Would A Modern Batman & Catwoman Book Be A Good Idea?

[AzraelOnline]

The writers, King especially, seems way too concerned with always trying to 'shake things up.' She'll probably say yes, and he'll probably kill her off at the wedding. I'm with everyone else, would much rather see a Catwoman solo book then a Bat/Cat book.

[Assam]

I'll read Cass too. Isn't that the one character that was pulled out of canon and fans got mad? Or am I mixing something up?

Both Cass and Steph were erased from existence with the Nu52. This was 2nd time DC had tried to get rid of the two, (They'd tried killing off Steph and turning Cass inexplicably evil in the past) and through a combination of fan outcry and Tynion being a fan of the two, they finally came back.

[godisawesome]

Maybe... If this never ends in marry her..

I don´t hate Catwoman but... I am afraid for one Big change in batman comics with Bruce married..

But one big change has been the name of the game in regards to Batman's continued excellence as a comic; it's the highest profile DC franchise that's always evolving with one or two changes. Your avatar shows the literal biological son of Batman; you go back ten years ago and that would have been almost impossible to see as a long term change. My favorite Robin is Tim Drake, my favorite Batgirl is Cassandra Cain, both of which are changes in Batman comics. And I think we can all agree that Batman in current comics hasn't felt like a 20-something in decades, even with the New 52's attempt to make everyone like that.

And married heroes have been extremely successful before; for all that creators sometimes moan that eliminating the romance aspect of a book hurts it, it's hard to see how matrimony is the problem in the examples they mention when they conveniently skip over their own mistakes.

I'd say the real issue as to whether or not this would work will be my response to the below post:

But isn't that part of the problem? Having all these books? This is part of the reason why some people still view Cat as some kind of villain or selfish or her and Batman not being that deep. Because a lot of the emotional closeness and scenes that you would see in a Catwoman book, it wasn't as paramount in the Batman book because the focus was on him. So if you are not reading those Cat books, you miss that.

Same with Damian. A LOT of people still think of him as a brat but apparently he has matured a little. But since I don't read Super Sons or Teen Titans, I really don't know how Damian is now at 13. I mean I've seen some panels but ....

I may be giving in to nostalgia, but my memories of the Batboards around here right before Flashpoint was pretty positive in regards to how most vocal fans and posters regarded characters; you didn't see the same infighting and fandom wars between various Robins and Batgirl fans, in part because right before Flahspoint, everyone had some kind of book appearance under a skilled author:

-Dick, Damian and Bruce were splitting books by Grant Morrison and Scott Snyder.
-Babs was in BoP by Gail Simone and Batgirl by Bryan Q. Miller.
-Tim was in Red Robin by Fabian Nicieza.
-Steph was in Batgirl by Miller.
-Dick, Tim, Cass, and Damian also got Gates of Gotham by Kyle Higgins.
-And everyone was making appearances in Paul Dini's book, and crossing over into other books.

And I'd argue this lead to a healthy respect for all Batfamily members (save possibly Jason, since they hadn't quite figured out what to do with him). A lot of Tim Drake fans stopped hating on Damian and got a more nuanced appreciation because Tim was in a good book already, and because Damian got a nuanced handle there and in Batgirl. There was still some left over venom in the Batgirl fandom because of Steph's sudden replacement of Cass, but it was suddenly a lot more friendly once Cass had a role in a mini-series. The Batman family of books was huge... And didn't seem to suffer from it...

...But that's because the Batfamily books had a great stable of skilled writers and a healthy editorial board to support them. You want to know why the Batman books have been of consistently better quality than the Superman books for almost a decade now? The Bat editorial board cultivates both veteran writers happy to be given some freedom (Morrison, Snyder, Dini, and even Dixon at times) and young up-and-comers who get to take a shot at succeeding (Tynion, Higgins, Seeley from a certain point of view, the guys working on Gotham Academy) and let's them write. In contrast, the Superman books seem to be written by a rotating cast of writers working under restrictions and occaisionally on editorial fiat.

