Inhumans vs X-Men #1 SPOILERS

[Narasinha]

If you want a kinda logical justification about why Emma could do it: The inhumans were expecting Cyclops to be there. They were expecting him to lead the team to destroy the mist. Emma only showed them what they were already expecting to see so it was a lot easier than if she tried to show them something that was contrary to what they were believing.

That could justify it a little, for what it's worth. (and she did got a noise bleed out of it )

[Iron Fist]

If you want a kinda logical justification about why Emma could do it: The inhumans were expecting Cyclops to be there. They were expecting him to lead the team to destroy the mist. Emma only showed them what they were already expecting to see so it was a lot easier than if she tried to show them something that was contrary to what they were believing.

That could justify it a little, for what it's worth. (and she did got a noise bleed out of it )

Nose Bleeds usually imply great psychic stress, Emma wouldn't be stressed projecting Cyclops to people who apparently have no mental defences. But she would is she was psionically projecting Cyclops into the real world, we know she has telekinetic potential so it's not out of the realm of possibilities and it would explain how the Inhumans could be seeing it without having their mental blocks breached and how it was recorded.

Perfect explanation for all plot holes. Well a more reasonable one than after Emma's 'ingenius plan' she sat on an iMac and edited a video on Adobe After Effects for the media.

[Punjabi_Hitman]

Both telepathy and empathy are not fact and are not real. Usualy, when they are defined, telepathy is about thought and empathy about emotions. That's 2 distincts things. Empathy isn't a subset of telepathy.

That's how it's "usualy" defined in literature or in articles discussing the subject. But naturaly, as they are not real, people are free to come up with other definition.



Read what you yourself wrote: create illusions of her opponents' fears or wishes.. That's emotions and by your own definition that's empathy. You just sad that empaths can only read/project emotions. Show me where it is writen that Moonstar can read mind and project though, not emotions, into other people.

Marvel Wikia about Moonstar powers:
Empathic Illusion Casting
Neural Arrows
Animal Empathy
Death Sense
Resist Death
Quantum Energy Manipulation

Anyway, creating a physical item or person, that looks real and can be touched, is neither telepathy nor empthy. That's something else. In the same way, "Death Sense", "Resist Death", "Quantum Energy Manipulation" are neither telepathy or empathy but Something else.

Causing someone to hallucinate would mean they have the ability to tap into the visual cortex of the brain. I don't know how you would do that other than forcing thought into someone brain that they are seeing something that is not there. Forcing thought is Telepathy and yes people can hallucinate to the point where they can see, hear, and feel something that is not there.

Olfactory[edit]

Main articles: Phantosmia and Parosmia

Phantosmia (olfactory hallucinations), smelling an odor that is not actually there,[20] and parosmia (olfactory illusions), inhaling a real odor but perceiving it as different scent than remembered,[21] are distortions to the sense of smell (olfactory system) that, in most cases, are not caused by anything serious and usually go away on their own in time.[20] It can result from a range of conditions such as nasal infections, nasal polyps, dental problems, migraines, head injuries, seizures, strokes, or brain tumors.[20][22] Environmental exposures are sometimes the cause as well, such as smoking, exposure to certain types of chemicals (e.g., insecticides or solvents), or radiation treatment for head or neck cancer.[20] It can also be a symptom of certain mental disorders such as depression, bipolar disorder, intoxication or withdrawal from drugs and alcohol, or psychotic disorders (e.g., schizophrenia).[22] The perceived odors are usually unpleasant and commonly described as smelling burned, foul spoiled, or rotten.[20]

Tactile[edit]

Main article: Tactile hallucination

Tactile hallucinations are the illusion of tactile sensory input, simulating various types of pressure to the skin or other organs. One subtype of tactile hallucination, formication, is the sensation of insects crawling underneath the skin and is frequently associated with prolonged cocaine use.[23] However, formication may also be the result of normal hormonal changes such as menopause, or disorders such as peripheral neuropathy, high fevers, Lyme disease, skin cancer, and more.[23]

Gustatory[edit]

This type of hallucination is the perception of taste without a stimulus. These hallucinations, which are typically strange or unpleasant, are relatively common among individuals who have certain types of focal epilepsy, especially temporal lobe epilepsy. The regions of the brain responsible for gustatory hallucination in this case are the insula and the superior bank of the sylvian fissure.[24][25]

[Narasinha]

OMG! I just realized! It was Nature Girl with an Image Inducer! How cruel, even for you Emma! Ah, no, Nature Girl will be in Generation X so it wasn't her.

[yogaflame]

Both telepathy and empathy are not fact and are not real. Usualy, when they are defined, telepathy is about thought and empathy about emotions. That's 2 distincts things. Empathy isn't a subset of telepathy.

That's how it's "usualy" defined in literature or in articles discussing the subject. But naturaly, as they are not real, people are free to come up with other definition.



Read what you yourself wrote: create illusions of her opponents' fears or wishes.. That's emotions and by your own definition that's empathy. You just sad that empaths can only read/project emotions. Show me where it is writen that Moonstar can read mind and project though, not emotions, into other people.

Marvel Wikia about Moonstar powers:
Empathic Illusion Casting
Neural Arrows
Animal Empathy
Death Sense
Resist Death
Quantum Energy Manipulation

Anyway, creating a physical item or person, that looks real and can be touched, is neither telepathy nor empthy. That's something else. In the same way, "Death Sense", "Resist Death", "Quantum Energy Manipulation" are neither telepathy or empathy but Something else.

Have you ever read the actual New Mutants comics and not just their wikis? The death sense and all that are aspects of her Valkyrie powers from their Asgardian adventures.

