Deathstroke #19 (Lazarus Contract Part 3)

[Grayson - The Dark Heir]

Maybe, but he acts like the two are mutually exclusive.

And? Is he not allowed to have an opinion? I disagree with him for sure, but it's his opinion. We can discuss that, but that's not what my post was about. All I was saying in my post is that it was wrong to call him a "pissy child." All he was doing was writing a blog post about his upcoming story, and being honest about what went on in the background between his first teasing of it and the story in it's current form (which is very interesting to me, because I've been expecting TJC stuff in it since before Priest had started talks with Abnett because of it). From what I understand, his post only goes where it does because he wasn't allowed to revisit TJC as it is, and if he wanted to, he would have to retell it or redo it. Obviously, he'd rather skip that, and I'm not sure I prefer it this way (it would've been nice if some NTT era stories were back in continuity at least), but I guess he didn't feel he could write a good story doing that.

I feel like I'm the one who looks upset about this, though, since I'm still posting about it, smh. Honestly, I only posted about all this because "pissy child" struck a nerve with me, I guess. Also, I apologize if my tone in this post came across as combative or anything, I'm not trying to pick a fight here.

[Pohzee]

Maybe, but he acts like the two are mutually exclusive.

What he is saying is that when the need to address continuity conflicts with a writer's ability to tell a story, good storytelling should take precedent over explainations of continuity changes. Future writers shouldn't have to be burdened undoing the damage of poor decisions made by past creators, they should be allowed to tell the stories that they want to tell.

You act like just bringing the "A-team" back is enough to recapture that magic of the early NTT run. They HAVE brought the so called a-team back many many times and you know what? By an large it sucked. It was never anywhere near as good as the original run. It is hard enough to capture lightning in a bottle once let alone twice and that is why it pretty much never works.

Priest wasn't talking about reassembling Wolfman's team, he just wanted to acknowlege that it even existed.

[Frontier]

Priest wasn't talking about reassembling Wolfman's team, he just wanted to acknowlege that it even existed.

That's what I was hoping for, at least to some degree. They at least could have re-instated Starfire's prior Titans status...

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

I'm gonna be honest, I don't agree with Priest's idea of saying we messed up and just getting to the continuity that fits his story. Job of being a writer in serialized canon is making a story fit into continuity, that's what the fun is for readers reading these monthly stories. I've seen people on other sites point to superman reborn being a good example and while the stories are good, it honestly just looks messy overall how much they had to do to achieve that status quo. I'd rather the writers just work with making the best of the continuity they have available.

You're not wrong, but what Priest is saying here is that DC needs to stop trying to streamline their continuity. At least that's my understanding. DC spends way too much time on making everything into a solidified timeline instead of actually letting the writers draw on the actual history of the characters. He wanted to acknowledge that the NTT did in fact exist and, honestly, if DC had let him do it, then the story would have been much better. Instead of having to rely on this weird Frankenstein continuity that nobody really has any attachment to, it would allow him to call back to an actual era of DC's publication history, which is what makes these kinds of stories powerful in the first place.

[Caivu]

What he is saying is that when the need to address continuity conflicts with a writer's ability to tell a story, good storytelling should take precedent over explainations of continuity changes.

And why doesn't "good storytelling" include making changes to the intended story so that it still fits? That's what I mean about the mutually exclusive part. It's not either "Write a good story" or "stay in line with what's canon."

[Pohzee]

And why doesn't "good storytelling" include making changes to the intended story so that it still fits? That's what I mean about the mutually exclusive part. It's not either "Write a good story" or "stay in line with what's canon."

A good writer shouldn't be stuck fixing other people's messes. What's it matter if canon is fudged a little to tell a more condense, consistent, or satisfactory story. Despite their bests efforts, the writers at DC will never be able to make everything canon anyway, there are simply too many stories that have been told and will continue to be told. Why not pick and choose the best parts of that history to tell your story rather than what is most recent? In a few years, the status quo that is handicapping you may not exist anyway. Why handicap yourself to that?

[Caivu]

Why handicap yourself to that?

Because they aren't writing creator-owned stuff.

[Pohzee]

Because they aren't writing creator-owned stuff.

