New 52 Division of Robins and their relationships

[Alycat]

So this is something I've seen discussed in different individual robin threads and have also spent some time thinking about. It seems like after the the New 52 started, DC decided to split to the robins into two different groupings, which were Dick and Damian and Jason and Tim. The first group actually makes lot of sense considering where they came from before as Batman and Robin and their excellent relationship overall. Unfortunately it also came at the expense of Dick and Tim's long and amazing brotherly relationship that didn't get a chance to fix itself before Tim's current situation.

This lead to writers putting him and Jason together, which some people loved, but imo hurt them both since writers could use them as those two guys with Tim being smart and Jason being there I guess. They also became each others favorite family members for some reason.If there is one thing I'm glad about Tim being not there its the fact that he and Jason can't be paired up and shipped to the side. I personally like Jason's current position and he feels much closer to the family than any part of New Tim. Hopefully that's fixed one day, but I wanted you guys opinion on the way DC divided the four and their current relationship with each other.

[Dark_Tzitzimine]

So this is something I've seen discussed in different individual robin threads and have also spent some time thinking about. It seems like after the the New 52 started, DC decided to split to the robins into two different groupings, which were Dick and Damian and Jason and Tim. The first group actually makes lot of sense considering where they came from before as Batman and Robin and their excellent relationship overall. Unfortunately it also came at the expense of Dick and Tim's long and amazing brotherly relationship that didn't get a chance to fix itself before Tim's current situation.

This lead to writers putting him and Jason together, which some people loved, but imo hurt them both since writers could use them as those two guys with Tim being smart and Jason being there I guess. They also became each others favorite family members for some reason.If there is one thing I'm glad about Tim being not there its the fact that he and Jason can't be paired up and shipped to the side. I personally like Jason's current position and he feels much closer to the family than any part of New Tim. Hopefully that's fixed one day, but I wanted you guys opinion on the way DC divided the four and their current relationship with each other.

That was on editorial and the writers, not on the idea being flawed. During the N52 editorial had this weird fixation on keep Tim completely separated from Gotham while Snyder (and to varying degrees other writers under him) had little interest on exploring the Robins and would rather spend time with their OCs. Lobdell was the only one that bothered to explore and develop the relationship properly.

Personally I enjoyed Jason and Tim together because it made a lot of sense as is the natural direction they would have if Jason would've returned earlier and not completely psychotic pre flashpoint. The dynamic was also very interesting and helped a lot to mellow Jason while making Tim the level headed member of the bat family, willing to try and understand Jason.

[Alycat]

That was on editorial and the writers, not on the idea being flawed. During the N52 editorial had this weird fixation on keep Tim completely separated from Gotham while Snyder (and to varying degrees other writers under him) had little interest on exploring the Robins and would rather spend time with their OCs. Lobdell was the only one that bothered to explore and develop the relationship properly.

Personally I enjoyed Jason and Tim together because it made a lot of sense as is the natural direction they would have if Jason would've returned earlier and not completely psychotic pre flashpoint. The dynamic was also very interesting and helped a lot to mellow Jason while making Tim the level headed member of the bat family, willing to try and understand Jason.

I was fine with it myself most of the time, but my sheer saltiness over Tim and Dick did'nt help. The dynamic was okay, but Tim's willingness to understand Jason but not Damian, if we leave preflashpoint stuff canon, was also strange at the time.

[millernumber1]

I was fine with it myself most of the time, but my sheer saltiness over Tim and Dick did'nt help. The dynamic was okay, but Tim's willingness to understand Jason but not Damian, if we leave preflashpoint stuff canon, was also strange at the time.

That "if" is a pretty big one, though.

[Alycat]

That "if" is a pretty big one, though.

Thats true. But even then theres nothing to suggest that Jason and Damian did'nt attack Tim. Unless I overlooked something.

[Godlike13]

I don't know i DC consciously did this, or more that its just something that happened because Lobdell was writing Jason and Tim (and wanted to make Jason more important to Tim's time as Robin), and those writing Dick were more just interested in his newer relationship with Damian.

[Aahz]

Personally I enjoyed Jason and Tim together

Depends on the story, in RHatO and TT it was good, but Eternals and Robin War are in genral not very enjoyable if you are a fan of Jason or Tim.

