Thread Drift: Will One More Day ever be reversed?

[Metamorphosis]

The problem here is that not everyone cares enough about the marriage to stop reading Spider-man and many people actually liked the fact that it's gone. "Everyone" is not going to stop reading because of this or it would have already happened.

Going by the slipping sales, I'd say plenty of people cared enough to not read it anymore after the continuity-nuking of OMD.

You don't have to be a marriage fanatic to resent Marvel flushing comic continuity down the toilet, with a "hey, get over it" attitude. Why get invested in any storyline they do?

But most here chalk up the high sales around 2007 to Civil War. So there you go.

It would have to be a regime change where every single person in change at marvel and Disney left at the same time. That's probably not going to happen, much in the same way one person probably won't win the lottery, be struck by lighting, get elected president, and win the WWE Championship belt all on the same day.

Or word could just come down that they want it done.

Making it seem like this vastly insurmountable, most impossible thing in the universe to have happen, is quite laughable. But I guess it makes people parroting this stuff feel better.

Technically yes, it could happen, but it's not worth wasting time talking about.

So why waste time talking about it?

[Vortex85]

Personally, OMD was probably the biggest joke of the comic industry. It was a slap in the face to long-term fans and those that have any sort of intellect. However, it happened and there is nothing we can do about it. It's a done deal. With that being said, can it be reversed and can we have a married Peter Parker again? Oh hell yeah we can. The biggest problem is that readers kept reading the book after OMD. If everyone actually put their wallets to where their mouths were, then MJ and Peter would have had a second honeymoon in a few months. Simple as that.

If everyone stopped buying ASM and made it known that it was because of OMD, then there there is a chance it could be reversed. The way things are going it's probably not going to be reversed, unless there is a regime change at Marvel. Personally I think that's what should happen, but what I think should happen and will happen are in two different spectrums.

Either way, do I think OMD will be reversed anytime soon? Nope. Can it be reversed? Yup. Just need enough people to stop buying the book.

1) That would never happen
2) There are a million ways to change directions or stir things up intead of reinstating the marriage to increase sales

The sales argument has to go. Restoring the marriage is not about sales, sales can be up or down regardless. It has to be about what provides a more satisfying romantic setting for Peters ongoing adventures. Is it the drama of life between two key characters over the decades in the most hightened / highest stakes relationship possible, or is it trading characters for the sake of variety on an endless sea of failed relationships that are mostly forgotten and buried in obscurity from one generation of readers to the next?

[MetalWoman]

Going by the slipping sales, I'd say plenty of people cared enough to not read it anymore after the continuity-nuking of OMD.

Amazing Spider-man sold around 49,000 in the early 2000 before JMS started writing the series, and that is in the days before trades and digital sales. So by those numbers OMD actually helped the book.

[WebLurker]

ASM /main universe. Meaning the "mainstream version". I think there is room for RYW or Spider-Girl or whatever where they are married, but as we already talked about in Marvel's eyes other rules apply for 616 version.
Whether that is smart or not is debateable.

Can't say I like it, but that makes sense.

[Metamorphosis]

Amazing Spider-man sold around 49,000 in the early 2000 before JMS started writing the series, and that is in the days before trades and digital sales. So by those numbers OMD actually helped the book.

I don't know about that, a regular issue of ASM now sits at an average of 60k in retailer orders when it's not boosted by myriad sales tricks.

Not much more currently than it was when Mackie was writing.

[Conn Seanery]

Personally, OMD was probably the biggest joke of the comic industry. It was a slap in the face to long-term fans and those that have any sort of intellect. However, it happened and there is nothing we can do about it. It's a done deal. With that being said, can it be reversed and can we have a married Peter Parker again? Oh hell yeah we can. The biggest problem is that readers kept reading the book after OMD. If everyone actually put their wallets to where their mouths were, then MJ and Peter would have had a second honeymoon in a few months. Simple as that.

If everyone stopped buying ASM and made it known that it was because of OMD, then there there is a chance it could be reversed. The way things are going it's probably not going to be reversed, unless there is a regime change at Marvel. Personally I think that's what should happen, but what I think should happen and will happen are in two different spectrums.

Either way, do I think OMD will be reversed anytime soon? Nope. Can it be reversed? Yup. Just need enough people to stop buying the book.

Did it occur to you at all that a good chunk of those people you're pretending to represent still buy the book because, despite OMD, they actually still enjoy it? I realize the hate-readers are often more vocal in threads like these, but it's wrong to assume they're the majority of the comic-buying readership just because they've gathered together in their bubble.

[Metamorphosis]

Did it occur to you at all that a good chunk of those people you're pretending to represent still buy the book because, despite OMD, they actually still enjoy it? I realize the hate-readers are often more vocal in threads like these, but it's wrong to assume they're the majority of the comic-buying readership just because they've gathered together in their bubble.

Is it really right to assume the non-"hate" readers you're talking about represent a majority of opinion on the topic?

