IvX #4 SPOILERS

[LoganAlpha30X33]

Mutants are fighting now because if they don't stop the cloud in two weeks every single mutant on Earth will die a horrible and painful death and the Inhumans could care less about it, and Scott died after the X-men knew that the cloud was killing mutants, months after but yet the Inhumans only moved them around but did nothing to actually stop the cloud, which is not vital to their future, Inhumans exist without the cloud so they don't actually need it to survive...the royals seem intent on just waiting it out until all of the mutants are dead, Medusa didn't seem that concerned with their health, her hope was to have them on her side but if not she didn't seem broken up at the thought of them not helping she and the Inhumans either...

[Revoirver2]

Mutants are fighting now because if they don't stop the cloud in two weeks every single mutant on Earth will die a horrible and painful death and the Inhumans could care less about it,

then why Mutant keep 2 week time line Information secret ?.
if Inhuman care less of mutant,they didn't waste their resource for beast(mutant) to find cure for m-pox and evacuate mutant before the cloud hit.

and Scott died after the X-men knew that the cloud was killing mutants, months after but yet the Inhumans only moved them around but did nothing to actually stop the cloud, which is not vital to their future, Inhumans exist without the cloud so they don't actually need it to survive...

terrigen crystall give Inhuman power to live long and prosper in isolation for millenia. and it give them a change to fight if Kree Empire ever think to mess with Attilan.

the royals seem intent on just waiting it out until all of the mutants are dead, Medusa didn't seem that concerned with their health, her hope was to have them on her side but if not she didn't seem broken up at the thought of them not helping she and the Inhumans either...

i could take that just your Assumption. let wait and see when Royal know about 2 week time limit mutant have.

[Xelossik]

The Inhuman fans look at the same panels in the same books and draw a different conclusion....

I am not sure if this is completely true.
Inhumans fans were reading Inhumans stories earlier and X-men fans were reading X-men stories.
From the beginning You will have different point of view.

[Captain Zolalnadia]

Even if we don't agree on who's right and who's wrong, can we all agree that this was probably one of the best moments in the series so far?
http://i.imgur.com/4VksmJL.jpg

[LoganAlpha30X33]

then why Mutant keep 2 week time line Information secret ?.
if Inhuman care less of mutant,they didn't waste their resource for beast(mutant) to find cure for m-pox and evacuate mutant before the cloud hit.



terrigen crystall give Inhuman power to live long and prosper in isolation for millenia. and it give them a change to fight if Kree Empire ever think to mess with Attilan.



i could take that just your Assumption. let wait and see when Royal know about 2 week time limit mutant have.

Maybe because the Inhumans views on the clouds were already very well known that they'd try to kill anyone that tried to mess with the clouds and given that it's only two weeks at most they don't exactly have time to sit down and talk about things...and remember if the Inhumans knew all about it then all they'd have to do is wait and they'd win, there was nothing pushing them even try to help mutants...the thing with Beast could more just be giving him enough so that he'd stop asking, basically just pacify him...

The Inhumans know full well that the clouds are killing mutants left and right, men women and children are dying and they're not trying to stop the clouds at all, it's practically setting up refugee camps with no guarantee of the mutants ever being able to return home...

So then they're guessing that the Kree are going to attack them without any proof...seems fine for them to fight in that situation but not for the X-men in a similar situation...

[Xelossik]

then why Mutant keep 2 week time line Information secret ?.
if Inhuman care less of mutant,they didn't waste their resource for beast(mutant) to find cure for m-pox and evacuate mutant before the cloud hit.

Marvel didn't want to show Inhumans who were helping. Most of new inhumans had Terrigenesis without Inhumans because Inhumans are somewhere but not near cloud.
Basically only in UI and ANI they did something. If You read anything else then they did nothing. You may read CW2, US, EXM, UXM, ALXM, MGaDD and more books and You won't find anything about this. Terrigen clouds will be in cities but not inhumans.
Good that city was evacuated in Mosaic right? och no... they weren't here.
They were on time and helped Ulysses? They were too late. Synapse? Too late... Mosaic? too late

Inhuman PR won with Cyclops is Hitler (from interview about IvX)
but they wasted so many resources for this that they couldn't do anything to save mutants or even help inhumans with Terrigenesis.

