Willow Wilson, creator of Ms Marvel, is PISSED OFF re: X-Men Gold

[JasonEsta]

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Ms. Marvel Creator Comments On X-Men Gold Controversy

Jamie Lovett-*04/09/2017

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G. Willow Wilson, the co-creator of*Marvel Comics’ Kamala Khan, a.k.a.*Ms. Marvel*has joined the conversation concerning*X-Men*Gold*#1 controversy around the artwork of Ardian Syaf.

The controversy is largely based on Syaf placing a reference to a controversial verse from the Quran on Colossus’s shirt in a panel from*X-Men Gold*#1 that some, in particular to readers in Syaf’s home country of Indonesia, feel carries an anti-Semitic and anti-Christian message.

Wilson, who is a Muslim, took to*her website*to write a post clarifying what the verse in question really means. Be warned that Wilson used some colorful language in her explanation:

“This verse is subject to a truly fantastical amount of bullshittery in the modern era. And that bullshittery takes on a particular flavor depending on the agenda of whoever is translating the verse. Keep in mind that 75% of Muslims are non-native speakers of Arabic (I’m one of them), and of that 75%, most know a few phrases of Arabic at most; just enough to be able to perform the five daily prayers, plus some tangentially related religious terminology (I know a bit more). To put it more simply, the vast majority of Muslims around the world do not read the Quran in the original Arabic. They read an interpretation rendered into their local language. And this is where the bullshittery starts.

The meaning of a holy text becoming lost or altered in translation is a problem that many world religions face. Another example would be that most Christians cannot read the Bible in its original Biblical Hebrew or Biblical Aramaic, and there exist several different modern translations.

Up Next:*Marvel Releases Statement On Controversial X-Men Gold Art

Wilson continues:

“Apparently, the Indonesian translation of 5:51 reads something like this: “Oh you who believe, take not the Jews and the Christians as leaders/advisors.” (I don’t speak or read Indonesian, so I am going off the explanations of others and stuff I have been able to find online.) The reason Syaf referenced this verse is because (apparently) he has been protesting a Christian governor in his province; a governor who has been accused of blasphemy and/or corruption and/or making fun of this particular verse of the Quran, depending on who you ask.”

Wilson goes into more detail on the how the word actually has a very specific meaning from a particular point in history and really means none of the things that Syaf’s cause or most other causes claim it does.*The entire post is educational and absolutely worth a read.

In conclusion, Wilson squarely denounces Syaf and whatever he was trying to achieve.

This is all to say that Ardian Syaf can keep his garbage philosophy. He has committed career suicide; he will rapidly become irrelevant. But his nonsense will continue to affect the scant handful of Muslims who have managed to carve out careers in comics. From what I can deduce off of Facebook, it appears he is trying to claim the Charlie Hebdo defense…ie, he doesn’t mean anything by it; we just don’t understand the nuance and subtly of the local bigotry. Much good may it do him. Goodbye, Ardian Syaf. We hardly knew ye, which is just as well.

Can't embed tweets but heres a good one
https://twitter.com/GWillowWilson/st...89014970269697

[AbnormallyNormal]

Charlie Hebdo defense....? That deserves a bit more elaboration.

Anyway, I'm glad other muslims in comics are trying to push back against the intense islamophobic assault which has been whipped up re: this controversy. I think she is being far too harsh on Syaf but I've already explained my personal position on this

[Gray Lensman]

A Muslim is much like a Christian in the following sense - whether or not they are a decent person or a complete scummer often depends on the person in question. But the same can be said for people of any, or no faith.

[lollie_poppy]

I have to be honest. What this artist did was wrong, but this hidden messages were his political beliefs, even if in his country they are very entagled with religion, they were mostly political. He can express them although not in this way, it was inappropiate, the X-men belong to Marvel not to him, he should have used social media to do it or make his own comics about it.

But then again hasn't Wilson who writes MS. MArvel use the comics to express his political points of views too? Aren't a lot of creator using the characters they don't own in comics to express their own political point of views regarding actual stuff?I've seen a lot of Anti-trump things in Marvel comics tbh.

I think in both caes is wrong.

[Huntsman Spider]

Charlie Hebdo defense....? That deserves a bit more elaboration.

