JSA or Legion: Which Team Will Be Rebirthed First?

[Thor-Ul]

I believe that's non-canon, and the portrayal of the Legion in the Bug Bunny crossover will not be the same from the eventual Rebirth iteration of the team.

Also remember, that was the New52 version of Bugs Bunny.
Jokes aside, I suppose than Legion and JSA will sipin off from Doomsday Clock. I mean, there will be explored why Dr manhattan stole time from DC universe andboth Legion and JSA belong to other times.

[CaptCleghorn]

Also remember, that was the New52 version of Bugs Bunny.
Jokes aside, I suppose than Legion and JSA will sipin off from Doomsday Clock. I mean, there will be explored why Dr manhattan stole time from DC universe andboth Legion and JSA belong to other times.

Do we have any reason to believe the Legion's actually lost any time? Is there any reason the Legion can't be doing anything mow? Aside from the obvious "cuz DC won't publish dem", that is. We know there's stuff going on with the JSA as only Wally apparently remembers Jay. The Legion, though has appeared in nu52 books and interacted with nu52 characters.

As I've often said, the Legion probably needs to wait for a final Superman to be settled on before his teenage superhero club pops up again. I'd guess the clock story will deal with the Legion as the button story dealt with the Legion. I'm settled in to waiting until whenever for LSH #1 and JSA #1. I might need to bring something to read while I'm waiting though (see what I did there?).

[MajorHoy]

. . . I'm settled in to waiting until whenever for LSH #1 and JSA #1. I might need to bring something to read while I'm waiting though (see what I did there?).

I don't quite know if I'm "settled" to wait that long.
I've referred to "Rebirth" as being equivalent to "Zero Hour" for me because Zero Hour was an attempt to fix things that, unfortunately, didn't do enough (or maybe changed too much?) to keep me around for more than about a year or so. (I then gave up regular comic book purchases for about the next +/-fifteen years.) And I'm wondering if this continued waiting for a return of the/a JSA may drag out to the point that I no longer care (again), especially when for all I know DC will pull another last-minute "revival" of the JSA that could be closer to what they gave us with the New52's Earth 2.

[CaptCleghorn]

I don't quite know if I'm "settled" to wait that long.

Ready for it isn't liking it. But this is a situation when I'm willing to give DC the benefit of the doubt. There's more than enough time so the returns shouldn't be thrown together and rushed. And although the returns are crawling at a snail's pace, what little I've seen has been good. DC will need to provide me with a good reason why Imra is willing to spend some time in Arkham, though.

[MajorHoy]

Ready for it isn't liking it. But this is a situation when I'm willing to give DC the benefit of the doubt. There's more than enough time so the returns shouldn't be thrown together and rushed.

Can you define the difference between "shouldn't" and "definitely won't"?
The (supposed) return of a "JSA" under the New52 did not appear to be "rushed", but look at what they eventually gave us with Earth 2.

(And while that book was interesting in the beginning, Earth 2 really didn't seem to reflect what DC was originally saying about the return of a "Justice Society" in terms of anything more than a slightly vague, sorta-connection way.)

[CaptCleghorn]

Can you define the difference between "shouldn't" and "definitely won't"?
The (supposed) return of a "JSA" under the New52 did not appear to be "rushed", but look at what they eventually gave us with Earth 2.

(And while that book was interesting in the beginning, Earth 2 really didn't seem to reflect what DC was originally saying about the return of a "Justice Society" in terms of anything more than a slightly vague, sorta-connection way.)

I think the terms are pretty much self-explanatory. nu52 was rushed, Rebirth doesn't have to be. Now we know there are books (and jobs of every kind) that are p[ostponed until the last minute and end up rushed. All I'm saying is DC's got the time to do it right. I'm trying not to be cynical.

[MajorHoy]

I think the terms are pretty much self-explanatory. nu52 was rushed, Rebirth doesn't have to be. Now we know there are books (and jobs of every kind) that are postponed until the last minute and end up rushed. All I'm saying is DC's got the time to do it right. I'm trying not to be cynical.

The initial roll-out of the New 52 may have appeared to be rushed, but Earth 2 wasn't until the second wave, so that shouldn't have faced the same problems when they began it.
As for being "cynical", well, I confess to that. But I've seen too many times where DC threw that team under the bus to not be concerned with what they may try this time out.

[CaptCleghorn]

The initial roll-out of the New 52 may have appeared to be rushed, but Earth 2 wasn't until the second wave, so that shouldn't have faced the same problems when they began it.
As for being "cynical", well, I confess to that. But I've seen too many times where DC threw that team under the bus to not be concerned with what they may try this time out.

