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  1. #31
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    Because the characters.

    BvS came out with a depressed as hell murdering Batman. Why should I give a f bout him? Superman was depressed as hell didn't know what to do with his life. Why should I care about him? Who's even looking forward to seeing these characters in the next Justice League movie? Are people going to cheer when they see Superman back?

    The reason why MCU movies get a pass is because the audience is in love with the characters. Marvel took it's time and sure the plots have been mediocre, but the characters have grown with the audience in every movie. The characters are what makes the MCU, not the plots. Take Tony Stark, going from a selfish prick to now mentoring Spider-Man due to the trauma and the selfish mistakes he's gone through in all the movies.

    If you don't care about any of the MCU characters then obviously you are going to hate the movies. But what you need to realize is, this opinion is in the minority and you just need to accept it and move on or stop watching the movies all together, while people like me will enjoy the ride while it lasts.

    We are watching the next movie to watch the next adventure of these characters not for studying art or how to make a time tested movie.

    Fox is gonna make a Dark Phoenix movie and I don't give a crap about any of the young characters other than Quicksilver. Why would it affect me that Jean became evil now?
    Last edited by Punjabi_Hitman; 06-25-2017 at 04:10 PM.

  2. #32
    Astonishing Member rui no onna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Punjabi_Hitman View Post
    Because the characters.

    BvS came out with a depressed as hell murdering Batman. Why should I give a f bout him? Superman was depressed as hell didn't know what to do with his life. Why should I care about him? Who's even looking forward to seeing these characters in the next Justice League movie? Are people going to cheer when they see Superman back?

    The reason why MCU movies get a pass is because the audience is in love with the characters. Marvel took it's time and sure the plots have been mediocre, but the characters have grown with the audience in every movie. The characters are what makes the MCU, not the plots. Take Tony Stark, going from a selfish prick to now mentoring Spider-Man due to the trauma and the selfish mistakes he's gone through in all the movies.

    If you don't care about any of the MCU characters then obviously you are going to hate the movies. But what you need to realize is, this opinion is in the minority and you just need to accept it and move on or stop watching the movies all together, while people like me will enjoy the ride while it lasts.
    Yep. Didn't know the Avengers existed prior to the MCU movies. Marvel was just X-Men, Spider-Man and FF. Didn't know Blade was a Marvel character until recently. For me, despite the campiness, CA: The First Avenger actually made Cap likeable. His various incarnations always felt boring. Samuel L. Jackson certainly made a much, much, much better Nick Fury than David Hasselhoff.

    As for the upcoming Justice League movie, I love Gal Gadot. Thought she was the best part of BvS. The Wonder Woman movie was awesome. Gonna watch it just for her. From JL teasers/trailers, I like Ezra Miller's Flash. Jason Momoa, I dunno. I still think of him as Khal Drogo.
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  3. #33
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    They can do wrong, they have done wrong in the past but for everything they fucked up they nailed two or three other things.

    The Movies are all at least "good enough" and are generally way ahead of the direct competition.

    It's easy to see why that is considered a success. What's more is that the movies have a similar feel to the comics which is all I want.
    "̶l̶̶e̶̶t̶'̶s̶̶ ̶̶h̶̶a̶̶v̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶s̶̶o̶̶m̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶f̶̶u̶̶n̶̶,̶̶ ̶̶t̶̶h̶̶i̶̶s̶̶ ̶̶b̶̶e̶̶a̶̶t̶̶ ̶̶i̶̶s̶̶ ̶̶s̶̶i̶̶c̶̶k̶̶.̶̶ ̶̶i̶̶ ̶̶w̶̶a̶̶n̶̶n̶̶a̶̶ ̶̶t̶̶a̶̶k̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶a̶̶ ̶̶r̶̶i̶̶d̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶o̶̶n̶̶ ̶̶y̶̶o̶̶u̶̶r̶̶ ̶̶d̶̶i̶̶s̶̶c̶̶o̶̶s̶̶t̶̶i̶̶c̶̶k̶̶"
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  4. #34
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    MCU films are very successful, but I don't think they are ground breaking-ly good or praise worthy to be honest. Iron Man and Winter Soldier are probably my favorite movies from them.

    A lot of people are on their jock because it's "MAHVEL" so it "has to be good" IMO.
    Superhero shows are trash

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dboi2001 View Post
    You're acting like I want some Oscar bait movie out of superhero films. I don't but I do expect more out of them.
    Sure, but I do think people forgive a superhero movie a lot of things if they're entertaining enough.