[Dark_Tzitzimine]

Depends on the story, in RHatO and TT it was good, but Eternals and Robin War are in genral not very enjoyable if you are a fan of Jason or Tim.

Eternals and Robin War are terrible, terrible stories so everything was bad and not just their relationship.

[Aahz]

Eternals and Robin War are terrible, terrible stories so everything was bad and not just their relationship.

Defnitally, but unforunatly the majority of their intercation is in these series. And in RHatO and TT the only time they are working really together is the DotF tie in, on the other ocassion i rember they are just talikng, it is not like ever really got team up story arcs with them, like we got for Dick and Damian in the last issues of Nightwing.

[nightbird]

I'm still salty over Tim calling Jason "closets thing he had to brother". The way writers treated Tim and Dick's bond to push Damian and Dick (also Jason and Tim) wrong on so many levels. Dick could be (and should be) equally close to both his little brothers.

[Badou]

Lobdell making Jason and Tim super close always felt weird to me. Maybe because I was so used to their old relationship where Jason resented Tim a lot that their new close as brothers dynamic felt off to me. I get that Tim, and even Jason, were under different editors at that time that were different from the Batman office ones. So Lobdell was just using what he had control over. I don't think it really hurt Jason's character as he didn't really lose anything. All he did was gain a closer relationship with Tim, but Tim because of the position he was in felt like his relationship to Dick and other Batman family characters became nonexistent. Given how close Tim and Dick were it hurt Tim's character to not have that anymore.

[Dark_Tzitzimine]

Lobdell making Jason and Tim super close always felt weird to me. Maybe because I was so used to their old relationship where Jason resented Tim a lot that their new close as brothers dynamic felt off to me. I get that Tim, and even Jason, were under different editors at that time that were different from the Batman office ones. So Lobdell was just using what he had control over. I don't think it really hurt Jason's character as he didn't really lose anything. All he did was gain a closer relationship with Tim, but Tim because of the position he was in felt like his relationship to Dick and other Batman family characters became nonexistent. Given how close Tim and Dick were it hurt Tim's character to not have that anymore.

This is a misconception/selective memory. Other than the TT issue, Jason never showed a lot of resentment against Tim pre-FP.

Even during BFTC where Jason is a his most deranged, he always showed a soft spot for Tim, going so far to want him as sidekick. Something he had suggested before during his appearances on Tim's series.

Jason being close to Dick is what comes off because they never were on amicable terms after Jason's resurrection.

And yet, people complains about Jason's closeness to Tim but to Dick on the N52.

[Alycat]

This is a misconception/selective memory. Other than the TT issue, Jason never showed a lot of resentment against Tim pre-FP.

Even during BFTC where Jason is a his most deranged, he always showed a soft spot for Tim, going so far to want him as sidekick. Something he had suggested before during his appearances on Tim's series.

Jason being close to Dick is what comes off because they never were on amicable terms after Jason's resurrection.

And yet, people complains about Jason's closeness to Tim but to Dick on the N52.

But Jason isn't close to Dick? Theres nothing to complain about because they barely interact, not even to really show hostility. In anything that's a relationship that should probably be addressed.

[Badou]

I think Dick and Tim were as close as brothers before. I think the main difference between Dick's relationship between Tim and Damian is that Dick treated Tim like an equal and with Damian there are hints of fatherhood mixed with brotherhood that Dick could never have with Tim.

This is a misconception/selective memory. Other than the TT issue, Jason never showed a lot of resentment against Tim pre-FP.

Even during BFTC where Jason is a his most deranged, he always showed a soft spot for Tim, going so far to want him as sidekick. Something he had suggested before during his appearances on Tim's series.

Jason being close to Dick is what comes off because they never were on amicable terms after Jason's resurrection.

And yet, people complains about Jason's closeness to Tim but to Dick on the N52.

Were Dick and Jason close before? It seems that is only something people have written in the last few years. I dunno, I suppose Jason stabbing Tim and leaving him for dead left a strong impression on me and that was probably one of their last interactions before Flashpoint. Also I think Lobdell overdid it a bit with trying to build a connection with Tim and Jason. The "closest thing I've ever had to a brother" line, Tim not even wanting to be called Robin because of Jason, and that scene where he is standing in the mansion looking at a giant picture of Jason talking about how he will respect his memory felt like a bit much.