[MetalWoman]

Is it really right to assume the non-"hate" readers you're talking about represent a majority of opinion on the topic?

Considering that Amazing Spider-man has remained one of Marvel's top selling comic books, if not the top selling comic book, in the 10 years after OMD, then yes, it is same to assume that the majority of readers either like Peter as single, or more likely do not care one way or the other.

[Metamorphosis]

Considering that Amazing Spider-man has remained one of Marvel's top selling comic books, if not the top selling comic book, in the 10 years after OMD, then yes, it is same to assume that the majority of readers either like Peter as single, or more likely do not care one way or the other.

But that's all it is, assuming.

If the book measurably had a bigger buying audience before OMD, is it "safe to assume" that a chunk of the readers left in droves because of Marvel's approach with OMD?

[Conn Seanery]

Is it really right to assume the non-"hate" readers you're talking about represent a majority of opinion on the topic?

On the subject of the comic-buying audience still buying ASM I'd say it is. I have to believe that even the majority of hate-readers (that don't fancy themselves as Sith lords) aren't going to stick around for the long-haul to read something that upsets them month after month. Not saying it never happens, but I'd say the book's continued success has more to do with people who enjoy it than don't.

[MetalWoman]

ASM sales have varied widely both before and after OMD, with some periods after OMD far outselling some periods before OMD. And that is only looking at the direct market sales, which are not as important today as they were before OMD. So it is not safe to assume readers left in droves because of OMD. And again, ASM has remained one of Marvel's top selling comic books for the years after OMD, so obviously most fans do not care or approve of OMD.

But that's all it is, assuming.

If the book measurably had a bigger buying audience before OMD, is it "safe to assume" that a chunk of the readers left in droves because of Marvel's approach with OMD?

[Lee]

It's not odd at all; I'm a huge fan of the Raimi movie trilogy and the Ultimate Spider-Man comic series, which were also the first pieces of material I was exposed to, incidentally.

For what it's worth, I do read the RYV series and seeing the duo as a family is one of the things I like best about it.

I'd be open to tracking down some pre-OMD comics (and have got a few on my "to read" list). If I liked them, that's great.

However, I have liked nothing of the post-OMD ones I've read. Also, beyond the fact that Spider-Man and Mary Jane aren't together in those stories anymore (remember, USM fan, so huge deal breaker), I very much do not like where Dan Slott has taken the series (SSM, Parker Industries, and the like). In all honesty, none of the stuff I like best about Spider-Man are really represented in ASM anymore.

Let's talk Star Trek: The Next Generation.

"Season 5 ruined everything. First 4 seasons were the best. Season 5 was a mistake. Terrible decisions. Man, Season 5. Can't believe what they did in Season 5. Everything Season 5 onwards was awful. Terrible. Seasons 1-4 were way better. They really blundered with Season 5. They should've gone back to how it was in Season 4. Because Season 5 sheesh. Season 5 lead to Season 6 and Season 7. Wow. Terrible Seasons. I hate Season 5. What was the point of Season 5? The first 4 seasons were the best. God. Talk about screwing the pooch. Season 6 really sucked too. Everything since Season 5 really. Oh for the halcyon days of Seasons 3 and 4. They really knew what they were doing with Season 4."

Whoa! Pretty strong opinions from me, huh?

But if I then said:

"I haven't actually watched Star Trek: The Next Generation, other than six episodes of Season 7 which I didn't like. But I love Deep Space Nine."

That's pretty weird isn't it? Hard to take my opinion on Star Trek: The Next Generation seriously.

[Metamorphosis]

Let's talk Star Trek: The Next Generation.

"Season 5 ruined everything. First 4 seasons were the best. Season 5 was a mistake. Terrible decisions. Man, Season 5. Can't believe what they did in Season 5. Everything Season 5 onwards was awful. Terrible. Seasons 1-4 were way better. They really blundered with Season 5. They should've gone back to how it was in Season 4. Because Season 5 sheesh. Season 5 lead to Season 6 and Season 7. Wow. Terrible Seasons. I hate Season 5. What was the point of Season 5? The first 4 seasons were the best. God. Talk about screwing the pooch. Season 6 really sucked too. Everything since Season 5 really. Oh for the halcyon days of Seasons 3 and 4. They really knew what they were doing with Season 4."

Whoa! Pretty strong opinions from me, huh?

But if I then said:

"I haven't actually watched Star Trek: The Next Generation, other than six episodes of Season 7 which I didn't like. But I love Deep Space Nine."

That's pretty weird isn't it? Hard to take my opinion on Star Trek: The Next Generation seriously.

And yet he's still not wrong.

[Dan Slott]

But that's all it is, assuming.

If the book measurably had a bigger buying audience before OMD, is it "safe to assume" that a chunk of the readers left in droves because of Marvel's approach with OMD?

By that "logic" droves of them came back during the Big Time run (and maybe more than on Superior). Guess Spider-Man readers are Spider-Man readers married OR unmarried OR indifferent to the marital status altogether. Go figure.