Anyway, I'm glad other muslims in comics are trying to push back against the intense islamophobic assault which has been whipped up re: this controversy. I think she is being far too harsh on Syaf but I've already explained my personal position on this

I'll try. The "Charlie Hebdo defense," as it were, basically amounts to, "We're entitled to say offensive things about people whose cultures and faiths and what-not we don't really view as worthy of respect or consideration equal to our own because free speech." Yes, free speech gives you the right to say horrible things about other people, but rights are a power that also comes with great responsibility to not be abused, and even so, it doesn't grant legal protection from others' reactions to what you say, like for example firing or boycotting you for talking (and acting) like a bigot. However, it's also not a license for retaliatory violence, as nearly every government has laws against assault, murder, vandalism, other destruction of property, and anything else that could cause harm to people and you will be punished by those laws regardless of how offended you feel about what somebody said to or about you should you choose to respond in ways that cause harm or even death. To sum it up in somewhat shorter words, "the right to speak doesn't entitle you to be a bigot and the right to react to bigotry doesn't entitle you to get violent."

[LocoSteve]

But then again hasn't Wilson who writes MS. MArvel use the comics to express his political points of views too?

Not to this level.

[Confuzzled]

But then again hasn't Wilson who writes MS. MArvel use the comics to express his political points of views too? Aren't a lot of creator using the characters they don't own in comics to express their own political point of views regarding actual stuff?I've seen a lot of Anti-trump things in Marvel comics tbh.

The difference is Wilson ingrains messages in her stories that seek to protect religious minorities in the US from discrimination. Syaf ingrained symbols in X-Men: Gold #1 that only served to vilify the minorities in his own country (Indonesia).

[AbnormallyNormal]

I'll try. The "Charlie Hebdo defense," as it were, basically amounts to, "We're entitled to say offensive things about people whose cultures and faiths and what-not we don't really view as worthy of respect or consideration equal to our own because free speech." Yes, free speech gives you the right to say horrible things about other people, but rights are a power that also comes with great responsibility to not be abused, and even so, it doesn't grant legal protection from others' reactions to what you say, like for example firing or boycotting you for talking (and acting) like a bigot. However, it's also not a license for retaliatory violence, as nearly every government has laws against assault, murder, vandalism, other destruction of property, and anything else that could cause harm to people and you will be punished by those laws regardless of how offended you feel about what somebody said to or about you should you choose to respond in ways that cause harm or even death. To sum it up in somewhat shorter words, "the right to speak doesn't entitle you to be a bigot and the right to react to bigotry doesn't entitle you to get violent."

That makes very little sense to me though. Isn't the entire movement Syaf belongs to all a reaction against what Indonesians/Jakartans consider to have been an abuse of free speech by this Christian-Chinese politician? So if anything Syaf is the one saying free speech has limits and shouldn't be exercised willy-nilly even at the expense of producing great religious offense to the majority.

Although yes there is for sure the irony, many of the same people who despise "SJW culture" are of course super pro censorship when it comes to promotion of Islamic political messages

[JustAnotherFan]

I have to be honest. What this artist did was wrong, but this hidden messages were his political beliefs, even if in his country they are very entagled with religion, they were mostly political. He can express them although not in this way, it was inappropiate, the X-men belong to Marvel not to him, he should have used social media to do it or make his own comics about it.

But then again hasn't Wilson who writes MS. MArvel use the comics to express his political points of views too? Aren't a lot of creator using the characters they don't own in comics to express their own political point of views regarding actual stuff?I've seen a lot of Anti-trump things in Marvel comics tbh.

I think in both caes is wrong.

Eh, if Wilson writes a Ms. Marvel story that touches on certain political views it's probably clearly present in her comic and her editors (and the company as a whole) are fully aware of that message and agree with it enough to accept it going into print. In Syaf's case he never consulted editors (or the company) on the particular beliefs he chose to promote in his art and he just sneakily inserted them there without Marvel's consent. So you can't really compare them. And it's also my understanding that the main "political" views Wilson "promotes" in Ms. Marvel are mainly about acceptance of people of different faith and inclusiveness as a whole (obviously not having actually read Ms. Marvel I'm only guessing) which I would say isn't such a bad thing to express. However, Syaf's expressed "political" views on the other hand seem to be about pro-discrimination and not allowing members of minorities the same rights as members of majorities have and that's not something most sensible people would agree with, regardless of their personal political allegiances. In fact I don't really see how anti-discrimination and/or pro-discrimination are even political views really, I feel weird saying that being pro-discriminaton or anti-discrimination is a political view at all. To me if you support discrimination of those who are different (or part of a minority) you're just an a-hole regardless if you're political views are more right or more left or somewhere in-between. But that's just me.

That makes very little sense to me though. Isn't the entire movement Syaf belongs to all a reaction against what Indonesians/Jakartans consider to have been an abuse of free speech by this Christian-Chinese politician? So if anything Syaf is the one saying free speech has limits and shouldn't be exercised willy-nilly even at the expense of producing great religious offense to the majority.