    Look at Spider-Man in Captain America: Civil War. By the normal standards of a normal movie, his part in the movie is pretty ridiculous. It takes time out of the plot for Tony Stark to go and meet this kid we've never seen before and press-gang him into risking his life in a foreign country. Then he participates in a fight where he has no idea what is going on, gets knocked down, and disappears from the movie until the very end.

    If this were a movie about original characters this would be seen as bad storytelling, but of course, the character is Spider-Man, one of the few superheroes almost everybody knows, and he was played pretty well, and seeing Spider-Man hang out with the MCU characters we already knew was so much fun that we forgave how irrelevant he was to the plot of the movie.

    I do think Marvel movies sacrifice something by having so many plugs and setups for upcoming movies. The Winter Soldier was (IMO) their best movie so far because it had its own style and tone and didn't work too hard to set up other movies or bring in other characters who didn't belong. Civil War doesn't hold together as a movie that way because it's so obviously working to set up Spider-Man: Homecoming and Black Panther and Infinity War and even the Ant-Man sequel.

    But if we think it got the characters right we'll probably forgive the rickety storytelling. The big complaint about Zack Snyder's movies was that they didn't get Superman and Batman right. Wonder Woman was praised because people thought it got Wonder Woman right.

  6. #36
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    In WW defense, Diana's characterization was pretty spot on. Solid adapting.
    Superhero shows are trash

  7. #37
    Astonishing Member Xalfrea's Avatar
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    Did this really need its own thread? You could've just posted this in the actual MCU thread.

    As to why many people like them and you don't, it's because of simple opinions and taste. Behavior in the Internet may make it seem otherwise, but it's actually GOOD to have different opinions. Just as long as you give a good explanation, stay true to them, and the most important thing of all that a lot of people seem to miss, don't like a complete jerk towards people who have different opinions from you.

  8. #38
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    Chris Evans as Captain America, with the Russo Brothers direction, is just top notch.

    I do wish they'd let some films stand on their own, though. They've started blurring together for me. I haven't even bothered to see the last 2.

    Spiderman will have Robert Downey Jr though so that will be worth it (since I guess we are not getting more IRON MAN solos?)
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  9. #39
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    Oh I'm sorry why should you care about Batman or Superman? Batman because he's broken and at his lowest and has nothing left. Superman because even after dashing the world and choosing humanity over his own people. Sorry they aren't happy about being hated and losing loved ones

    Why should I care about anyone not named Captain America or Iron Man? Ant Man is just a 'nice guy' who makes retarded decisions and forgets his family, Hawkeye has a family for two minutes before like Scott was forgotten, Wanda is an emo who lost her family and again forgotten, Vision is a robot who wants to be human, Falcon is the funny black side kick, War Machine is the funny black side kick, Bruce Banner is just a nice guy, and Thor is either a goof ball or exposition box. I'm sorry but most mcu characters are just kinda flat and have nothing about them

    Dr Strange was okay even though his origin was rushed and was too Iron Man-y, Black Panther just seems angry and knows where the plot is because reasons and Spiderman is well Spiderman not really anything different from past versions but maybe their movies will give them more character

    I just don't see what is so special about most of these characters

  10. #40
    Astonishing Member whiteshark's Avatar
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    After making so many great super heroes movies,this kind of praise is not that exagerated.
    Before MCU movies,one have to remember how uneven were movies inspired in Marvel characters.
    For every good movie as Spider-Man by Sam Raimi,Blade or X-Men movie there were movies as Howard the Duck,the first Fantastic Four movie or the Incredible Hulk movies from the 80s.
    So the MCU movies by making from good to great super hero movies is enough to me to explain such praise as MCU can do no wrong.

  11. #41
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    I'm sorry but the MCU didn't get most characters 'right'

    Take Ant Man. Scott Lang was a bit of a wise ass but still had a more serious side and always put his daughter first. Mcu Ant Man is just Paul Rudd being Paul Rudd, is never series and seems to forget his family. Or Scarlet Witch who is just an emo and again forgets all about her family. To me the most disappointing thing about CW was Wanda not meeting Zemo because they are so much alike

    I could give an essay about how Snyder's Superman and Batman are both great and achieve the core of each character but the point here is Marvel has changed the core of plenty of their characters

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dboi2001 View Post
    Oh I'm sorry why should you care about Batman or Superman? Batman because he's broken and at his lowest and has nothing left. Superman because even after dashing the world and choosing humanity over his own people. Sorry they aren't happy about being hated and losing loved ones