[butterflykyss]

Even if we don't agree on who's right and who's wrong, can we all agree that this was probably one of the best moments in the series so far?
http://i.imgur.com/4VksmJL.jpg

that was a funmy/cute moment

[DDM]

See, this is interesting to me. I think a lot of the conflict here on the board comes down to stuff like this. To some people, Medusa and the Royals have a malicious streak that is driving them. To others, they have been trying to be peaceable and compromise until pushed to a point of retaliation for what appear to be unprovoked violations of a peace treaty.

One of the things you hear a lot from the X-supporters is that the Royals have acted with disregard for the Mutants, that they could have done more but they didn't care enough to, that they being driven by base urges.

The Inhuman fans look at the same panels in the same books and draw a different conclusion, that the Inhumans (who have a lot of issues they are dealing with of their own) have taken on the extra tasks of dedicating resources to finding a cure and evacuating Mutants in danger zones and providing them with aid. That their only goal was to find a mutually beneficial option for everyone and while they weren't going to go ahead and let anyone destroy the cloud which has a vital role in their people's future it was with the understanding that they also weren't going to let it keep killing mutants in the long term. Then enter Emma Frost, manipulative psycho with an axe to grind, who convinces the mutants to be prepared for war because "My boyfriend died before anyone knew there was anything suddenly dangerous about the cloud in the first place so those bastards gotta pay!" and convinced everyone that peace only existed as a time to prepare for war. I don't think any Inhuman fan would say Storm is being malicious, but no sane person could say the same about Emma.

I wouldn't disagree with you on that, there's absolutely malice on Emma's part. That said I'd also argue Emma has had much opportunity here to be malicious, even bloodthistry, and hasn't gone beyond the agreed upon line. She might be manipulative and vengeful, but she's still letting Blackbolt live which is more than be said for how Medusa treated Scott. And expanding on this comparison to Medusa, like Emma, she has been formulating war plans during the entire peacetime truce as well. Emma and Medusa come off fairly similarly in this I think, although they're not coming from an equal place in terms of motivation and emotional response.

As for the general Inhuman response, I'd argue it's less about that they could be doing more, but more that what they were doing just simply wasn't enough. Which is self-evident as large numbers of mutants were still getting sick and dying despite any rescue efforts. At some point there had to have been a calculus on the Inhuman side, that the unrestricted progress of the cloud and resulting Nuhuman terrigeneses was worth the loss in mutant life and health. And that's what I'd say is really morally reprehensible and unacceptable.

then why Mutant keep 2 week time line Information secret ?.

Because it's too great a risk. The timeline is too tight, the X-Men can't afford any resistance to stoping the cloud. That's why they surprise attacked the key Inhumans, in order to stop any credible resistance. It's very literally life or death stakes for them.

[Iron Fist]

Because it's too great a risk. The timeline is too tight, the X-Men can't afford any resistance to stoping the cloud. That's why they surprise attacked the key Inhumans, in order to stop any credible resistance. It's very literally life or death stakes for them.

That's the dumbest aspect of this conflict though. The Inhumans are more than accomodating and wouldn't want the mutant species to die. The idea they'd hear there is a two week deadline and say "sucks to be you!" is x-fan nonsense.

He didn't fire either, he was just preparing to when Blackbolt murdered him. Scott's blasts aren't necessarily lethal even, you can count on one hand the number of people he's actually killed with them.

And "the hard way" can mean many things. When Scott said he wouldn't surrender and wouldn't stop until the other cloud was destroyed, that's the point when Medusa ordered his execution. That sent a pretty clear message to all mutants.

Cyclops's eyes dont glow and then fire, the beam is constant so when he fires he fires, there is no preparing. And you can see in his death panel he fired.

The hard way generally means doing the hard things aka fighting to the death. Either way Cyclops did a lot to show he wasn't going to stop and would pursue the cloud by taking out anyone in his way, so he was executed for it. That's still a long way from 'anyone who touches the cloud dies'

[Revoirver2]

Maybe because the Inhumans views on the clouds were already very well known that they'd try to kill anyone that tried to mess with the clouds and given that it's only two weeks at most they don't exactly have time to sit down and talk about things...and remember if the Inhumans knew all about it then all they'd have to do is wait and they'd win, there was nothing pushing them even try to help mutants...the thing with Beast could more just be giving him enough so that he'd stop asking, basically just pacify him...

again with your assumption. not every old Inhuman in attilan view terrigen cloud sacred, and if Medusa do know about 2 weeks deadline there a big possibility she will give order the cloud to be destroyed ... again with your assumption if you read Inhuman book you wil know Royal need as many Super powered people to face a threat that will come to earth, The Exctinction of Mutant Race did not work well with that agenda... haa again with your assumption it seem Mutant could not trus other.