Although yes there is for sure the irony, many of the same people who despise "SJW culture" are of course super pro censorship when it comes to promotion of Islamic political messages

I've said this before and I'll say it again: I know next to nothing about the current political climate of Indonesia and I'm sure that the issues there aren't completely black and white and I'm sure both Muslims and non Muslims over there have reasons to critisize the other side as is often the case and Syaf might have completely valid reasons for his stance BUT he shouldn't express those ideologies in messages hidden in the art of work for hire. If he wants to talk about issues he has with the politicians in his country he should talk about them openly. And based on everything I have managed to gather from various sources so far it is my understanding that the protest Syaf was referencing had Muslim people demand that non Muslims should not have political power in Indonesia which quite honestly sounds kind of bad. It's essentially members of a majority demanding that members of minorities shouldn't have all the same rights as a majority does. If that indeed is the case it's more than just a political opinion, it's a human rights issue and it's basically discrimination of a minority which is the complete opposite of what X-Men are all about. So basically Syaf was hiding pro-discrimination messages in a comic that is anti-discrimination.

Of course, I again stress that I'm no expert in Indonesian politics and it might be that Muslims have good reasons to not want this particular Christian of Chinese descent in a position of political power but that is a whole different matter and based on what information is available it seems that the fact that this politician is of Chinese ethnicity and of Christian faith is at least part of why the native Indonesians of Muslim faith don't want him to have political influence. And that's basically just discrimination. Also, based on what I could gather the perceived blasphemy that the protesters of 212 wanted th governor to be punished for was actually some kind of translation error and what the governor actually said was not what these protesters had be told he said via a translation. So there is that too. And as someone who does not belong to any religion whatsoever I find it questionable that these protesters (or at least some of them?) were demanding that someone be punished for critisizing their holy book. I just find that to be pretty awful of an idea, I mean, obviously you need to respect the faith of others and not talk **** about the beliefs of others but every religion and belief should be open for criticism and scrutiny without the fear of punishment for it.

[MarvelMaster616]

I don't blame Wilson for being upset. Syaf picked the worst possible time to do something political in a Marvel comic. This is exactly the kind of stuff that readers have wanted to get away from. There's a time and a place for political discussions in comics, as we saw in Civil War and Civil War II. This is NOT one of those times.

Wilson has never been afraid of sharing her opinion. And unlike Syaf, she doesn't try to hide them in the background of her comics. But this really hit home for her because Syaf was using her religion. Clearly, she does not hold the same view as Syaf and isn't afraid to let him know it. I don't know that he understood how big a deal this was going to be when he snuck those messages into X-men Gold, but I imagine he'll remember once he loses his job. I really don't see how Marvel can keep him on board after a stunt like this. Given the current climate, Marvel just can't afford to be too political right now.

[MetalPsyc]

I'm very sad by this situation. Adrian seemed very proud when he exchange messages to one of his facebook followers saying that he drew the 212 and QS 5:51 reference right after he got back from the 212 (2nd of December) march.

I stand with Ms. Wilson on this one. Because of Adrian's action (based on his conservative/fundamentalism view on the verse), It might be harder for other decent muslim comic artists (even writers) to land a job in the industry.

[superduperman]

He basically ended his career with this. Even if the issue isn't as black and white as it sounds (and I don't see how it couldn't be) it was naive of him to expect American audiences to understand the nuances of Indonesian politics.

[Anduinel]

He basically ended his career with this. Even if the issue isn't as black and white as it sounds (and I don't see how it couldn't be) it was naive of him to expect American audiences to understand the nuances of Indonesian politics.

Plus he's sent a loud and clear message that any future employer simply can't trust him.

[marhawkman]

He basically ended his career with this. Even if the issue isn't as black and white as it sounds (and I don't see how it couldn't be) it was naive of him to expect American audiences to understand the nuances of Indonesian politics.

even IF people understand it, it is likely to irritate them.

[Psi-Lord]

That makes very little sense to me though. Isn't the entire movement Syaf belongs to all a reaction against what Indonesians/Jakartans consider to have been an abuse of free speech by this Christian-Chinese politician? So if anything Syaf is the one saying free speech has limits and shouldn't be exercised willy-nilly even at the expense of producing great religious offense to the majority.

Although yes there is for sure the irony, many of the same people who despise "SJW culture" are of course super pro censorship when it comes to promotion of Islamic political messages

I believe it was said that the politician didn't offend anyone. What he said was mistranslated.