Darks Days: The Forge #1 Spoilers/Discussion

[DragonPiece]

So wow, this was a very packed issue with lots of teases. So much to digest. I literally don't even know where to begin. Was Plastic Man actually stuck in a container in the batcave this whole time? Duke's mom has some sort of immortal powers or something? Hawkman is back and is the one who had the weird version of the cover. The Anti Monitor tower that destroy's universes is back, makes sense, since the threat will be a dark multiverse. And of course, we have the new 52 Joker back. Should be interesting seeing Duke's reaction since this Joker is the one who poisoned Duke's parents. It doesn't surprise me Joker was the one talking to the two of them since the new 52 has been a master at fooling even Bruce as seen in endgame.

Can't wait for the casting next month!

[JBatmanFan05]

Did the issue say or suggest the original Outsiders were really formed as a cover front for Bruce's investigations into these metals?


EDIT: an article in case anyone wants to read it
http://insidepulse.com/2017/06/14/dc...e-3-jokers-ju/

[DragonPiece]

Did the issue say or suggest the original Outsiders were really formed as a cover front for Bruce's investigations into these metals?

Yep, that's right. Modern costumes though.

[AlexanderLuthor]

I'm not always the biggest Snyder fan, but I thought this was really well done. Perfect kick-off issue introducing all sorts of questions. My only gripes are Romita's art, which I can enjoy at times, really felt out of place here and Duke. I actually like Duke, but the old hey I'm going to kick you in the face Green Lantern because Batman said no one in the cave was cringe worthy and then later in the cave him showing less fear than Hal about continuing on seemed really out of character for Hal. But all in all, very good

[Katana500]

Did the issue say or suggest the original Outsiders were really formed as a cover front for Bruce's investigations into these metals?


EDIT: an article in case anyone wants to read it
http://insidepulse.com/2017/06/14/dc...e-3-jokers-ju/

Do you think we will get an Outsiders series some point in the future? Would be a bit strange to mention them with no follow up

[JBatmanFan05]

Do you think we will get an Outsiders series some point in the future? Would be a bit strange to mention them with no follow up

I definitely think that scene means DC is really pondering one or planning one. It'd be interesting if they could get Mike Barr to write it, he's still active for DC (like Dixon is). Though I doubt Barr will be chosen.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

That was a pretty strong start that threw a lot of different balls in the air. I am a little confused by timeline of it all though. Did Batman's investigations begin with finding that tooth in the Talon or had he been digging into the mystery metal prior to that? They said he'd been looking into this stuff for years.

Aside from that minor bit of confusion, there's a lot to love here. The idea that Nth Metal, Fate's helm, Poseidon's trident, the Amazons' bracelets, the Multiverse tower, and, presumably, the Oan power rings are all made from the same metal is genius.

[JBatmanFan05]

That was a pretty strong start that threw a lot of different balls in the air. I am a little confused by timeline of it all though. Did Batman's investigations begin with finding that tooth in the Talon or had he been digging into the mystery metal prior to that? They said he'd been looking into this stuff for years.

The Outsiders reveal I think almost certainly makes it clear Batman has been investigating this for a long long time (since early or early mid career at the latest). I hate Zero Year, but there might even be Metal eggs/seeds in there too, as with the rest of Snyder's run. I think Snyder is trying to hype this as the big one that Bruce has been pursuing almost his whole (crimefighting) life. Because of the Owls, the Wayne ancestors have been victims of the users of these metals, etc.

Sorta like how Morrison had Darkseid's Sanction and Hyper Adapter having affected so much in human and Wayne and Gotham history.

[JBatmanFan05]

http://www.ign.com/articles/2017/06/...days-the-forge

We [IGN] were able to talk with writers Scott Snyder and James Tynion IV about this big twist and its implications for the larger Metal storyline. Snyder told us, "I the DC Universe right now there's a big story coming from Geoff Johns with the three Jokers from back in Rebirth. Joker has sort of been deliberately off-table for the last year, but when it came to this story I approached Geoff and talked to him about it. The idea, really, for us is that we want Batman to suddenly realize the scope of the thing he's following. Not only is he the detective following the clues, but his whole story might just be one more piece in a mystery that's bigger than all of it. Meaning, he might have been taken advantage of long ago. The entire history of his time as Batman might be another clue as to what's coming. All of that stuff where the detective realizes he's just part of the mystery he's been following."

Snyder continued, "The only character who's been with him that entire time, apart from Jim Gordon, is Joker. He's been the adversary in my run with Greg [Capullo], and he was in pretty much every arc as a constant sort of recourse for Batman, telling him in different ways what he thought Batman was doing right, what he was doing wrong and also discovering a lot of things with Batman along the way. It just made sense to be the character here at the end, who'd be locked away with both answers and more questions than anyone would have asked."

Tynion said that readers can look back to various key storylines from the New 52 to see the seeds of Metal. "I'd say that 'Endgame' in particular is a good place that, if fans are looking for even more added depth to this story, go back and check out 'Endgame.' Especially the stuff that we hint at in The Forge, and you'll see more of it in The Casting. When Joker discovered Dionesium, he started down a path of discovery. That's the reason Batman has him locked up down there, because the Joker knows things. He might not be telling the truth about any of this, but he knows something, and Batman is trying to find out what. It's all a part of this greater tapestry. And for people who are less familiar, we'll be laying all of that out in The Casting, as well. I love the things where you can look back through an entire run and be like, "Oh! That's the antecedent to this seed." There are a lot of Easter eggs to look back and find once the full picture is drawn here.

