X-force by Klye y Yost is better than x-force by REMENDER

[Galerion]

I would like to add both Remender's and Aaron's RRrrrr-cyclops HATE!!!!
The sad thing is they never dealt with Wolverines hypocrisy as certain authors did with Scott's "fall" into more drastic measures to protect mutants. I hoped Storm, Rogue, even Beast of all people would of called out wolverine especially during UA or even after the DAS storyline but nothing happened. Unless you count Axis but that was underwhelming and problematic. Poor Evan is just floating around until someone takes Apocalypse's place or find a storyline outside of clone dilema. Unlike KY's X-Force, UXF themes and events where to an extend carried by Remender in the tiles he was working for at the time for Marvel and only a few writers bothered to actually do something with the creations he made. Even now with the whole Xavier Brain storyline and Apocalypse Twins should of has some sort of ramifications in WATXM or even UXM but nothing happened. We are barely dealing with any sort of ramification that should of had the respective characters or parties involved years ago that quite recently. I do understand his "inspiration" to Claremonts use of long process storytelling but you are also talking about a different comics market and process at the time. When comparing DPS and DAS you may see where DAS failed in the long run. Remender enjoys his long arc storytelling and sadly he bit off more than he could chew. A bitter lesson every writer should learn at some point in their careers. I did hear rumours of course had his plans been allowed to continue in writing X-Men with an event called the Apocalypse Crusade concerning the Apocalypse Twins. However it is unknown who would of been involved in that story or if it would or properly dealt with anything and at least tie loose ends.

You are forgetting about hippie Angel which never actually went anywhere too.

One thing that was great though was him killing off Fantomex. It would have been a good end to the character sacrificing himself for Evan but of course that was reversed.

[DDM]

I would like to add both Remender's and Aaron's RRrrrr-cyclops HATE!!!!
The sad thing is they never dealt with Wolverines hypocrisy as certain authors did with Scott's "fall" into more drastic measures to protect mutants. I hoped Storm, Rogue, even Beast of all people would of called out wolverine especially during UA or even after the DAS storyline but nothing happened. Unless you count Axis but that was underwhelming and problematic. Poor Evan is just floating around until someone takes Apocalypse's place or find a storyline outside of clone dilema. Unlike KY's X-Force, UXF themes and events where to an extend carried by Remender in the tiles he was working for at the time for Marvel and only a few writers bothered to actually do something with the creations he made. Even now with the whole Xavier Brain storyline and Apocalypse Twins should of has some sort of ramifications in WATXM or even UXM but nothing happened. We are barely dealing with any sort of ramification that should of had the respective characters or parties involved years ago that quite recently. I do understand his "inspiration" to Claremonts use of long process storytelling but you are also talking about a different comics market and process at the time. When comparing DPS and DAS you may see where DAS failed in the long run. Remender enjoys his long arc storytelling and sadly he bit off more than he could chew. A bitter lesson every writer should learn at some point in their careers. I did hear rumours of course had his plans been allowed to continue in writing X-Men with an event called the Apocalypse Crusade concerning the Apocalypse Twins. However it is unknown who would of been involved in that story or if it would or properly dealt with anything and at least tie loose ends.

No one called out Wolverine because his X-Force was different from how Cyclops approached it. No teenagers, no innocents, no coercion, and he was actually part of the team and not calling out orders from his comfy bedroom. Also it wasn't just his team, Betsy was essentially co-leader and formed it with him and Warren. Beast and Kitty basically took a "we don't wanna know, don't bring it to the school" attitude when they found out.

Besides, Cyclops was never really called out for his X-Force either, except by butthurt Beast. In fact Logan got more heat for that version of the team (from Storm especially) than Scott did. Before Schism Cyclops was the king of "getting off Scott free".

[Psy]

Reminders X-Force was the best book ever written. Hands down.....

[Izanami]

You are forgetting about hippie Angel which never actually went anywhere too.

One thing that was great though was him killing off Fantomex. It would have been a good end to the character sacrificing himself for Evan but of course that was reversed.

I would of enjoyed Final Execution more if that was the case with Fantomex. In a way it would of come full circle similar to the Alternate Ending of 28 Days Later with Cillian Murphy's character. It would of been quite poetic. A good end to the series. Also I had trouble reading this arc since I really enjoyed Liu's take on Daken and his relationship with X-23. I have the issues sitting in my bookcase somewhere. I guess in a way this really retracted me from the story a bit. What do you think about it?
Completely forgot Hippie Angel even existed for a moment. Was waiting forever for some sort of interesting character development or at least his views and truth towards the events that transpired. How does he feel about the Apoc Twins? Quite a lost opportunity. Maybe a possible story arc similar to Born from a wish from Silent Hill 2? If you get that reference. I have to say I enjoyed KY X-Force slightly more due how close of a unit the X-books where at the time. Although these are one of the few instances I actually enjoyed Remender, I still have issues with what happened in the Atom... will shut up about that now I promise, what was going about with the whole Schism thing and UA afterwards really took away the enjoyment of this series. Had it not happened and he was allowed to continue perhaps things would of gone smoother instead of the big mess that happened later in UA and with the Fandom. Havok's speech...