I care more about reading good stories than I do continuity tidbits that hold back a story. If a story is a worthy addition to a character's history, use it. If not, don't address it. For instance, we may spend this crossover reestablishing a relationship between Deathstroke and the Titans because the editors say that The New Teen Titans didn't happen. However, Priest hints (and fans hope) that it will be returned to continuity in the future, making this whole story pointless, and itself out of continuity. Continuity will always change, but if you focus on explaining the changes in continuity, then you reduce the amount of good stories you are able to tell before continuity changes again as you waste time explaining changes that don't matter, or worse, weaken a story, like the deletion of TNTT did.

Which brings us back to Priest's red hat/yellow hat comment. Don't sweat it and don't waste time on it.

[Outside_85]

You act like just bringing the "A-team" back is enough to recapture that magic of the early NTT run. They HAVE brought the so called a-team back many many times and you know what? By an large it sucked. It was never anywhere near as good as the original run. It is hard enough to capture lightning in a bottle once let alone twice and that is why it pretty much never works.

I never said that just brining back the A-team was enough, I remember well enough Winnick's Titans and the editorial-mandate that ran it into the ground.

But look at how it is now, you get Dan Abnett and Christopher Priest working on 2 parts of the Titans-franchise, and are you telling me they could not do a better job with the team most people (including themselves) actually want to see?

Also, if you want to talk about whats sucked... John's TT has sucked pretty much ever since he left the book for various reasons ranging from editorial crippling and sheer writer incompetence. NTT, remind me but Titans has been the only recent attempt at getting the band back together?

[millernumber1]

I'm not asking for a 20-page comic to solve gun violence or any other huge issue like it. What I would like to see is some sort of stance beyond "it's complicated" or "this is just to start a conversation". Everyone knows these are complicated issues.

I'm not sure what you mean here, but my whole problem is that Priest is acting like he's being subversive or something when he's really doing nothing of the sort. Slade's quoting the Bible? Oh no! The next villain is a gay Christian? Why, I just might faint. Tanya gets *gasp* birth control!
He really does sound like someone who doesn't actually read comics anymore, which is bizarre.

I actually tend to agree that "Chicago" wasn't a terribly impressive issue. I appreciated that it didn't paint any of the sides as the true root of the problem - which, as a conservative, feels fairly unusual in any artistic medium, which almost always finds some way to present the issue as heartless gun users vs. complicated but ultimately righteous and reasonable gun control advocates (unless it's a piece of propaganda by the other side, in which case, vice versa). That being said, the evenhandedness was the only thing that was really noteworthy about it.

There has been a few moments of the Bible being quoted in a sincere and non-undercut way in the past few years - but it's almost never done with a character who is considered a "normal" person - Azrael is the best example I can think of recently, and his religion is so tied up with a cult that it's difficult to see it as attempting to positively represent the lived experience of many comics readers.

When was the last time you saw a gay Christian villain in mainstream super hero books? and if he doesn't read comics I cant fault him because they're mostly crap anyway. Either way he gives examples and offers insights to the editorial process in his interviews so its not like he's being vague or anything.

Agree completely with this point. Furthermore, I think the fact that being gay and Christian don't motivate his villainy, but are just a part of the texture of his character is really unusual, and make for a much richer reading experience.

[Lightning Rider]

Just popping in to say I haven't read this because my local store ran out of issues on Wednesday. Which is a good sign I would think.

[HsssH]

It was decent issue, but unfortunately "decent" wasn't good enough to salvage this crossover.

Other than that few things:

On one hand people might say that "it is complicated" is pointless argument to make, but today our societies are pushed to extremes and everyone has an answer for everything so, at least for me, it was genuinely refreshing to see writer (or any person with platform, and due to facebook/twitter everyone now has one) saying that he doesn't know how this can be solved.
And I totally agree on his point about continuity porn. Look at Superwoman, once Reborn happened entire run went out of continuity and fans were left scratching their heads (writer wasn't too happy either). Such things shouldn't be happening, but they are, to some extent, unavoidable when editors/writers try to "fix" continuity.

[protege]

Not sure how this revamped jericho is supposed to work.