    Why should I care about anyone not named Captain America or Iron Man? Ant Man is just a 'nice guy' who makes retarded decisions and forgets his family, Hawkeye has a family for two minutes before like Scott was forgotten, Wanda is an emo who lost her family and again forgotten, Vision is a robot who wants to be human, Falcon is the funny black side kick, War Machine is the funny black side kick, Bruce Banner is just a nice guy, and Thor is either a goof ball or exposition box. I'm sorry but most mcu characters are just kinda flat and have nothing about them

    Dr Strange was okay even though his origin was rushed and was too Iron Man-y, Black Panther just seems angry and knows where the plot is because reasons and Spiderman is well Spiderman not really anything different from past versions but maybe their movies will give them more character

    I just don't see what is so special about most of these characters
    I goto the movies to have a good time, not see depressed ass people whining and crying about their lives. Already experience that shit in real life. Going into Justice League, other than WW, who am I going to care for. I have no idea what iterations of the other characters are, what their motivations are other than from reading comics. But comic readers probably make up like <1% of the audience. My favorite DC character is Aquaman, so I'm looking forward to seeing how they portray him in JL. But I have no idea of how the DCEU is going to portray his character.

    You not liking those characters is the reason you hate those movies. But you are in the minority, it's as simple as that.

    Like I said different strokes for different folks. If you don't like it don't watch them. I watch them all and enjoy all DC, Marvel, and Fox movies, while the enjoyment lasts. The problem is people constantly have this fanboyish dick waving contest about which ones are better than others because they are made by different corporations who in the end are just after your money. I just don't care for that nonsense. Never have.
    Last edited by Punjabi_Hitman; 06-25-2017 at 06:12 PM.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dboi2001 View Post
    I'm sorry but the MCU didn't get most characters 'right'

    Take Ant Man. Scott Lang was a bit of a wise ass but still had a more serious side and always put his daughter first. Mcu Ant Man is just Paul Rudd being Paul Rudd, is never series and seems to forget his family. Or Scarlet Witch who is just an emo and again forgets all about her family. To me the most disappointing thing about CW was Wanda not meeting Zemo because they are so much alike

    I could give an essay about how Snyder's Superman and Batman are both great and achieve the core of each character but the point here is Marvel has changed the core of plenty of their characters
    Well, different people have different ideas about what fits the core of the character. I'm not saying you must believe that Snyder didn't get Superman, just that people who don't like his version of Superman don't like it because they think he doesn't get the character right. That doesn't mean "Superman and Batman don't kill!" is an absolute rule that a creator must follow, but people who think that's the core of the characters are going to be disappointed.

    So when someone says that a movie got the character right, we're not saying it didn't change anything, just that it seemed to deliver whatever we think is most important about that character. What's interesting is arguing about what is essential to a character, and there are usually a few key things everyone can agree on (Mary Jane Watson = beautiful party girl with red hair; Vision = red-faced robo-guy with phasing powers who falls in love with witch; Jughead = loves hamburgers and doesn't like dating), but different people will have different ideas about what a character absolutely has to be.
    Last edited by gurkle; 06-25-2017 at 05:58 PM.

  14. #44
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    I agree with the OP. The MCU are so cookie cutter that they're practically interchangeable now. They blend together, and those are just the ones that aren't totally unforgettable. I honestly don't remember what happened in Thor two. There's almost no rewatch value for any of them. Is anyone still watching the first Captain America? Or the Incredible Hulk? Or the first Thor? How about the first Avengers?

    If I had to choose, I would take a dumpster fire of a movie over a bore any day of the week. At least dumpster fires can become cult classics.
    Last edited by Namor'sWrath; 06-25-2017 at 07:06 PM.

  15. #45
    Mighty Member Redjack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dboi2001 View Post
    I'm sorry but the MCU didn't get most characters 'right'

    Take Ant Man. Scott Lang was a bit of a wise ass but still had a more serious side and always put his daughter first. Mcu Ant Man is just Paul Rudd being Paul Rudd, is never series and seems to forget his family. Or Scarlet Witch who is just an emo and again forgets all about her family. To me the most disappointing thing about CW was Wanda not meeting Zemo because they are so much alike

    I could give an essay about how Snyder's Superman and Batman are both great and achieve the core of each character but the point here is Marvel has changed the core of plenty of their characters
    Once again.

    No one is attempting to "get it right" by the standards set forth in this thread. Comic Book fans are NOT the core audience of these films and their/our opinions about them have zero value for the reasons I said in the first response post. Different people will disagree about "the core" of a character and NO ONE is "right." it's all subjective. Personally, for instance, I feel Zach Snyder completely failed to make a superman movie, twice now. MILLIONS of people agree. MILLIONS of people disagree.

    no one is right. everyone is right. that's how it works.

    You can't fail at something you weren't trying to do in the first place.

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