No one called out Wolverine because his X-Force was different from how Cyclops approached it. No teenagers, no innocents, no coercion, and he was actually part of the team and not calling out orders from his comfy bedroom. Also it wasn't just his team, Betsy was essentially co-leader and formed it with him and Warren. Beast and Kitty basically took a "we don't wanna know, don't bring it to the school" attitude when they found out.

Besides, Cyclops was never really called out for his X-Force either, except by butthurt Beast. In fact Logan got more heat for that version of the team (from Storm especially) than Scott did. Before Schism Cyclops was the king of "getting off Scott free".

That is true. The issue I had was how Wolverine was all about not keeping secrets and the awful Schism made both sides quite intolerable when it came to who was right and who was wrong. I felt they should of been more of a consequence considering how at times Logan was written as Holier than thou. And then there is Cyclops Che Guevara phase... not sure if I want to get into that bag of cats but I am thankful we have the young Scott. Don't really want to add the horrible downfall of characterization and we are making things as we go along, Death of X. Getting back to the calling out Wolverine thing was sadly never properly dealt with as was Cyclops after Schism and AvsX. It could of been an interesting plot with both sides views of each other and the collateral damage of Evan and Nu-Angel alongside the truth of the events that transpired. I believe all we get is just small mention and a panel on cyclops side before the whole Phoenix 5 thing. Quite underwhelming. :/ At least I am happy they are both dead. They weren't as enjoyable as they used to be although I know some Cyclops fans that differ.

[MetalPsyc]

I like Kyle & Yost X-Force but I love Remender's X-Force much more.

[Carbon Based Stickler]

Remender was actually able to make Fantomex interesting, Deadpool more "real," and less cartoonish, Psylocke somethign more than a ass cheeks and a sword, and satisfactorily brought the Arch Angel thing to some sort of a good conclusion for that aspet fo the character.

Yosts X force was a good book but Remender's was next level shit

Nothing but net. For the record, I own & really like both runs, but this basically sums up everything.

[ohsnapulon5000]

love it or hate it, Remender's run on X-Force reinvigorated the X-franchise wholesale.

[Wolverine12]

I liked Remender better but let's be honest, those runs back to back spoiled us as fans. Neither were bad, both were amazing.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

Both runs had their clear faults, that just got worse as time went on...

[Wolverine12]

Both runs had their clear faults, that just got worse as time went on...

Care to elaborate on that? I thought both runs were very well done with little to complain about. I'm curious on what others didn't like.

[Ultimates]

Care to elaborate on that? I thought both runs were very well done with little to complain about. I'm curious on what others didn't like.

He can't, it's empty internet hate. This thread is ridiculous anyway: what's better, a highly praised and awarded series which had an omnibus sell out in a month vs a softly praised forgotten series? Can't blame people for empty comments when threads are started on such silly premises.

[Triniking1234]

Is Kyle+Yost's X-Force collected anywhere affordable so I check it out myself?

Remender's Secret Avengers got me into his work and I followed him into Uncanny X-Force which was pretty damn good.

It sucks that Secret Wars cut into his plans for UA and Captain Sam and he left.

[Doctor Know]

Is Kyle+Yost's X-Force collected anywhere affordable so I check it out myself?

Remender's Secret Avengers got me into his work and I followed him into Uncanny X-Force which was pretty damn good.

It sucks that Secret Wars cut into his plans for UA and Captain Sam and he left.

The KY run was collected into two deluxe hardcovers.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/07851...roduct_details

https://www.amazon.com/X-Force-Vol-2...QTB79XA3H6XHQT

Still at good price. The only things not collected in the above volumes are X-Force Messiah War (he mid part of the Messiah arc) and X-Necrosha.

The timeline of events for the KY and Remender XFs go as follow.

Messiah Complex - Introduces Hope Summers

KY X-Force vol 1

KY X-Force vol 2 + Messiah War (which happens during XF #14-16)

KY X-Force Nexrosha

Second Coming - Final part of the Messiah Trilogy and XF officially disbands, by Cyclops' orders. Wolverine keeps it going unofficially.

Remender Uncanny X-Force

Then AvX and Marvel Now XF.

[DiamondQueen]

I loved Kyle and Yost. When Angel flipped out and Archangel ripped his way...was amazing. The other was ok for me...but Otherworld was $H173

[WhySoFuriousGeorge]

I wouldn't say one run is better than the other, because they both had different strengths and weaknesses. I personally love Remender's run (mostly because I don't care for most of the cast or plotlines of K&Y's run, with the exception of Necrosha, I LOVED Necrosha), but that's just me.