Wonder Woman #18 Discussion & Spoilers

[RealWonderman]

WOW. No time for more at the moment, but this may be my favorite issue. So much story and depth here!!!

[Joao]

MY HEART IS ON THE GROUND. IT'S DEAD. I'M DEAD.

This was perfect. Absolutely. The only thing I wish we'd seen was Barbara's "wrong choice" moment, since it's been told a long time ago and Rucka's version would be welcome. But that's just a detail.

This was perfect. I'm 100% sold on Cale right now. The dialogues were on point. The discussion about the gods was amazing. Cyber is more of a sidekick in her own issue, but her threat is real.

So heartbreaking. Nothing was misplaced. This is what I came for, Mr. Rucka.

And there's some explanation about the lies/truth in the twins story, have you guys noticed? "...searched far and wide for their father, who had been trapped by his evil siblings... and guarded by the wicked women their nasty relatives had brought to life to guard him... and so the two handsome princes vowed they would not rest until they freed their father... and claimed from him their inheritance, so they could spread fear and horror and despair to everyone."

That makes me confused about amazons' origin, since Castalia told Diana that they're daughters of Ares and Harmonia and Ares himself wanted to visit his daughters. What's happening? I don't know.
But the chained men seems to be Ares indeed, and the price Wonder Woman would pay to come back home is freeing him again.

[CRaymond]

damn ya'll get your comics early. my shops arent open for another 1.5 hours

[SiegePerilous02]

I flipped through this at the store yesterday, as they had it on display early (but not for sale grr.) Will be picking it up later today, but from what I saw it was heartbreaking in the best way possible. Was not expecting to see Barbara as Cheetah so soon, and was hoping she would get her own focus issue of this arc to show her transformation (maybe it's still on the table?) but it was almost way more effective this way. Love the development for Cale too, though she's still way more ruthless in the present day than she is here, so it will be interesting to see how that develops.

Next up is Circe. Yay! We should probably be expecting her to turn up in #19 as well.

And there's some explanation about the lies/truth in the twins story, have you guys noticed? "...searched far and wide for their father, who had been trapped by his evil siblings... and guarded by the wicked women their nasty relatives had brought to life to guard him... and so the two handsome princes vowed they would not rest until they freed their father... and claimed from him their inheritance, so they could spread fear and horror and despair to everyone."

That makes me confused about amazons' origin, since Castalia told Diana that they're daughters of Ares and Harmonia and Ares himself wanted to visit his daughters. What's happening? I don't know.
But the chained men seems to be Ares indeed, and the price Wonder Woman would pay to come back home is freeing him again.

This is a pretty good indication that the Ares Diana fought in Year One was not actually Ares, but his sons (and maybe Eris and some others?) in disguise. One of them says in #17 "We've already been inside her mind and couldn't find it," not that Ares himself had invaded her mind. For those who thought Ares was too generic in Year One...well, here you go. I imagine the real deal will be more subtly devious the way Rucka wrote him in his previous run.

[Dr. Poison]

I can't help but pity Veronica Cale, Dr. Cyber, and the Cheetah after reading this issue. They're all suffering from the acts of Demos and Phobos in one way or another. Dr. Cyber seems more dangerous than ever before and I love it! I hope she gets a cybernetic body with a green cape at some point. I hope we get to learn more about how Maru and Poison came to be.

[Calvinr]

I can't help but pity Veronica Cale, Dr. Cyber, and the Cheetah after reading this issue. They're all suffering from the acts of Demos and Phobos in one way or another. Dr. Cyber seems more dangerous than ever before and I love it! I hope she gets a cybernetic body with a green cape at some point. I hope we get to learn more about how Maru and Poison came to be.

This, I think Cale is still a first class B*tch regardless lol, but the position Deimos and Phobos put her in, makes you empathise with her motivations, and she's not all entirely selfish, she's loving and caring depending on the people, she's definitely more interesting now and then in Ruckas' first run, great issue today.

[AmiMizuno]

So if the guy chained up is Ares, who is Jason, now?

[Rakzo]

Decent enough. The character work is pretty solid while the build-up to the final scene where Cheetah is transformed was nicely implemented. That being said, I still dislike the current direction of Cheetah since I feel like it makes her weaker in terms of character.

Loving Evely's art on the other hand.

[millernumber1]

Really love the relationships between Diana and her friends, contrasted with Veronica and her friends and family. Even more tragically, if Diana knew about Veronica's daughter, there's no way she wouldn't help her.

