Why Doesn't Batman Kill?

[Agent Z]

Well, Superman, Wonder Woman, Green Arrow, the Flash etcetera have all killed in canon at some point. It's just Batman who doesn't. Or hasn't done so since the fourties anyway.

He killed Darkseid in FC and has also participated in the killing of several non human enemies like the White Martians

[SiegePerilous02]

He killed Darkseid in FC and has also participated in the killing of several non human enemies like the White Martians

I thought he wounded Darkseid, not killed him? Wasn't Superman the one who sang him to death?

At least in the Morrison JLA run, he didn't kill any White Martians. I don't recall the Waid story all that well, but I can't remember him killing any of them there either.

[Nite-Wing]

Batman also killed a bunch of aliens with Damian rather recently in one of the annuals
Still if you argue Batman won't take a human life but everything else better watch out its not breaking his rule

[Agent Z]

I thought he wounded Darkseid, not killed him? Wasn't Superman the one who sang him to death?

At least in the Morrison JLA run, he didn't kill any White Martians. I don't recall the Waid story all that well, but I can't remember him killing any of them there either.

He shot Darkseid with a bullet made of Radion which is lethal to New Gods. Darkseid returned as a ghost and then Superman sang him to death and finished him off.

Pretty sure I recall him setting White Martians ablaze which is supposed to kill them. Even then there's also instances of him killing non human enemies. He and Superman are a lot more flexible with this rule when the enemy isn't human or doesn't look human.

[JBatmanFan05]

He shot Darkseid with a bullet made of Radion which is lethal to New Gods. Darkseid returned as a ghost and then Superman sang him to death and finished him off.

Correct, but also should be reminded that he shot Darkseid with radion to purge Darkseid from Turpin's body. That worked. Neither Turpin or Darkseid died, and Superman "vanquished" his disembodied essence by singing. Even later we learned that even Superman basically did not finish off Darkseid because the later Return of Bruce Wayne tells us that Darkseid was trying to reincarnate in Dr Hurt. Batman and Joker presumably end that reincarnation by defeating Hurt and Bruce in Return of Bruce Wayne being purged of the Omega energy by realizing and accepting that he's always had help. (And then also Multiversity and Darkseid's escape from the tomb)

(All in all, Darkseid's long undeath means Batman & Superman did next to nothing to him in Final Crisis)

[Agent Z]

Correct, but also should be reminded that he shot Darkseid with radion to purge Darkseid from Turpin's body. That worked. Neither Turpin or Darkseid died, and Superman "vanquished" his disembodied essence by singing. Even later we learned that even Superman basically did not finish off Darkseid because the later Return of Bruce Wayne tells us that Darkseid was trying to reincarnate in Dr Hurt. Batman and Joker presumably end that reincarnation by defeating Hurt and Bruce in Return of Bruce Wayne being purged of the Omega energy by realizing and accepting that he's always had help. (And then also Multiversity and Darkseid's escape from the tomb)

(All in all, Darkseid's long undeath means Batman & Superman did next to nothing to him in Final Crisis)

None of this negates my point. Darkseid was a spirit which you need to be dead to exist as. That he came back does not negate Superman and Batman killing him. Just as how Jason Todd'd murder at the hands of the Joker isn't negated because Jason was later resurrected.

[SiegePerilous02]

None of this negates my point. Darkseid was a spirit which you need to be dead to exist as. That he came back does not negate Superman and Batman killing him. Just as how Jason Todd'd murder at the hands of the Joker isn't negated because Jason was later resurrected.

Wasn't he a disembodied spirit before the story began? That's how he had to incarnate in a new host body with Dan Turpin, right? And like JBatman said, Turpin didn't die.

Again, I don't remember much from the Waid White Martian story, but I do remember Batman using fire to defeat them in the Morrison arc, but none of them were dead. He captured them, not killed them. And about Batman and Superman caring less about non-human enemies, that's not really consistent either I believe. Rucka wrote them that way to highlight why Diana is so much more awesome than them (and in the context of the story, yeah she was), but I'm sure there are examples throughout history of Batman and Superman upholding all life.

