Lack of Superstar or commerical artists in comics

[prismablue]

I didn't know where to put this because CBR is so brand specific with their forums but I hope I can find a discussion here with those interested.

What I mean by commercial or superstar talent are monthly artists who can create a visceral experience and enthrall the reader even when the story itself isn't particularly deep. there is a lack of artists who have commercial marketability to their style. I don't mean just the style of drawing but especially the visual storytelling. I know those who read comics for their literary merit may turn their nose up at this sentiment but There are maybe 1% of writers and artists in comics who can produce a watchmen, or sandman. For the average comic title that approach, It's beyond boring in most cases. Visual art is taking off all over the place, I see print ad's for tmobile that are more dynamic than the average comic book cover.

This is not a knock on talent working in comics today. There are a lot of good storytellers and draftsman and those who still produce work that gets critical acclaim but There seems to be a lack of artists with commercial quality to their work who haven't already been working professionals since the 90's or earlier. The names that dominated in the early and mid 90's still do today. Jim Lee, Greg Capullo,The Kuberts, etc are all top of the pack and they do great work but where are their successors?

I talk to people at my LCS that don't think it's possible because publishers shifted the focus toward character brands and marketing solely writers making artists interchangeable and unimportant to the enjoyment of comics and I think that's actually hurting the art form. It's just odd to me that we live in a highly visual world and comics for the most part have become anti-visual art.

What do you guys/girls think? Am I way off base here?

[Arfguy]

I'm a comic book art first guy, actually. I love art first and foremost. It's great when a really well told comic story happens, but the art is usually what draws me in.

I tend to agree with you, in that comic book covers aren't as daring or striking as they used to be, IMO. They tend to fall more towards the side of pin-up style covers, rather than storytelling or visually stunning. For instance, I really loved the unique and cool covers that Kaare Andrews did on Incredible Hulk, but then the stories after the initial start kind of fell off. It also didn't help that the cover artist also wasn't the interior artist.

On the other side, I think Dave Johnson did 100 excellent covers for 100 Bullets and the story was really interesting and filled with cool characters. It was a big plus to have Eduardo Risso as the interior artist, as the man could draw with a minimalistic style that was so expressive and so unique, it could not be ignored.

I do think we need a bit of a rock & roll style artist to come in and really steal the thunder away. Kind of like Erik Larsen with Savage Dragon. I tailed off on Savage Dragon, as his art style became a little too clean and less grimey, but he really had a passion for comics and his character. To this day, he's still doing a character he left the financial security of Spider-Man for. We need someone like that to come along with a style that is so aesthetically amazing that no fan can ignore it. I think artists like Olivier Coipel and Adam Warren are that talented, but I think their personalities are a little too humble. If they were a little more in your face and a little bit more full of themselves, they would could really change the landscape of the comic book industry.

[Kirby101]

I think Sean Murphy has become a Superstar. His work is fairly recent.
Though not a superstar yet, I love the work of Piotr Kowalski.

[anyajenkins]

Short answer, comics don't pay very much. Slightly longer answer, comics don't pay much and artists lose most, if not all of the creator rights when the work for 'the big 2.' So it's not worth it unless they really, really love the medium.

[Mister Mets]

There has to be a distinction between the lack of new star artists and a lack of commercial artists. The former is an issue. I don't know if the latter is a problem.

I think one issue is that there are so many good artists it becomes difficult for one artist to stand out. There are just so many options available for readers.

Printing and coloring tech has also gotten us to a place where artists are able to reach their full potential so that more of their work looks great than ever before. And we've got more access to it than ever before thanks to trade paperbacks, digital comics and websites where you can see samples of gorgeous artwork. When supply was lower, it wasn't able to meet the demand.

Looking at artists who were popular a generation ago, are they really noticeably better than Fiona Staples (Saga), Steve Epting, Sean Phillps or Francesco Francavilla (Black Beetle)?

There are some other slightly contradictory ideas. It might be that there's a house style in the industry that means that individual artists won't stand out as much, and the type of deviations that led to an artist being popular and different just aren't being done any more. On the other hand, there's also a growing nichification so that the relatively small group of comic fans is getting split into smaller and smaller communities. An artist might really appeal to one group, but be limited beyond that.

[Kirby101]

I think there has to be a distinction between the lack of new star artists and a lack of commercial artists. The former is an issue. I don't know if the latter is a problem.

One possible issue is that there are so many good artists it becomes difficult for one artist to stand out. There are just so many options available for readers.

True, in the hey day of Marvel there were maybe ten artists doing the books.

[Goggindowner]

I think you alluded to it, but it all kind of started with the artist exodus from Marvel that led to the creation of Image. There was a purposeful shift away from glorifying artists after that, and the shadow of that idea is still hanging over the Big 2.

But I am curious, because this feels like a relatively contained issue to DC and Marvel. So I ask, OP. Are you calling them out specifically, or is this targeted at the industry as a whole? There are really great artists working on stuff every month that is just amazing. Fiona Staples as been mentioned already. Gabriel Ba, Leandro Fernandez, and Cliff Chiang just to name a few. No, they don't have a "rock star" persona, but I wouldn't expect them to. That "rock star" quality seems like it was very much a product of the era in which those guys came out, back when the industry was still very closed off to outside influences and a lot of style was being celebrated over substance. Not to say that any of those old 90's artists are bad, but it was such a snapshot of that time of the industry to have guys with those personalities.