The Bat books can take a bunch of spinoffs, providing they keeping rounding up promising writers and giving them a chance. There are risks and failures; Finch, Adams and Daniels were artists given writing duties as payment and it didn't quite work out, and Nocenti got way too much time on Catwoman. But at least it's not like the Superman books, where editorial will hire then fire a famous writer like Andy Diggle even before his first (well-recieved) issue is out. And that's the reason the Batbooks can cultivate so many different genres and casts; they're a healthy series.

And they're healthy enough for still more expansion.

[MajorHoy]

I only know of Helena Wayne Huntress but I know there is another woman that's Huntress too. I figured that out in reading HUSH.

The Helena Wayne version of Huntress was originally co-created by Paul Levitz (as well as Joe Staton and Bob Layton) back in the mid-to-late 1970s and was the pre-CoIE daughter of Earth-2's Batman and Catwoman.



She was a member of the Justice Society of America for a while, and even got her own back-up feature at one point in Wonder Woman.



But as a result of Crisis on Infinite Earths in 1985-1986, the Multiverse was collapsed into a single Earth, and many (but not all) of the Golden Age duplicates of (then) modern day heroes (like the Bruce Wayne Batman, and even the Selina Kyle Catwoman) no longer ever existed, which meant there was no longer a "Helena Wayne".

What DC wound up doing was creating a new "Huntress" in 1989, who was secretly Helena Bertinelli.

[WontonGirl]

The Helena Wayne version of Huntress was originally co-created by Paul Levitz (as well as Joe Staton and Bob Layton) back in the mid-to-late 1970s and was the pre-CoIE daughter of Earth-2's Batman and Catwoman.



She was a member of the Justice Society of America for a while, and even got her own back-up feature at one point in Wonder Woman.



But as a result of Crisis on Infinite Earths in 1985-1986, the Multiverse was collapsed into a single Earth, and many (but not all) of the Golden Age duplicates of (then) modern day heroes (like the Bruce Wayne Batman, and even the Selina Kyle Catwoman) no longer ever existed, which meant there was no longer a "Helena Wayne".

What DC wound up doing was creating a new "Huntress" in 1989, who was secretly Helena Bertinelli.

Awesome. Thanks! And then remember, the WB had a TV show called "Birds of Prey", it was based off of the Helina Wayne as Huntress.

[MajorHoy]

Awesome. Thanks! And then remember, the WB had a TV show called "Birds of Prey", it was based off of the Helina Wayne as Huntress.

Actually, the Birds of Prey version of Huntress was Helena Kyle, and she actually had some meta-human, cat-like abilities (something neither of the comic book characters did).

And, in case you weren't aware, the Huntress name had originally been used for a villainess back in the Golden Age of the 1940s.

[WontonGirl]

Actually, the Birds of Prey version of Huntress was Helena Kyle, and she actually had some meta-human, cat-like abilities (something neither of the comic book characters did).

And, in case you weren't aware, the Huntress name had originally been used for a villainess back in the Golden Age of the 1940s.

Thanks! Batman was still her daddy, LOL! But I am going to catch up on Birds of Prey on the CW Seed.

Thanks for all the history! I got a lot of catching up to do

[MajorHoy]

Thanks for all the history! I got a lot of catching up to do

For the original Helena Wayne/Huntress, if you can read All-Star Comics #66-74, that's the arc where Helena first appears with the JSA (staring with a cameo appearance in issue #69). She does meet up with the original Golden Age Huntress at one point as well.



After issue #74 of All-Star Comics, the JSA moves over to a spot in Adventure Comics that runs from issue #461-466.

[adrikito]

But one big change has been the name of the game in regards to Batman's continued excellence as a comic; it's the highest profile DC franchise that's always evolving with one or two changes. Your avatar shows the literal biological son of Batman; you go back ten years ago and that would have been almost impossible to see as a long term change. My favorite Robin is Tim Drake, my favorite Batgirl is Cassandra Cain, both of which are changes in Batman comics. And I think we can all agree that Batman in current comics hasn't felt like a 20-something in decades, even with the New 52's attempt to make everyone like that.

