Batman #23 Preview/Discussion

[Pohzee]

Personally, I came to see him as some kind of Turk in Frank Miller's DD instead of simply a joke (Not that there's a big difference), especially since he may be the protagonist of an upcoming issue in The War Of Jokes And Riddles

The problem is that he's pretty much capable of like two lines every issue. I guess I should say that I've tired of the HELL YEAH's.

[Bookem Danno]

A one-and-done tale is refreshing! The art was wonderful. Often an issue long duo-tone colour scheme may tick me off but here it changed from scene to scene and the color choices evoked very well. The afternoon tea sequence was brilliant. The minor role afforded the D-List Batman Rogue, Kite-man, worked well too. The story had some kinks but overall it made use of an B-List guest hero, Swamp Thing, as cleverly as the neat title choice THE BRAVE AND THE MOLD.

Did we know Alec had 2 dads? Was that a lucky tuber this dad had laying around on his apartment table? Can Swampy 'tele-project' himself into any organic substance even if it is not connected to the Earth?

It was a thought provoking effort to interpret this Worldview of The Green through Alec. Shades of an A.I. Worldview through Marvel's The Vision but that was 12 issues of mindframe growth and this was noticably squeezed -a bit... inadequately(?)- into 1. In the end how is Swampy's showing any different from a supervillain Batman would forever pledge to hunt down? He killed a man against the Law for his terra-ist beliefs!

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[JasonTodd428]

Honestly, I didn't like this issue as much as I thought I would. I know a lot of people thought it was great but it just didn't do anything for me for whatever reason. In fact I thought it was a bit dry and dull even. For me it was probably the worst single issue King has written but that's just my opinion. The art was brilliant though.

[Johnatellodi]

Can anyone clear up the status of Alec Holland for me?

Is he still intended to have always been a plant, from Moore's run, or was it revealed that he truly was the human Alec at one point in life?

[HsssH]

If I'm not mistaken current version is supposed to be real Alec, Moore's version was briefly shown during Snyder's run and IIRC Soule's Futures End one-shot.

As for the issue, good stuff. Yet it is weird that some people still complain about Batman being emotional about his parents when that has been central theme of entire run so far. You'd think that people would manage to understand that after 20 issues?

[Frontier]

Can anyone clear up the status of Alec Holland for me?

Is he still intended to have always been a plant, from Moore's run, or was it revealed that he truly was the human Alec at one point in life?

Alec Holland as Swamp Thing was restored at the end of Brightest Day, and I believe that's been consistent since.

[Johnatellodi]

Alec Holland as Swamp Thing was restored at the end of Brightest Day, and I believe that's been consistent since.

I appreciate both replies, friends.

But can anyone clear it up further? Does this mean that the Alan Moore Swampy is from a different dimension than our currernt one? Or was our Alan Moore Swampy turned into some type of Alec Hollan hybrid? I know it has to be some crisis-related mumbo jumbo but can anyone help me out further? Much appreciated.

[Johnatellodi]

Alec Holland as Swamp Thing was restored at the end of Brightest Day, and I believe that's been consistent since.

I appreciate both replies, friends.

But can anyone clear it up further? Does this mean that the Alan Moore Swampy is from a different dimension than our currernt one? Or was our Alan Moore Swampy turned into some type of Alec Hollan hybrid? I know it has to be some crisis

EDIT: nvm, but thank's anyways. For anyone else wondering, here's the wiki post:

The conclusion of the series Brightest Day revealed that Swamp Thing had become corrupted by the personality of the villain Nekron in the wake of the Blackest Night crossover.[12] Swamp Thing now believed himself to be Nekron, similar to how he had once believed himself to be Alec Holland. Swamp Thing went on a rampage in Star City, ultimately seeking to destroy all life on Earth. The Entity within the White Lantern used several heroes, including Hawkman, Hawkgirl, Firestorm, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman and Deadman to slow the rampage and to construct a new Swamp Thing based on the body of Alec Holland. Instead of merely thinking it was Holland, this version of Swamp Thing would actually be him. The new Swamp Thing defeated and killed the corrupted and original Swamp Thing. Swamp Thing then restored life to natural areas around the world and declared that those who hurt "The Green" would face his wrath. He also restored Aquaman, Firestorm, Hawkman, and Martian Manhunter to normal. The book ended with Swamp Thing killing several businessmen who engaged in deliberate, illegal polluting activities.

