Unworthy Thor #5 SPOILERS... the whisper concludes

[JKtheMac]

To those of you contending that the whisper makes sense - how do you explain the moment from New Avengers #32 mentioned in this thread?

It isn't a Thor comic for a start! That's quite an important issue. You can't expect everything to line up across every comic ever. Not even Thor comics hold true to themselves over time.

[JKtheMac]

Can you be more specific? I've been reading Thor for over 35 years and I don't know what you're talking about when you say this.

I have had the argument too many times in these forums to go over all the issues all over again. This comes up constantly in these arguments. There have been at least four retcons and several smaller shifts. One day I will put the notes together and make a website because I love these little inconsistencies. They are what makes following Thor fun for me.

[JKtheMac]

Having re read this discussion I've realised with even more clarity how dissapointed and sad reading a marvel book has been making me since siege


That's not good when I think about it especially when I'm supposed to be enjoying this stuff


I wonder why that is marvel

It might be time to stop. Why read something you are not enjoying?

[Shinglepants]

3. In New Avengers (2015) #32, Thor was wielding a Mjolnir from an alternate dimension Thor that basically said 'If you are unworthy, you can wield this hammer'. But when Odinson and Hyperion fought the Beyonders, he suddenly couldn't lift that hammer anymore and he smiled, realizing that he was once more worthy.

So whatever Gorr said to Thor no longer hampered the ability of Odinson to lift Mjolnir. And he certainly should be able to lift it now and should not be still moping about not being worthy when he became worthy again in New Avengers #32.

I guess that is assuming that Hickman's Secret Wars didn't come along and immediately wipe out his own story in regards to Thor? Like it did with Cap, Tony etc. Hickman essentially rendered his own work irrelevant with SW?

Which makes no sense, because Hickman already resolved Thor being worthy again at the end of his run. So Aaron is totally ignoring what Hickman did and doesn't want to follow continuity. Wonder how he would feel if another writer did the same to his work?

One could argue it was not Hickman's story to conclude. Aaron was building to this from the start and was also the writer of OS don't forget. Another writer doesn't get to come in and make a major status quo change to somebody else's character before they're done with them?

[HaveAtThee]

Seems like the reasoning is a lazy, forced explanation. Aaron happily ignores his own continuity within his own series.



Thor himself was revealing some self-doubt in the climactic battle against Gorr and the God-Bomb.



Both King Thor and Present Thor again conversing on the subject, yet still able to wield Mjolnir.

But apparently a post-hypnotic suggestion from Nick Fury about Gorr's desire to rid the universe of gods is enough to unleash a torrent of self-doubt from Thor to make him unworthy? I bet a middle school student could come up with a better story.

[JKtheMac]

BTW In the New Avengers issue I was arguing even back then, and several times since whenever this comes up that worthiness is not a binary opposite. I am pretty sure I couldn't wield either hammer for example. Just because you are not unworthy does not make you worthy. I know for a fact Hickman checked with Aaron because I have listened to interviews and this wasnt a big issue. Hickman wasn't making him worthy. Can you imagine a writer not checking with the person that is in control of the character? Or at the very least the editorial team.

[bloodyarts]

Good job, @HaveAtThee! Aaron literally contradicted himself, and proved that neither he or Marvel had any clue whatsoever what Fury whispered to Thor and just decided to wrap it up, for better or worse.
What a crappy way to set up Jane Foster Thor, who is actually a good character in her own right.

Nothing anyone could ever say should be enough to make Thor unworthy. That's for Mjolnir to judge; not Fury or Gorr.

[kevlon]

Which makes no sense, because Hickman already resolved Thor being worthy again at the end of his run. So Aaron is totally ignoring what Hickman did and doesn't want to follow continuity. Wonder how he would feel if another writer did the same to his work?

There are certain writers on Marvel's payroll that do this all the time and seemingly do not care. It's almost become acceptable to not follow continuity.