The Inhumans know full well that the clouds are killing mutants left and right, men women and children are dying and they're not trying to stop the clouds at all, it's practically setting up refugee camps with no guarantee of the mutants ever being able to return home...

they can't stop the Cloud from roaming its within the possibility as I know Eldrac Scatter all Inhuman in Infinity, as I can see how ISO and Frank could take important position Medusa didn't recover all their big brain Inhuman. bold again with your assumption they just need to wait The Cloud to past to get back home.

how about Mutant Side. in 8 month why didn't they offer any solution to Medusa. as I know Mutant have Strom that could control Weather. Forge, Danger, Fantomex, Warlock to build some kind of Machine/device or Magik, blink, that could teleport The Cloud to Blue Moon area ?. heck they even have reality-warper as Neegasonic and Wanda Maximoff.

So then they're guessing that the Kree are going to attack them without any proof...seems fine for them to fight in that situation but not for the X-men in a similar situation...

they already have before... tell Royal about 2 week information. if they keep defending the cloud I won't defend/support them.

Marvel didn't want to show Inhumans who were helping. Most of new inhumans had Terrigenesis without Inhumans because Inhumans are somewhere but not near cloud.

if marvel didn't want to show anything why blame Inhuman ?. Royal didn't have Cerebro that could detect People with Inhuman-gene or they busy to evacuate Mutant.

Basically only in UI and ANI they did something. If You read anything else then they did nothing. You may read CW2, US, EXM, UXM, ALXM, MGaDD and more books and You won't find anything about this. Terrigen clouds will be in cities but not inhumans.

why that book must focus about Inhuman and terrigen cloud plot nonsene. they not Inhuman book.

Good that city was evacuated in Mosaic right? och no... they weren't here.
They were on time and helped Ulysses? They were too late. Synapse? Too late... Mosaic? too late

Royal didn't have cerebro. as far i know what terrigen cloud can do is public known. it easy to avoid unless you are ignorant fool.

Inhuman PR won with Cyclops is Hitler (from interview about IvX)
but they wasted so many resources for this that they couldn't do anything to save mutants or even help inhumans with Terrigenesis.

if its only just PR I think Royal will have more resource to spare. but from Infinity to IvX, Royal face problem that waste alot of Inhuman resource.

[DDM]

That's the dumbest aspect of this conflict though. The Inhumans are more than accomodating and wouldn't want the mutant species to die. The idea they'd hear there is a two week deadline and say "sucks to be you!" is x-fan nonsense.

I think realistically we'd have seen a multitude of opinions on the Inhuman side had Beast informed them, very much unlike the relatively galvanized response mutants had. The thing is any degree of resistance on their part is too much to risk for the X-Men, that's why a disabling first strike made rational sense for the mutants. You can disagree with it but the rationale is sound.

Cyclops's eyes dont glow and then fire, the beam is constant so when he fires he fires, there is no preparing. And you can see in his death panel he fired.

The hard way generally means doing the hard things aka fighting to the death. Either way Cyclops did a lot to show he wasn't going to stop and would pursue the cloud by taking out anyone in his way, so he was executed for it. That's still a long way from 'anyone who touches the cloud dies'

I just looked at the panels again and you're wrong, Scott never fired. It appeared he was about to and Medusa actually gave the execution order before that moment. In essence she had him killed because he refused to quit.

Also "the hard way" generally means exactly what it says; the more difficult route or option. And in the exchange there it obviously meant a fight. Stopping someone doesn't automatically mean killing them however, just as "the hard way" doesn't mean to the death. If you really think otherwise you must have lived a pretty bloody life to this point.

[Xelossik]

Revoirver2 :

if marvel didn't want to show anything why blame Inhuman ?. Royal didn't have Cerebro that could detect People with Inhuman-gene or they busy to evacuate Mutant.

