Do you see Superman as a badass?

[Kuwagaton]

Just to play a little devil's advocate here...

It totally makes sense that compared to say, Hal or Clark, Bruce is a lot more human and a lot more concentrated on personal efforts to overcome limitations. But speaking of the devil... Bruce is about that far comparitively from Matt Murdock. Matt, who had to claw his way through law school without parents, a trust fund, or a working pair of eyes. He did get free ninja training to help with his augmented senses, but constantly has to focus so they don't drive him crazy and when he lost his powers, had to prove that he was just as good without them. He went against the Hulk without plot armor. That's badass.

To be frank, he's old, straightforward, powerful, very apart of the world's culture as a constant, and contrarians are a thing. Batman's conventionally cool so his age and place in the world don't matter. And also, some people just think some characters suck. I think Cyclops and Jean are just the worst ever. I don't really have a essay to write about why, but I feel pretty darn strongly about it. I imagine the same is true for a whole bunch of people about Superman. I don't think it's a code that needs cracking. He's just old and famous enough that more people can have a strong opinion on him.

All you can do is accentuate what's great, relatable, and topical about him. It won't fix everything, but it will help.

Well, I do dislike Batgirl. Not Barbara Gordon, but the concept of Batgirl. Can't win me to it.

I think it's no surprise that Scott Summers is arguably my favorite after Superman, and in fact being a Cyclops fan is what drew me to Superman for the long haul. I like the "good guy." Sure they can embrace certain things like cultural allegory, but going forward what people have to like is the character, not what surrounds him. It's not that people don't get the idea, it's that they don't like him. They have to get people to see that being an outwardly decent and noble person, that being the "good guy" is cool in a way and not try to compensate with half hearted contradictions. A scowling Superman who flexes and floats above will never be as cool as a scowling Batman brandishing his claws and putting his feet up on someone else's table.

I like Wolverine a lot more than Batman, but as much more of a Cyclops fan I had to fight that same fight. Unfortunately Marvel has thrown the character under in the last few years, and I now have to compensate with back issues and a growing interest in characters like Blue Marvel and Black Bolt. The unfortunate thing about Cyclops back when they did have him around was that they either shoved him to the back or his most prominent writers (Lee, Morrison, Fraction, Bendis) actually wrote him very poorly. Media outside comics played up the "uncool" factor to make Wolverine look better, just like they might do with Superman here or there. Warren Ellis wrote him well, since Ellis writes everyone well, but for what it's worth also called Cyclops the "best superhero in the world."

If you ever want to read the original X-Men, I say go for Jeff Parker's First Class.

[PyroTwilight]

Well, it'll always depend on what a badass means to you. But honestly. YES. He's the Ultimate Big Good. If there's crime or evil he'll always be there try to stop it. He's very presence reassures other heroes, even those he considers peers.

Badass is just as much what you do and knowing when to do it. And Superman/Clark/Kal all are pretty good at knowing what that is and doing there best even if they can't be sure. .

[Timmyb52]

Superman has always been...and always will be a bad ass!

[CPSparkles]

Superman is great but I couldn't call him a badass like I would Batman or Deathstroke.
I mean I guess it depends on what you mean by badass. Superman rarely has me going damn that was badass or thinking no way did he just do that I can't believe he just did that!?

Plus Superman is so powerful that everything seems a cakewalk for him. I'm never worried about him.

[SpideyCeo]

No way, superman is the mary sue good guy but that doesn't define a badass, its how you act and behave. Superman is white privilege incarnate, the cop cowboy, the alpha jock, the boy scout and apparently king arthur on jutice league. Hes a compilation of every hero trope he fails to prove himself a on edge rebellious establishment against the norm.

That and hell never be as cool as anime heroes or any marvel heroes who are in the position as him but are treated like flawed tough people. That's what superman isn't, tough because hes blessed with godlike resistance and beat anything else.

John Constantine has no powers, his godhood or superman unflagging moral superiority, because he doesn't need it and lives how he wants to and can still save the world. That makes him beyond Superman in being a badass.

[Joker Venom]

The way being a badass is traditionally defined? No, he isn't.

But the great thing about Superman is that he doesn't NEED to be. That, in and of itself, is pretty badass.

[The World]

No way, superman is the mary sue good guy but that doesn't define a badass, its how you act and behave. Superman is white privilege incarnate,

But Batman isn't?

the cop cowboy, the alpha jock, the boy scout and apparently king arthur on jutice league. Hes a compilation of every hero trope he fails to prove himself a on edge rebellious establishment against the norm.

Supes was the original rebel and was the original alpha male type superhero. Though it's weird we just got a movie and a game where Batman reigned supreme over Supes and we've still got people calling Supes the jock not Bats.

[CPSparkles]

But Batman isn't?




Supes was the original rebel and was the original alpha male type superhero. Though it's weird we just got a movie and a game where Batman reigned supreme over Supes and we've still got people calling Supes the jock not Bats.

That makes Bats a badass not a jock.

[The World]

The way being a badass is traditionally defined? No, he isn't.

But the great thing about Superman is that he doesn't NEED to be. That, in and of itself, is pretty badass.

Seems pretty traditionally badass to me.

[The World]

That makes Bats a badass not a jock.

So Batman perpetually winning constantly no matter what the level of the opponent put in front of him makes him a "badass" but Superman doing the same makes him a mary-sue/jock/whatever? Sounds like fanfic bias.

[CPSparkles]

So Batman perpetually winning constantly no matter what the level of the opponent put in front of him makes him a "badass" but Superman doing the same makes him a mary-sue/jock/whatever? Sounds like fanfic bias.

What the hell does fanfc bias mean?
But yes it's a bias and one that Superman has to deal with. It's not intentional that's just how it is. However that's not why superman isn't badass and Batman is. Supes is the opposite of badass. He is all powerful much more powerful than Batman but he still isn't badass.

[CPSparkles]

Seems pretty traditionally badass to me.

Great panel
Shooting his kneecaps would have been much more badass

[The World]

What the hell does fanfc bias mean?
But yes it's a bias and one that Superman has to deal with. It's not intentional that's just how it is. However that's not why superman isn't badass and Batman is. Supes is the opposite of badass. He is all powerful much more powerful than Batman but he still isn't badass.

But can you go into any level of depth outside of saying Batman is a badass and Superman isn't?

By fanfic bias I mean how the reality of the DCU seems to naturally bend towards making Bruce look good all the time no matter what he does.

[The World]

Great panel
Shooting his kneecaps would have been much more badass

Whole lot more of that in the golden/bronze age. But frankly Clark isn't a guns guy, whole reason he's bullet proof.

[CPSparkles]

But can you go into any level of depth outside of saying Batman is a badass and Superman isn't?

By fanfic bias I mean how the reality of the DCU seems to naturally bend towards making Bruce look good all the time no matter what he does.

I mean like Batman's attitude his whole persona is one of badassery. He is the goddamn batman.
It's not about power levels for me. Batman seems to have brasser balls than Superman I don't want to put Supes down or make him appear lesser because that is not the case at all.

Clark is just too nice and too powerful to be a badass to me. Every time Bruce stands up to Clark he is being badass since he is taking on a much more powerful being. He constantly punches above his weight class and he has way more edge than Clark.

I don't think it's the reality of the DCU that bends it's people. People prefer one over the other therefore they give one more leeway. People are bemoaning Clark being bad in injustice. Bruce was a douche in BvS and yet everyone cheered that's not on DC that is on the public.