EDIT 2: Sorry for the double post. Forum wouldn't allow me to edit my post for some reason.

[Kevin Street]

^ That was before Flashpoint, The New 52 and Rebirth, so it's almost certainly been retconned away. I think all we can say now is that this Swamp Thing is Alec Holland. We don't know if that's always been the case, or if something happened to restore his mind somewhere along the way.

This was a really good issue! A complete done-in-one, with awesome art by Mitch Gerads. It's so much better than that Bane story, I don't even know where to start. Maybe that's the difference an artistic collaborator can make. Anyway, King and Gerads hit this one out of the metaphorical park. There was a murder mystery, colorful supporting characters (one thing Tom King has definitely excelled at in this series is bringing back lesser villains in cool new ways), an unlikely team-up, and an ending that feels like an epilogue to "The Button." One gets the impression that Swamp Thing isn't the only person Batman is calling a coward there. It was a lot of fun.

[RebirthgotmebackintoDC]

This was fantastic, absolutely fantastic, the different views of death between Bruce and Alec, the realization at the end that part of Swamp Thing is still "Alec". Also the theme of a Father's legacy and influence continues from the button, I'm very interested to see what actions Bruce will take in the future regarding what his father said to him in the button (which was more great batman issues). Honestly, Tim's run went from good with I am Gotham, to what? with I am Suicide, but every since rooftops and onward, he's been absolutely killing it. Love the "inside" look into batman.

[DIVINITY]

Great one and done. A lot of really good character moments....

Tom & Mitch work well together. They're like the new "Brubaker & Phillips"...

[sirmarkus]

I enjoyed this issue. It was also my first Batman comic so I'm kind of glad it was a one off story. Always enjoy Swamp Thing too, and liked how he and Batman meshed together. I went into a little more detail here: http://wp.me/p81uZL-8w

Is the series as a whole better or worse than this issue?

[darkseidpwns]

I enjoyed this issue. It was also my first Batman comic so I'm kind of glad it was a one off story. Always enjoy Swamp Thing too, and liked how he and Batman meshed together. I went into a little more detail here: http://wp.me/p81uZL-8w

Is the series as a whole better or worse than this issue?

Its inconsistent and depends on your taste. I think issues 9-20 and 24 have really been carried by Catwoman and Bane more than anyone else.

[Fearless Heart]

I enjoyed this issue. It was also my first Batman comic so I'm kind of glad it was a one off story. Always enjoy Swamp Thing too, and liked how he and Batman meshed together. I went into a little more detail here: http://wp.me/p81uZL-8w

Is the series as a whole better or worse than this issue?

Woah, this is so awesome! It's cool to see someone just jump right in. That's how I always bought comics. Rebirth is the first time I jumped in on the beginning. I always just bought a book based on the cover. If the story really grabbed me, the next time I'd go to the comic store, I'd try to get another issue with the character. I didn't even look at writers.

I wondered what it was like to read my first issue of Batman. I don't even know what it was. I only remember my first issue of Spider-man. It's cool to read your thoughts!

It's something you have to decide for yourself. It's a bunch of navel gazing from Batman with beautiful art. It made me question certain aspects with Batman's character, so that is interesting. Usually, if I don't like a writer's interpretation, I flat out reject it, and I don't look back unless fans say other-wise, but I think I've always kept my opinions. With this one, I've gone back in forth. I think Tom King is incorporating all different depictions of Batman into one, and he's giving a very honest look at a grown man who dresses like a bat.

Can you get Hoopla? If you can, maybe you can read the first two trades. This and Deathstroke were the only comic books I bought this year, and I'm stress out over money, so I must have liked it even though I've complained about King's writing. It's the most I thought about Batman's character since "I didn't count on being happy" Mask of the Phantasm scene and the Dark Knight Returns.

[sirmarkus]

I've never bought any DC stuff at all until the Rebirth stuff in the past year. I've found this issue has grown on me more as I've re-read it, but am still more impressed with the Flash as a general read so far.