Not once in Claremont's run did he ever call her an empath. Just because she locks in on fears/desires, doesn't mean she isn't doing that telepathically.

[yogaflame]

Here, from a freaking comic book!

[Narasinha]

Causing someone to hallucinate would mean they have the ability to tap into the visual cortex of the brain. I don't know how you would do that other than forcing thought into someone brain that they are seeing something that is not there. Forcing thought is Telepathy and yes people can hallucinate to the point where they can see, hear, and feel something that is not there.

It's kinda pointless to try to use medical definition for something that isn't even real... To my knowledge, it's not possible to project through or emotion into someone's mind so it's useless to try to explain logicaly how it works.

We are just speaking about arbitrary definition: In term of "psychic power", what is generaly accepted as being telekinesy, telepathy, empathy, pyrokinesis, clairvoyance and so on.

But anyway, hallucinations are neither telepathy nor empathy. Telepathy is putting an idee/though into the mind of someone. He is not hallucinating it, he really experience and remember it because the information was inserted into his brain.

As for empathy: extreme emotions can cause psychosis that induce hallucinations.

[Narasinha]

Have you ever read the actual New Mutants comics and not just their wikis? The death sense and all that are aspects of her Valkyrie powers from their Asgardian adventures.

So what? What's your problem with that, I don't understand... I just pointed out that she has (or had) powers not related to empathy or telepathy.

Not once in Claremont's run did he ever call her an empath. Just because she locks in on fears/desires, doesn't mean she isn't doing that telepathically.

Here, from a freaking comic book!

Again, so what? It doesn't matter what they called it: It's a question of definition. Telepathy is commonly used to refer to a specific set of habilities. Empathy is commonly used to refer to another set of habilities.

It doesn't change anything to what she did or can do. It's just a question of definition and of labels. Her powers are more related to empathy than telepathy when using the commonly accepted definitions. The wikia use the commonly accepted definitions because it's important that everyone speak the same language to understand each others.

I am not sure why you have a problem with the term "empathy" anyway. Call it what you prefer, that's fine. But does Moonstar's powers really looks like the ones of Emma, Jean, Xavier, Psylocke or does it looks like something else?

You realized that several X-Men authors confused telekinesis and telepathy? And several times? They are 2 totaly different things, but they still managed to get it wrong every so often. So what? They just used the wrong term, that's all.

Oh and you quoted Wikipedia, but you forgot the part were they say she has empathy. Or the part where they wrote "Mirage was born a mutant who formerly had empathic psi abilities to communicate with animals and to create three-dimensional images of visual concepts from within the minds of herself and others. Her most developed ability allowed her to manifest people's fears or desires as realistic illusions."

The same wikipedia page you quoted also says that "she is not a traditional telepath"

A little bit of intellectual honesty wouldn't hurt. They use indescriminately the terms telepathy, empathy and quasi-telepathy (whatever that mean) in that article

[ZNOP]

lol I see

But the Cuckoos couldn't say "We are sure that Ms Frost already broke through Medusa, BB and Triton mental defenses and is making them see what she want" because that would have given away the end of the story The "probably" is as near as the author could go without spoiling the end.

True that!

[yogaflame]

Wasn't I the one who said wikis are bs and anyone can write anything in them? I read the comics, I base my ideas on the comics. Dani is not a traditional telepath, she is a very specialized one, as I said to begin with. However, her projection abilities are based in telepathy. Hence, another telepath, like Emma, could possibly employ that specialized application.

[Heroine Addict]

In regards to psi's just being able to induce a hallucinatory state in their victims, as opposed to conjuring an actual virtual reality of sorts, complete with corporeal forms & tangible environments... I know only this for sure, it HAS been done, by:

... BUT, she didn't do it alone, she had help from:



... THAT'S RIGHT, in conjunction with the powers of:



(Coincidentally enough, wouldn't you say? ;p)

[Heroine Addict]

... during the early 2000's "Eve of Destruction" era-ending, X-over storyline:

... At this point, Xavier reveals himself and explains that Amelia Voght freed him from the cross at the start of the battle and with Jean Grey running telepathic interference, had Dazzler use her powers to create a hologram of herself (which was what Magneto "destroyed") while she took Xavier's place on the cross, using her hologram powers to impersonate Xavier. ...

Hope this provides some food for thought, and sheds some...

... light, ... on the subject.

[Rosebunse]

It's kinda pointless to try to use medical definition for something that isn't even real... To my knowledge, it's not possible to project through or emotion into someone's mind so it's useless to try to explain logicaly how it works.

We are just speaking about arbitrary definition: In term of "psychic power", what is generaly accepted as being telekinesy, telepathy, empathy, pyrokinesis, clairvoyance and so on.

But anyway, hallucinations are neither telepathy nor empathy. Telepathy is putting an idee/though into the mind of someone. He is not hallucinating it, he really experience and remember it because the information was inserted into his brain.

As for empathy: extreme emotions can cause psychosis that induce hallucinations.

I think it's fun to try and explain these things with science! It's amazing how so many of them actually do make some level of sense, while others not so much.

[FluffyCyclopsRLZ]

So, yeah. Any thoughts on why Uncle Alex is seemingly M.I.A.? I mean, he probably threw a hissy fit over Emma botching her posthumous tribute and he's incapacitated/locked up on Muir Island, right?

[Narasinha]

Nose Bleeds usually imply great psychic stress

Or that Emma saw in Black Bolt's mind what he fantasises about her (luckily Medusa doesn't know about it)

However, her projection abilities are based in telepathy. Hence, another telepath, like Emma, could possibly employ that specialized application.

Let me know when Emma start talking to ponies.