Considering that ASM has been Marvel's top selling Marvel U title for some time, it's kind of hard to gauge how much an impact the rabidly passionate anti-OMD/pro-Marriage crowd is. They're certainly vocal, outspoken, and prolific posters online. The handfuls of them that zealously post ritualistically, multiple times a day here and on a few select other boards do make their voices heard. But it's hard to step back and ask how many of them are-or-aren't buying the book. Many of them do seem to keep up to date with all the goings on-- and I'd hate to think that they'd be doing something that (in spirit) their hero Spider-Man would never do-- illegally download/steal comics. (Remember, in the books, even Spidey would web down some change to the news vendor before webbing and yanking up a copy of the Daily Bugle-- even on days when Jonah was slamming him.)

Much like our political elections, it's hard to gauge the votes of voters who didn't show up to the polls. For Marvel, that's the register. If, like Metomorphosis/Cheesedique suggests, droves of Spider-Man fans left, logically wouldn't they have left at greater numbers than other Marvel franchises? Wouldn't titles like X-MEN or AVENGERS move up into the top MU spot?

Conversely, it IS easy to gauge who votes AT the register. If those pro-Marriage/pre-OMD readers wanted to do more than complain over and over again online-- if they REALLY wanted to take action and make their voices be heard, wouldn't they do that by supporting titles that reflected their tastes? Wouldn't they be trying to send a clear message to Marvel by buying and spending more of their energy promoting things like the MR. & MRS. SPIDER-MAN stories in the SPIDER-MAN FAMILY specials? Or SPIDER-GIRL? Or RENEW YOUR VOWS? Wouldn't those droves and droves of voices make a concerted effort to get those numbers WAY up?

Or maybe those who either aren't so invested in those causes-- or, more likely, are ambivalent to them-- are a strong enough voice to keep ASM as the best performing MU title? Just a thought.

[Spidercide]

By that "logic" droves of them came back during the Big Time run (and maybe more than on Superior). Guess Spider-Man readers are Spider-Man readers married OR unmarried OR indifferent to the marital status altogether. Go figure.

Considering that ASM has been Marvel's top selling Marvel U title for some time, it's kind of hard to gauge how much an impact the rabidly passionate anti-OMD/pro-Marriage crowd is. They're certainly vocal, outspoken, and prolific posters online. The handfuls of them that zealously post ritualistically, multiple times a day here and on a few select other boards do make their voices heard. But it's hard to step back and ask how many of them are-or-aren't buying the book. Many of them do seem to keep up to date with all the goings on-- and I'd hate to think that they'd be doing something that (in spirit) their hero Spider-Man would never do-- illegally download/steal comics. (Remember, in the books, even Spidey would web down some change to the news vendor before webbing and yanking up a copy of the Daily Bugle-- even on days when Jonah was slamming him.)

Much like our political elections, it's hard to gauge the votes of voters who didn't show up to the polls. For Marvel, that's the register. If, like Metomorphosis/Cheesedique suggests, droves of Spider-Man fans left, logically wouldn't they have left at greater numbers than other Marvel franchises? Wouldn't titles like X-MEN or AVENGERS move up into the top MU spot?

Conversely, it IS easy to gauge who votes AT the register. If those pro-Marriage/pre-OMD readers wanted to do more than complain over and over again online-- if they REALLY wanted to take action and make their voices be heard, wouldn't they do that by supporting titles that reflected their tastes? Wouldn't they be trying to send a clear message to Marvel by buying and spending more of their energy promoting things like the MR. & MRS. SPIDER-MAN stories in the SPIDER-MAN FAMILY specials? Or SPIDER-GIRL? Or RENEW YOUR VOWS? Wouldn't those droves and droves of voices make a concerted effort to get those numbers WAY up?

Or maybe those who either aren't so invested in those causes-- or, more likely, are ambivalent to them-- are a strong enough voice to keep ASM as the best performing MU title? Just a thought.

The flaws in this logic are too numerous to count.

2016

Clone Conspiracy Volume 1 #1: A brand new #1 issue for a big event hyped for months on CBR, Newsarama and other sites, including social media, Free Comic Book day and having been set up since early in Volume 4 of ASM almost a whole year before. It promised the return of multiple dead figures including Gwen Stacy (still somewhat hot in the public consciousness due to Emma Stone’s performance in ASM 1-2)

Estimated sales according to Comichron: 90,285

2002, when dedicated comic book sites were in their infancy if they existed at all, where social media wasn’t a thing and issues weren’t hyped as much as they are now unless they are a big event.


Amazing Spider-Man Volume 2: #40: A normal issue of Amazing Spider-Man...with no variants...


Estimated sales according to Comichron: 97,298


2003, see above

Amazing Spider-Man Volume 2 #55: Another normal issue of ASM with no variants.

Estimated sales according to Comichron: 95,074