I apologize. I did not want to imply you were cynical, just that I'm trying not to be.

As to your other point, Earth 2 was well planned and thought out, just not a traditional JSA setting. And we've both gone on about that series a lot. My point with mentioning nu52 was the rest of it being rushed.

[MajorHoy]

I apologize. I did not want to imply you were cynical, just that I'm trying not to be.

I don't fault you for keeping your hope alive.
I'm wondering, though, if I'm not being cynical as much as I'm being a realist in this case.

[Tugger]

Doesn't look like Legion is coming back anytime soon.

http://www.cbr.com/dan-didio-jim-lee...oes-interview/

[MajorHoy]

Going back to a previous post, . . .

. . We know there's stuff going on with the JSA as only Wally apparently remembers Jay. The Legion, though has appeared in nu52 books and interacted with nu52 characters.

Don't forget that in DC Universe: Rebirth that old Johnny Thunder remembers (or believes he remembers) the JSA, so he may remember Jay.
And in the Paul Levitz-written Doctor Fate series that DC was still publishing during the beginning of Rebirth, the Kent Nelson Doctor Fate remembers a JSA, so he, too, might remember Jay.
(Of course, DC hasn't done anything that I'm aware of to clarify whether those stories are still part of the current Rebirth canon or not. Or has something definite been said in the Rebirth Blue Beetle series?)
Also, has there been any indication since DC Universe: Rebirth that Wally still remembers Jay now that he's acclimated to life outside of the Speed Force? (I don't read Titans, so no clue on whether that memory was lost.)

[CaptCleghorn]

Going back to a previous post, . . . Don't forget that in DC Universe: Rebirth that old Johnny Thunder remembers (or believes he remembers) the JSA, so he may remember Jay.
And in the Paul Levitz-written Doctor Fate series that DC was still publishing during the beginning of Rebirth, the Kent Nelson Doctor Fate remembers a JSA, so he, too, might remember Jay.
(Of course, DC hasn't done anything that I'm aware of to clarify whether those stories are still part of the current Rebirth canon or not. Or has something definite been said in the Rebirth Blue Beetle series?)
Also, has there been any indication since DC Universe: Rebirth that Wally still remembers Jay now that he's acclimated to life outside of the Speed Force? (I don't read Titans, so no clue on whether that memory was lost.)

I don't know. You're right that Johnny and probably Kent, both remember Jay. The Rebirth special was DC's admitting that a more traditional Jay exists. I don't think it's a stretch thinking that. What I'm now stuck on is that Wally was trapped in the speed force and from the Button arc, it looks like Jay is as well. If Jay is in the speed force, where the heck are the other JSAers? With future solicits, we're seeing that in a year and a half of books, little JSA (or Legion) has developed.

Your way of thinking has merit and evidence for its support, Major.

[MajorHoy]

. . . What I'm now stuck on is that Wally was trapped in the speed force and from the Button arc, it looks like Jay is as well. If Jay is in the speed force, where the heck are the other JSAers?

It might be that Jay found his way into the Speed Force after the JSA was removed from whenever/wherever/however and was trying to use Barry as his link to break free from the Speed Force.
The rest of the JSA members (at least whichever ones were removed from the HUAC hearing by Thunderbolt) may still be wherever they wound up.

[Thor-Ul]

I just thought, remember than from that scene with Johnny in Rebirth, it could be implied that it was his thunderbolt (genie/djinn) the responsible of the dissapearance of the JSA from history books. Or at least it had some degree of responsability. Johnny blamed himself for the absence of the JSA but he can't summon the djinn again. Could be than the thunderbolt is one of the prisioners of Mr. Oz? He already had another 5-D being prisioner.

[MajorHoy]

I just thought, remember than from that scene with Johnny in Rebirth, it could be implied that it was his thunderbolt (genie/djinn) the responsible of the dissapearance of the JSA from history books. Or at least it had some degree of responsability.

Not exactly . . . Johnny seemed to be saying he commanded Thunderbolt to cause the JSA members to disappear from the HUAC hearings. Not the same thing as causing people (and history books) to forget the JSA ever existed.
And as I've said before, the disappearance of the JSA from those hearings in front of Senator Joe McCarthy and others isn't a new idea. Paul Levitz introduced the idea back in a JSA story in 1979 to explain why the JSA members were not active after the Golden Age, and the concept has been used in stories many times over the years prior to Flashpoint in 2011.
How exactly the collective memory of the Justice Society was removed from history books as well as people's minds since the start of the New52 is still anybody's guess at the moment.