[Agent Z]

Wasn't he a disembodied spirit before the story began? That's how he had to incarnate in a new host body with Dan Turpin, right? And like JBatman said, Turpin didn't die.

Again, I don't remember much from the Waid White Martian story, but I do remember Batman using fire to defeat them in the Morrison arc, but none of them were dead. He captured them, not killed them. And about Batman and Superman caring less about non-human enemies, that's not really consistent either I believe. Rucka wrote them that way to highlight why Diana is so much more awesome than them (and in the context of the story, yeah she was), but I'm sure there are examples throughout history of Batman and Superman upholding all life.

Again, not sure how that negates my point and I never claimed Turpin died so I feel that's kind of moot. He had a physical form and then he didn't after Batman shot him. Don't know how else you can interpret that.

I'll cop to the White Martian thing but there's still other examples of them killing non humans. It's not like Rucka made that up either and I don't think it was just about showing Diana as better than them. To me it's no different than Morrison writing Talia as a pretty horrible individual as you'd expect of someone who is a terrorist.

[Scott Taylor]

Killing Darkseid isn't so easy as just eliminating his physical form.

Batman is all about justice. He espouses it, and works alongside police and the justice system. He does not see himself as judge, jury or executioner. He deduces what is going on when a crime happens, finds out who the criminals are, and goes out to catch them. Then when he catches them they go into the justice system.

[Agent Z]

Killing Darkseid isn't so easy as just eliminating his physical form.

Batman is all about justice. He espouses it, and works alongside police and the justice system. He does not see himself as judge, jury or executioner. He deduces what is going on when a crime happens, finds out who the criminals are, and goes out to catch them. Then when he catches them they go into the justice system.

Well it wasn't from a lack of trying and of course Superman took care of the rest.

Working with the justice system would mean becoming a cop, a prosecutor or a licensed consultant. Bruce has been shown investigating crimes without the GCPD's knowledge or approval and breaking the law when it suits. A recent arc had him breaking a woman on death row for murder out of custody.

[Batarang]

The only ''logical'' conculusion to this is:

Batman never kills except when he does. lol

[Scott Taylor]

Well it wasn't from a lack of trying and of course Superman took care of the rest.

Working with the justice system would mean becoming a cop, a prosecutor or a licensed consultant. Bruce has been shown investigating crimes without the GCPD's knowledge or approval and breaking the law when it suits. A recent arc had him breaking a woman on death row for murder out of custody.

In Batman Eternal, Batman has to go against GCPD when Gordon is arrested unfairly. In Batman Begins, most of the cops are corrupt so again he has to go against GCPD. Both he and Gordon actually team up against GCPD.

So its fair to say that he distinguishes justice, as a concept, from the authorities. Because he knows that the two don't always intersect.

[dietrich]

I love that Damian in the new Injustice 2 story mode makes the point a lot of people here are making.

"Batman so you won't kill but he's fine with traumatic brain injuries?" There are injures that don't kill you but leave you better off dead [depending on the individual]

In-story reason why he doesn't kill

I believe what happened to his parents helped shape Batman's decision along with the notion that there is a line you do not cross, that once you cross makes you no better than the criminals you hunt. Which is rich coming from a guy who already does a lot of the stuff those same criminals are doing and sometimes worse.

Real World why he doesn't kill

Batman doesn't kill because profits and story reasons.

[JBatmanFan05]

None of this negates my point. Darkseid was a spirit which you need to be dead to exist as. That he came back does not negate Superman and Batman killing him. Just as how Jason Todd'd murder at the hands of the Joker isn't negated because Jason was later resurrected.

I didn't quite say it negates your point, but I fleshed out the events. But you go too far IMHO to use the words "spirit" and "dead" and "kill" with Darkseid when his very nature and the relation of his god or godlike nature to those denotative and connotative words is not so clear, especially given the sequence I laid out.

[SiegePerilous02]

Again, not sure how that negates my point and I never claimed Turpin died so I feel that's kind of moot. He had a physical form and then he didn't after Batman shot him. Don't know how else you can interpret that.

He was a malevolent spirit possessing a body that wasn't his.

Is exorcism murder?