Tom King Ranks The Batfamily By Fighting Skills

[thefiresky]

https://twitter.com/TomKingTK/status/833702769487917057

Aaaaaaannnnndddd here we go!

Ranked! (Earth 1)
1. Cassandra
2. Dick
3. Bruce
4. Damian
5. Kate
6. Helena
7. Jason
8. Duke
9. Stephanie
10. Tim



Personally, I noted that in the DC Encyclopedia, it says that Tim's Bo Staff skills are unmatched... in the world... That should at least put him ahead of DUKE! Unless this is a hand-to-hand only list.

[Alycat]

Good old King. Considering the responses he's getting I'd say it was worth it.

[SiegePerilous02]

Dick and Damian's rankings seem a bit weird, as I'd probably place Bruce and Kate above them both. Only slightly, but still.

And why is Barbara not ranked but Duke is?

[Atlanta96]

This is important.

https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/833738440739061763

I wouldn't rank the current Barbara Gordon highly in any regard. But Pre-Flashpoint, maybe. Still not as good at strategy as Tim IMO but she was formidable.

[Atlanta96]

Also, it would be nice if the 2 separate threads on this topic were merged.

[millernumber1]

This is important.

https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/833738440739061763

I wouldn't rank the current Barbara Gordon highly in any regard. But Pre-Flashpoint, maybe. Still not as good at strategy as Tim IMO but she was formidable.

To add King's text to the discussion:

"This in one-on-one, hand-to-hand, not about long term strategies, where Batman would be #1, Batgirl (Barbara) #2, Tim #3, Jason below Ace."

[millernumber1]

Most of these characters haven't shown up in Earth One, so I imagine King means "main Earth" when he says "Earth-1."

Ah. That makes sense, and is what I assumed, but it was confusing. But I don't think King was putting on his "serious continuity" hat with this tweet. Or maybe he was, and I'm just silly.

Imo he should be around Dicks level. And above Kate, Helena and Damian.

Huntress is at least traditionally part of the Batfamily, Black canary not really. If you go back to pre flashpoint Helena had Appearences in batman storylines line No Man's Land, Hush or Outlaws and a lot of smaller stories, Dinah had never a connection to the Batman franchise appart from BoP.

Good point. I always think of Dinah as a Batfamily member, but that's totally true - she's not, really, just best friends with two of them.

[The Whovian]

To add King's text to the discussion:

"This in one-on-one, hand-to-hand, not about long term strategies, where Batman would be #1, Batgirl (Barbara) #2, Tim #3, Jason below Ace."

Makes no difference to me. I assumed that's what he meant anyway.

[JBatmanFan05]

To add King's text to the discussion:

"This in one-on-one, hand-to-hand, not about long term strategies, where Batman would be #1, Batgirl (Barbara) #2, Tim #3, Jason below Ace."

I'm glad he added that because that is a key distinction for me.

[SiegePerilous02]

This is important.

https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/833738440739061763

I wouldn't rank the current Barbara Gordon highly in any regard. But Pre-Flashpoint, maybe. Still not as good at strategy as Tim IMO but she was formidable.

As one of the twitter responses said: she's got a natural eidetic memory and she was raised by one of the best cops/detectives in the city and trained by the best vigilante detective ever. She should be better at long term planning than Tim.

Still don't get why she's not on the hand-to-hand list. Now way is she inferior to Steph and Duke, and I feel like Jason (and maybe Tim) would only be ranked higher because they have the Robin cred going for them.

[Alycat]

As one of the twitter responses said: she's got a natural eidetic memory and she was raised by one of the best cops/detectives in the city and trained by the best vigilante detective ever. She should be better at long term planning than Tim.

Still don't get why she's not on the hand-to-hand list. Now way is she inferior to Steph and Duke, and I feel like Jason (and maybe Tim) would only be ranked higher because they have the Robin cred going for them.

Nah, I can't see Babs taking Jason or Tim, especially the current one. She has no feats to even prove that. Heck, I would put her below Kate and Helena as well.

[millernumber1]

As one of the twitter responses said: she's got a natural eidetic memory and she was raised by one of the best cops/detectives in the city and trained by the best vigilante detective ever. She should be better at long term planning than Tim.

Still don't get why she's not on the hand-to-hand list. Now way is she inferior to Steph and Duke, and I feel like Jason (and maybe Tim) would only be ranked higher because they have the Robin cred going for them.

Babs had (at least in post-Crisis per Batgirl Year One) some karate classes, and maybe a bit of training from Dick. Steph had training from Bruce, Cass, and Tim in fighting. Babs was beaten by a novice Huntress in Huntress Year One while she was Batgirl.

NOW, if you remember Oracle: Year One, she also has escrima training from Richard Dragon, so that might actually bump her up a lot. But current Batgirl? I don't think we've had enough shown of her pre-Oracle ability or training (or, honestly, her post-Oracle training - she just does a lot of stuff, we don't see a lot of references to her training).

Of course, current Steph is very confusing as to her training and such - closest we've got before Tec was the references to Dick sending her training materials in Batman and Robin Eternal.

[Atlanta96]

As one of the twitter responses said: she's got a natural eidetic memory and she was raised by one of the best cops/detectives in the city and trained by the best vigilante detective ever. She should be better at long term planning than Tim.

Still don't get why she's not on the hand-to-hand list. Now way is she inferior to Steph and Duke, and I feel like Jason (and maybe Tim) would only be ranked higher because they have the Robin cred going for them.

Babs was formidable, yes. But she was also about 8 years older than Tim at the time and more experienced, I believe that in time Tim would have surpassed her. Similarly to how Damian will eventually surpass almost everyone in the Family.

[The Whovian]

This is important.

https://twitter.com/tomkingtk/status/833738440739061763

I wouldn't rank the current Barbara Gordon highly in any regard. But Pre-Flashpoint, maybe. Still not as good at strategy as Tim IMO but she was formidable.

Duke wouldn't even make my top ten. He's garbage. Babs would be #10, IMO.

[PurpleGlovez]

I'm not even Tim's biggest fan but no way in hell is Duke above him; ranking Dick above Bruce is rather absurd to me as well, sorry. And lol at him saying Earth-1 when DC continuity is actually Earth-0.

I would do...

1. Bruce
2. Cassie
3. Dick
4. Damian
5. Kate
6. Tim
7. Jason
8. Helena (Bertinelli?)
9. Stephanie
10. Duke

Just because Cassie, JPV, etc. have been shown to be able to beat Bruce hand-to-hand in certain situations, doesn't mean they automatically rank above him as a fighter. Batman is on top in my opinion, no question. I'd probably put Jean Paul above Kate at least.