[SiegePerilous02]

Decent enough. The character work is pretty solid while the build-up to the final scene where Cheetah is transformed was nicely implemented. That being said, I still dislike the current direction of Cheetah since I feel like it makes her weaker in terms of character.

Loving Evely's art on the other hand.

I'm not so sure. She is still way more fleshed out here than she ever was in the New 52, so I think she is a much stronger character. She lacks the ruthless creepy edge of Perez's version, but that may be an inevitable consequence of having them be friends and replacing Julia. But Deimos and Phobos say that the decision was hers and made the wrong one, they just manipulated events for Diana to not intervene. That still gives Barbara plenty of agency for the curse she wound up in. Even Perez's Minerva was more callous than outright evil, even after she was driven insane by being the Cheetah.

[Frontier]

I feel like we still really need to see Barbara make the actual choice to become Cheetah, because jumping to the aftermath still felt abrupt without enough build-up as to why she would make the decision.

There's been all this setup that there's a darker side to her, but with what we've been shown I still have a hard time buying her becoming Cheetah or being this person who secretly craves power like Diana's as other characters have alluded to. The way she responded to Diana showing up makes it seem like she chose to become Cheetah out of depseration rather then as a conscious choice.

Heh. Ares is still the overarching villain even when he hasn't even really been as involved as we were led to believe .

[Nyssane]

I feel like we still really need to see Barbara make the actual choice to become Cheetah, because jumping to the aftermath still felt abrupt without enough build-up as to why she would make the decision.

I loved the issue, but this was the one part that did irk me. I wish we got to see Barbara Ann becoming the Cheetah instead of just the aftermath. We already know the ritual was somewhat different since Barb's aide isn't there (and he was a pretty big part of the character becoming Cheetah back in the Perez days).

Heh. Ares is still the overarching villain even when he hasn't even really been as involved as we were led to believe .

They're definitely aiming for the "big bad" status for Ares, which is preferable for me over arch-nemesis role.

As for my other thoughts, I didn't really like Deimos and Phobos threatening Cale with possible rape (unless I just read that scene the wrong way). But good lord, Bilquis Evely is quickly becoming one of my favorite artists. Loved Veronica Cale dueling with her own agenda and the monstrous things she's doing. I was a little disappointed Cyber didn't get much spotlight considering the solicit had sort of implied it would showcase her, but whatevs.

[K. Jones]

I feel like we still really need to see Barbara make the actual choice to become Cheetah, because jumping to the aftermath still felt abrupt without enough build-up as to why she would make the decision.

There's been all this setup that there's a darker side to her, but with what we've been shown I still have a hard time buying her becoming Cheetah or being this person who secretly craves power like Diana's as other characters have alluded to. The way she responded to Diana showing up makes it seem like she chose to become Cheetah out of depseration rather then as a conscious choice.

Heh. Ares is still the overarching villain even when he hasn't even really been as involved as we were led to believe .

Barbara making 'the choice' is an interesting thing to depict, just because we're not actually sure wherein she made the choice. I mean, she definitely probably made the choice to "step into some god altar chamber" or something to explore it, right? But did she choose to become the bride of Urzkartaga? Or did he basically god-rape her? I'm interested in how it played out, specifically, as an allegory for, well, consent basically. But I do really like that she essentially is a victim of the "curiosity killed the cat" adage. Apropos.

[Dr. Poison]

Barbara making 'the choice' is an interesting thing to depict, just because we're not actually sure wherein she made the choice. I mean, she definitely probably made the choice to "step into some god altar chamber" or something to explore it, right? But did she choose to become the bride of Urzkartaga? Or did he basically god-rape her? I'm interested in how it played out, specifically, as an allegory for, well, consent basically. But I do really like that she essentially is a victim of the "curiosity killed the cat" adage. Apropos.

I'm thinking that Urzkartaga raped Barbara otherwise why would Cheetah accuse Diana of not coming when summoned? If Barbara had willingly given herself over to Urz, there wouldn't have been any need to try and summon Diana.

[SiegePerilous02]

It's possible she consented to the ritual, but didn't try to call Diana until after she had become the Cheetah and realized the many drawbacks to her new "marriage"? And then her condition deteriorated even more so before Diana showed up. We also see those two dead guys...did she kill them before (as part of the ritual) or after?

The ambiguity here is pretty interesting, and I think it was deliberate. Rucka wants us to wonder about her a bit, because despite her many positive qualities, Barbara can still have shady aspects to her. She is described as "controversial" in that one Year One issue. At the same time, if she is "raped" by Urzkartaga and fate has punished her for seeking out knowledge, she becomes even more of a tragic mortal-turned-monster like Medusa.