.

Now if we're talking about intergalactic incidents and alien armadas entering our solar system? I'm gonna give Hal a call and let Batman sit this one out.

taking the "pantheon" thing further, it also opens up the doors for some B and C list heroes to "matter" to the overall DCU. Just like the Greek gods have a "core roster" of big names (Zeus, Apollo, Hera, Artemis, etc) the Greek pantheon also had a bunch of lesser gods with more focused, smaller domains (Nike, Eros, etc). So using that logic, you can point at a D list hero like Vibe and say "He's the best interdimensional border cop in the DCU!" without it really stepping on the toes of the big names. Or you can point to Booster Gold and say "He's the guy who protects the timeline from manipulation" without it really infringing on Flash's "best explorer" concept. Or you can point to Oracle (back when there was one) and say she's the heroic community's "central nervous system" without that getting in the way of Batman's domain (though we might have a clash with Cyborg's new role in the League if DC ever actually capitalizes on his potential as the new "god of tech").

[Jim Kelly]

If I want a good detective, I'll probably get Elongated Man, Martian Manhunter or Plastic Man on the case. They can operate covertly and, unlike Batman, they aren't fussy about working in the daytime or nighttime. Batman is like that sheepdog that only works his shift during set hours and then leaves the wolf catching to someone else.

[stephens2177]

Superman coming from krypton is already SUPER compared to us,then the sun makes him even more SUPER,that simple IMO.kryptonite effects his body,so it will work on him regardless if he is powers up or not.the energy sucking or blocking things only effect his sun giving powers.

Superman is simple if you make him simple

[666MasterOfPuppets]

Eh, I got no problem with it as long as the story is good.

I dont believe in "X is too powerful" arguments. Power is a relative concept. People say Superman is over powered, but when he's fighting creatures like Darkseid, Brainiac, Imperiex, Solaris, Myx, Zod, etc, he's actually the underdog in those fights. Batman on the other hand, is smarter, stronger, and a better fighter with better resources than most of his rogues so in a lot of stories he ends up being the overpowered one; once he figures out the one gimmick the villain has, they're no longer a threat at all.

Flash, yeah, he's crazy powerful but so are a lot of his villains (like Zoom). Waid, Morrison, and Millar wrote the most powerful Flash I have ever seen and they made it work beautifully.

I do agree that Superman should be the pinnacle of raw physical power in the DCU; its the role he was created to fill and the concept is built into the central themes of the character. But just because Clark is the top of the mountain (someone has to be) doesnt mean the other big names can't do crazy high-concept stuff too. If you go by Morrison's pantheon concept, then each member of the Big 7 needs to have their own domain where they are king; the best of the best at that particular thing. Superman is the cosmic guy; he's the one who deals wth higher dimensional beings and cosmic manifestations. Diana is the one who deals with gods and mythological threats and the supernatural. Batman is the ultimate street level/noir guy. And Flash is the ultimate explorer. None of that is a threat to Clark or his standing as "best there is."

Me neither. If I were in charge of Superman, Hulk would be a freaking baby compared to him. "Oh, so you can thunderclap away a galaxy-destroying blast? That's cute."

Liked that analogy there. Each JL member has a role. And that's one of the reasons why I really don't see the problem with the religious imagery in Superman stories. I see it as only a natural thing. Some people will love him/ be in utter awe of him, some people will fear him, and some people will even adore him as a god. It's just the way the world works. And honestly, the judeo-christian overtones have been with the character from the very beginning.

It just means that though Superman still retains his "sun god" status as you've said, if some of Clark's powers are made innate to his biology he doesn't end up completely depowered on a planet with a red sun.

Pretty much. And it also lends strength to this notion of Kryptonians being a super-advanced alien race. AND the fact that he's an alien. We should see that his DNA is undecipherable, has six strands, that he's got two hearts and his blood is like gold, his eyes naturally glow... Stuff like that.

[DochaDocha]

If you go by Morrison's pantheon concept, then each member of the Big 7 needs to have their own domain where they are king; the best of the best at that particular thing.

While I see the benefits of this sort of niche assignment, I don't entirely endorse this idea, either. Of course, I don't entirely endorse the Justice League concept, either, so take my next comments with a grain or a billion of salt. Namely, if everyone has a specialty, it often means that only so-and-so can take care of fill-in-the-blank issue. I thought the specialty assignments, and its undesirable issues, were made apparent in animation quite often. If Batman was around, only he could contribute to the strategy, or else you risk making him look worthless. If there was magic, only Hawkgirl and her freakin' mace could play into the solution, otherwise she's just a weaker person who flies and hits stuff hard. And looking at the more recent films, the main JL team has a zero percent chance unless the newly-introduced character(s) step up and save the day with their unique skills. Etc.

Maybe the problem is less the idea and more the way the ideas are executed, but so far I can't say I like how the specialty assignments are done in practice.

[Stanlos]

It might get my New Gods fan card revoked but I don't necessarily believe that Supes is physically the underdog versus the New Gods characters. It is Darkseid's Omega Effect that enables him to bring Supes to his knees.

[krazijoe]

It might get my New Gods fan card revoked but I don't necessarily believe that Supes is physically the underdog versus the New Gods characters. It is Darkseid's Omega Effect that enables him to bring Supes to his knees.

The thing is with batteries is that they need to recharge or they become dormant. Remove him from his element if you want to defeat him. Not sure why no one boom tubed him into the heart of a red star...