Now, comic art is being influenced by graphic design. Artists are more and more coming into the industry from other careers in art, like advertising and animation. It's a different breed of people entirely. I think there would be a lot of kick back on a creator in 2017 that carried themselves like those guys back in the day. The fan base is very different now, too.

[Iron_Legion87]

I went to a local comic con convention over the weekend here in Virginia and I got to meet Chris Claremont and Neal Adams and both were cool and down to earth. I feel like they are famous comic book artist and anyone who reads comics should probably know who they are especially Chris. But I do feel we need more big name comic book artist our there as it is kinda lacking in that department.

[Iron Maiden]

Some of the really good ones probably don't need the comic book industry to make a living. Sometimes they get lured into video gaming companies or movie story boarding/design. I can't say if the task is that much easier than in Jack Kirby's days of sitting at his old wooden drawing table and working long hours. I don't think he ever missed a deadline while at Marvel and that was when he would do Fantastic Four, Thor, Avengers, etc every month.

Axel Alonso made this controversial statement recently :

There are fewer artists that impact sales than there are writers, Alonso said, and they’re harder to promote. “It’s harder to pop artists these days,” he said. “There is no apparatus out there. There is no Wizard Magazine out there that told you who the hot top 10 were. We don’t have that anymore. We can hype our artists all we want, but I don’t know if we know how many artists, besides maybe McNiven and Coipel, absolutely move the needle on anything to be drawn.


As you might guess, that didn't go over well in the artist community. IMO, Marvel's stable of artists seems to be weaker than in years past. Seems like they lost some of their talent to DC and probably some of the smaller companies.

[Vic Vega]

Some of the really good ones probably don't need the comic book industry to make a living. Sometimes they get lured into video gaming companies or movie story boarding/design. I can't say if the task is that much easier than in Jack Kirby's days of sitting at his old wooden drawing table and working long hours. I don't think he ever missed a deadline while at Marvel and that was when he would do Fantastic Four, Thor, Avengers, etc every month.

Axel Alonso made this controversial statement recently :

There are fewer artists that impact sales than there are writers, Alonso said, and they’re harder to promote. “It’s harder to pop artists these days,” he said. “There is no apparatus out there. There is no Wizard Magazine out there that told you who the hot top 10 were. We don’t have that anymore. We can hype our artists all we want, but I don’t know if we know how many artists, besides maybe McNiven and Coipel, absolutely move the needle on anything to be drawn.


As you might guess, that didn't go over well in the artist community. IMO, Marvel's stable of artists seems to be weaker than in years past. Seems like they lost some of their talent to DC and probably some of the smaller companies.

This is the first time I'm reading this.

I can see why the artist community is upset. They should be.

However, I think Erik Larsen's reply was most on point. Marvel hasn't really actually tried promoting its artists since the "Image Unpleasantness"
opting instead to push its writers.

And its not like they were subtle about it either.

If Wizard folding is the reason that artists can't be pushed anymore than how does he explain guys like Scott Snyder and Tom King becoming names post Wizard?

[Iron Maiden]

This is the first time I'm reading this.

I can see why the artist community is upset. They should be.

However, I think Erik Larsen's reply was most on point. Marvel hasn't really actually tried promoting its artists since the "Image Unpleasantness"
opting instead to push its writers.

And its not like they were subtle about it either.

If Wizard folding is the reason that artists can't be pushed anymore than how does he explain guys like Scott Snyder and Tom King becoming names post Wizard?

Exactly. There's this little thing called the internet that really knocked Wizard off it pins. It was only a monthly and by the time they printed an article, the news was already old. DC, Marvel, etc have their web sites to promote their wares.

They can get multiple titles out of a writer, like with Bendis, Ewing,etc. Hickman wrote a ton of stuff for them before he cut back. That requires a lot more artists. I think Marvel's output per month is somewhere south of 40 - 50 titles a month. I would think that would make the artists very important in getting your product out there. They can only do one title per month. JRjr is probably the only artist that could do two a month. IIRC he did that at Marvel for a while when he was on ASM a while back.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Exactly. There's this little thing called the internet that really knocked Wizard off it pins. It was only a monthly and by the time the printed an article, the new was already old. DC, Marvel, etc have their web sites to promote their wares.

They can get multiple titles out of a writer, like with Bendis, Ewing,etc. Hickman wrote a ton of stuff for them before he cut back. That requires a lot more artists. I think Marvel's output per month is somewhere south of 40 - 50 titles a month. I would think that would make the artists very important in getting your product out there. They can only do one title per month. JRjr is probably the only artist that could do two a month. IIRC he did that at Marvel for a while when he was on ASM a while back.

And that was with inkers finishing their pencils. The days of workhorses like the Buscema brothers doing two, perhaps three books a month are LONG over and will never be seen again. Today, with artists doing their own inking and/or coloring while providing the sort of detailed, realistic looking backgrounds readers have come to expect, if not demand, doing more than one book a month is flat out impossible.