No problem with marry someone... I only know Aquaman and Mera of N52(In Bat brave bold were secondary characters) and I see both married as good idea...

... I am only scared for future problems or if this change my opinion about him..... I prefer Selina Kyle than Talia.. and because I see this like... Try to make Superman and Batman franchises more similar than ever..

-First Batman with son(even if I see all my life batman as a father, thanks to grayson), Now Superman with son...
-Superman is married for years... well... First we copy THE REAL SON IDEA, now we try to marry Bruce like superman..

In the end batman will be like a dark superman without powers... and superman a Shinny Batman without mask and powers..Anyway ... I can always leave this..

With batman married, WW is the only single in the trinity... Although, at this rate, DC marry her with trevor... Seems that one day I will forgive that I admire her previosly...


MAYBE THIS ENDS IN ANOTHER THING LIKE "LEAVE BATMAN DIE WITH ME" FOR MAKE THAT BATMAN CAN´T INVESTIGATE THE REBIRTH..

[suemorphplus209]

Sure, I can't see why not.

[WontonGirl]

No problem with marry someone... I only know Aquaman and Mera of N52(In Bat brave bold were secondary characters) and I see both married as good idea...

... I am only scared for future problems or if this change my opinion about him..... I prefer Selina Kyle than Talia.. and because I see this like... Try to make Superman and Batman franchises more similar than ever..

-First Batman with son(even if I see all my life batman as a father, thanks to grayson), Now Superman with son...
-Superman is married for years... well... First we copy THE REAL SON IDEA, now we try to marry Bruce like superman..

In the end batman will be like a dark superman without powers... and superman a Shinny Batman without mask and powers..Anyway ... I can always leave this..

With batman married, WW is the only single in the trinity... Although, at this rate, DC marry her with trevor... Seems that one day I will forgive that I admire her previosly...


MAYBE THIS ENDS IN ANOTHER THING LIKE "LEAVE BATMAN DIE WITH ME" FOR MAKE THAT BATMAN CAN´T INVESTIGATE THE REBIRTH..

I don't know if you came in with the N52 but Superman had a son first. And their was a "SuperSons" comics back around the 1950's. This concept is not new.

The reason why the Vicki Vale character was created was because DC Comics wanted a "Lois Lane" type character in the Batman comics and for him.

Um, I believe that Wonder Woman and Steve have been married a couple of times as well.

And the concept Bruce getting married has been done before as well in the past comics, regardless of Superman being married.

Again, I don't know if you came in on the N52 but these concepts are all in the older comics.

[adrikito]

I don't know if you came in with the N52 but Superman had a son first. And their was a "SuperSons" comics back around the 1950's. This concept is not new.

The reason why the Vicki Vale character was created was because DC Comics wanted a "Lois Lane" type character in the Batman comics and for him.

Um, I believe that Wonder Woman and Steve have been married a couple of times as well.

And the concept Bruce getting married has been done before as well in the past comics, regardless of Superman being married.

Again, I don't know if you came in on the N52 but these concepts are all in the older comics.

I see images of the old concept of the supersons.. Yes, I imaginated that of Vicky Vale.. and Iris West in Flash..

I don´t know if add one marriage is good(I feel that this is not Bruce Wayne.), he has a son(really, many sons) he need more? he will not change(leave behind batman)...But, In the same way, they try to create a superman family... Make Batman and Superman universes similar is a good idea?

I know about Helena Wayne... Maybe Selina is the only good option for him...

However, I doubt that this can dissapoint me like another things.... Foe example Burnside(I want a mature barbara gordon not this) or know that the pre-flashpoint bat-family is better... Except Batwing I don´t see nothing interesting in N52 Bat-characters like Duke and Harper..