Snyder elaborated, saying, "There are so many Easter eggs, it's crazy. James and I had a lot of fun late at night going through all of that stuff. Even if you think about metals that have appeared in our run, there's Electrum in 'Court of Owls,' Dionesium in 'Endgame,' Batmanium in 'Superheavy.' There's the Blackhawks in All-Star Batman. All of that has been seeded. In Batman #50, the last issue I did with Greg, there's a ton of clues and terms and things that come back in our story. Things that were set up in the owl scene and all kinds of stuff. That probably be too much of a Rosetta Stone for everybody, but I would just say it's meant to be one of those things that's entirely built on our run, on Tom's run, on existing Batman stories. It's going to touch on stuff that other Batman writers did before me that'll surprise you - big DC events like Infinite Crisis. It's sort of a love letter to Batman and the DCU in a large way. Again, if you go back and look, it'll be more rewarding. But you can just pick it up cold and you'll be okay, as well."

[Rakzo]

This was an interesting set-up that escalates nicely towards the cliffhanger in the last page. Snyder was an appropriate choice at handling this event considering his cinematic style. The constant references to mythos around the DCU were also appreciated.

The only thing holding this back is the art. Lee, Kubert and JRJR don't offer the kind of attention to detail that this story deserves particularly during the little details in the environments that the plot provides. Hope things get better here.

[Bukdiah]

Yikes, the price is painful to look at but the story looks interesting

[MadFacedKid]

That was a pretty strong start that threw a lot of different balls in the air. I am a little confused by timeline of it all though. Did Batman's investigations begin with finding that tooth in the Talon or had he been digging into the mystery metal prior to that? They said he'd been looking into this stuff for years.

Aside from that minor bit of confusion, there's a lot to love here. The idea that Nth Metal, Fate's helm, Poseidon's trident, the Amazons' bracelets, the Multiverse tower, and, presumably, the Oan power rings are all made from the same metal is genius.

More inconvientent if anything. I prefer Amazonium and Gold of Legacy to be their own thing connecting to their own mythology inside of the bigger universe. Rather then everything conveniently connecting.

No idea how Batman was able to move that tower in that room either. If He and I guess now Mr. Miracle are the only ones who know its there..

Regardless gripes and all it was an entertaining issue.

[Jovos2099]

So does this mean that COIS is Canon again at least in some form or another?

[K. Jones]

Did the issue say or suggest the original Outsiders were really formed as a cover front for Bruce's investigations into these metals?


EDIT: an article in case anyone wants to read it
http://insidepulse.com/2017/06/14/dc...e-3-jokers-ju/

It did. Which is a perfect sneaky retcon on Snyder's part, when you consider the original Outsiders' powers. Metamorpho and the elements, Geo-Force and geology, Katana with a blade with magic powers that could very well be another METAL relic. Halo with light spectrum powers. Black Lightning with conductive/electrical powers. That original line-up is kind of perfect for Super-Hero or Super-Detective Geological Phenomena.

I'm surprised how well Snyder can sift through a lot of continuity and pick out choice things that build a story here. It's a move echoing some of the best 'big DCU connect-the-dots' of Johns or Morrison and he equates himself well. I'm also surprised how much more I like the voices of some of his characters here that aren't Batman or Bat-related. I rather like his Hal Jordan and Aquaman, but I especially like his Hawkman and his Mister Terrific.

I've got to re-read this sucker to get the full effect, but first thoughts; could Professor Madison be related to Julie? What the hell do the Blackhawks, Lady Blackhawk, and any recent completely bonkers Blackhawks continuity have to do with any of this?

Does this seem to tie back to Infinite and Final Crisis as much as it seems to? It's not just the Antimatter Tower (which looks conspicuously like Nth Metal now), but the references to the Bat-Tribe, the Miagani, and Hawkman's thoughts reminded me strongly of Morrison's Final Crisis and Return of Bruce Wayne storyline. (linkages I saw in Flash, this week, too, as Thawne recognizes that Iris West is as "strangely brought back from the timeline" as he, and Barry Allen himself, are.)

There's dionesium in Bruce's and Joker's systems now. There was electrum in Grayson's tooth. Duke is apparently loaded with the stuff. Could it have more to do with a lot of DCU immortality? What element in the meteor was it that gave Vandal Savage elongated life? (Could this immortal stuff link back to Tomasi's Insiders storyline a few years back, where Ra's al Ghul and Vandal reluctantly teamed to destroy some other immortals?) What about the elements found in Lazarus itself?

What the hell was Doctor Hurt freaking out about when he was torturing Grayson? (There's another can of frigging worms.)

And, correct me if I'm wrong ... but is the Dark Matter one and the same as the Kirby Crackle?

[Desean101101]

So does this mean that COIS is Canon again at least in some form or another?

We know howit happened in some shape and form but the multiverse didn't implode like it happened last time.