Marvel showed that Inhumans don't help.

why that book must focus about Inhuman and terrigen cloud plot nonsene. they not Inhuman book.

They have Inhumans in the stories. Mosaic should be considered as Inhuman book.

Royal didn't have cerebro. as far i know what terrigen cloud can do is public known. it easy to avoid unless you are ignorant fool.

1 - they have Cerebro
2 - Most of new nuhumans couldn't avoid the cloud. Maybe it is not so easy as You think?
3 - Yes it is public knowledge. Public knowledge = Cyclops started war with inhumans and he is a Hitler.

if its only just PR I think Royal will have more resource to spare. but from Infinity to IvX, Royal face problem that waste alot of Inhuman resource.

Ok they have but they didn't use them.
Their actions showed that they were constantly failing with the cloud. For each book where Inhuman did anything we have 5 books where they did nothing. Terrigen Clouds are shown without Inhumans and their battleship even in Inhumans books.

and no. I don't blame them. I think that both sides are quite rational.

[Gray Lensman]

I think realistically we'd have seen a multitude of opinions on the Inhuman side had Beast informed them, very much unlike the relatively galvanized response mutants had. The thing is any degree of resistance on their part is too much to risk for the X-Men, that's why a disabling first strike made rational sense for the mutants. You can disagree with it but the rationale is sound.

That needs to be brought up more - the X-Men can't afford the time any discussion will take. Any delay could be fatal to every last one of them.

That said, I like that the Kamala knows why and that she's asking questions.

[MarvelMaster616]

I don't think this issue was bad, but it felt mostly redundant. Most of what happened was already revealed for the most part in All-New X-men #18. It felt somewhat out of order to release that before this issue. Mosaic infiltrates the X-men, O5 Cyclops finds out the truth, and an X-jet gets stolen. All that had been spoiled before the issue even came out. That said, the big addition of this issue was the end. At the very least, I think that was an important moment. I find it odd that none of the younger Racist Xenophobic Slave-Owners stopped and asked why the X-men attacked. They were just like, "Oh, the X-men attacked New Attilan? Whatever. Let's call up our friends and strike back." Now they know the details, although it feels kind of forced at this point. Like it shouldn't have been necessary for Mosaic to uncover the truth before they realized that something was very messed up here.

This whole crossover event is very poorly organized. I don't really fault the writers for that because the situation itself was so unbalanced. One side is fighting to escape total extinction. One side is fighting to avoid being excessively inconvenienced. It can't be as balanced as Civil War or even AvX. There's really no way around it at this point. I'm already quite eager for this whole event to be over with so both sides can move on.

[Revoirver2]

Revoirver2 :

Marvel showed that Inhumans don't help.

realy ?. in ANI 11 Crystall save mutant refugee that throw her birth day party as thank for helping them.

They have Inhumans in the stories. Mosaic should be considered as Inhuman book.

so. different book different story to tell. if you want book about Inhuman trying to deal with TerriCloud read Inhuman book.
if Inhuman have 10 book maybe we can see more about terrigen cloud nonsene plot.

1 - they have Cerebro
2 - Most of new nuhumans couldn't avoid the cloud. Maybe it is not so easy as You think?
3 - Yes it is public knowledge. Public knowledge = Cyclops started war with inhumans and he is a Hitler.

1. I mean machine that could detect inhuman gene.
2. the first nuhuman like kamala, inferno, flint maybe. but 1 month after Infinity ? I m sure most people can. look we have experience dealing with disaster like an active volcano. we know how to avoid it. why you can't avoid a simple cloud that can be predicted where and when it will hit.
3. Public knowledge = if you have Inhuman gene terrigen cloud will change you.

Ok they have but they didn't use them.
Their actions showed that they were constantly failing with the cloud. For each book where Inhuman did anything we have 5 books where they did nothing. Terrigen Clouds are shown without Inhumans and their battleship even in Inhumans books.

and no. I don't blame them. I think that both sides are quite rational.

what do you mean inhuman didn't use their resource.
dealing with local government, make sure Mutant and Inhuman safe take time example can be seen in ANI book Sincong arc. you forgot Royal attilan still lack of manpower

oh okay than, i can understand why X-men attack but don't like how they do it.

and i can't wait when Magneto met Mosaic again