[JKtheMac]

Seems like the reasoning is a lazy, forced explanation. Aaron happily ignores his own continuity within his own series.



Thor himself was revealing some self-doubt in the climactic battle against Gorr and the God-Bomb.



Both King Thor and Present Thor again conversing on the subject, yet still able to wield Mjolnir.

But apparently a post-hypnotic suggestion from Nick Fury about Gorr's desire to rid the universe of gods is enough to unleash a torrent of self-doubt from Thor to make him unworthy? I bet a middle school student could come up with a better story.

Sorry this makes no sense at all. What exactly are you trying to say is inconsistent here?

[Sensational C]

If Gorr was right, then would Odinson's original disliking for the new Thor be that she was setting herself for failure by becoming a god, mixed with his then jealousy and scorn? Also, his blessing for using his Thor name was him hoping Thor could prove Gorr wrong, although the main reason will always be that Mjlonir chose her and did new tricks for Jane exclusively.

[JKtheMac]

If Gorr was right, then would Odinson's original disliking for the new Thor be that she was setting herself for failure by becoming a god, mixed with his then jealousy and scorn? Also, his blessing for using his Thor name was him hoping Thor could prove Gorr wrong, although the main reason will always be that Mjlonir chose her and did new tricks for Jane exclusively.

Not many new tricks. I have been checking back and Mjolnor has been used by Thor to swerve around and knock out multiple foes before Jane. You could argue some of the vaguely directed teleporting tricks it often did are analogous to the seek and find that it did recently, so that just leaves shape shifting and releasing the storm, which it is possible are only happening since Freyja looked at the hammer askew and decided to change something about it.

[HaveAtThee]

Sorry this makes no sense at all. What exactly are you trying to say is inconsistent here?

During the God Butcher arc (the God Bomb climax), Thor in those scans is going through self-doubt brought upon by Gorr (which, IMO, was never explained well). It's Aaron's way of injecting his atheism into the story, questioning whether or not the gods of the universe justifiably exist. Problem with that story was Gorr's rather bland characterization. There was never anything that showed gods doing anything abhorrent toward their "flock" as an example that would give credence to Gorr's hatred. Anyway, I'm getting sidetracked.

That scan shows Thor consciously doubting himself based on Gorr's outward hatred of the gods. So why is it that Nick Fury's whisper gets Thor to suddenly lose his worthiness, when during a battle with Gorr himself he's questioning if Gorr is right?

[Hypestyle]

so what does all of this lead to anyway? Who is "War Thor"?

What happens to Odinson now? Can he still use his axe?

[The Cool Thatguy]

During the God Butcher arc (the God Bomb climax), Thor in those scans is going through self-doubt brought upon by Gorr (which, IMO, was never explained well). It's Aaron's way of injecting his atheism into the story, questioning whether or not the gods of the universe justifiably exist. Problem with that story was Gorr's rather bland characterization. There was never anything that showed gods doing anything abhorrent toward their "flock" as an example that would give credence to Gorr's hatred. Anyway, I'm getting sidetracked.

That scan shows Thor consciously doubting himself based on Gorr's outward hatred of the gods. So why is it that Nick Fury's whisper gets Thor to suddenly lose his worthiness, when during a battle with Gorr himself he's questioning if Gorr is right?

Well, it's pretty self evident. What has Thor ever done for mortals? Other than, ya know, save their lives, helped found and support their elite team of heroes, serve as a medical doctor...

Well, besides him. I mean, has Herc ever saved the world? And Neptune, what's he ever done for Atlantis? Besides banishing Set.

[ArthurCurry]

Well, it's pretty self evident. What has Thor ever done for mortals? Other than, ya know, save their lives, helped found and support their elite team of heroes, serve as a medical doctor...

Stop asking good questions. Just give Marvel your $5 for an incoming #1 and be a Jason Aaron apologist or he'll hold your mouth open and shovel a mound of "you just don't get my plan...it's totally been planned out since the beginning" down your throat.