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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Masked Guy View Post
    I wouldn't say that I like Mr. Negative, I just think he's the best of a bad bunch. And the story you're thinking of with the Mayan Snow Demon is It Always Snows in April. Personally, I also found that story and villain to be uninteresting and forgettable (and considering that they haven't appeared since, it would seem a lot of other people didn't care for it/them either).

    To clarify, the reason I'm referring to the Brand New Day villains and characters as clunkers is because they've barely (sometimes never have) appeared or been mentioned since their debut stories or that particular era. In fairness, a villain/character I really liked during JMS's run was Charlie Weiderman, but I would also have to declare him a clunker because he hasn't appeared or been mentioned since his 2005 debut.
    Overdrive has had quite a lot of appearences, most prominently as part of superior foes.

    And although not as promintly but Charlie Weiderman has been mentioned/appeared to as a test subject to try and cure molten man. Really more of a cameo then anything really but he did appear.

  2. #17
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    Paper Doll please.
    Every day is a gift, not a given right.

  3. #18
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    Honest clunkers are some of the best parts of a long running book - if everything was classic, or perfect it, would get very old, very fast. Personal fav. Is to go back through a comic like Batman (or Spiderman) and spot the little wtfingf?! moments.

    Recent example - I forgot that dark and broody Pete backhanded a preggers MJ in the 90s clone arc. Jarring in hindsight, but not so bad in full 90s context.

    The caviat on new villains, at least for me, is progression - the ones that stick (asidefrom a Doomsday or Bane that were created to do something big) are the ones that ramp up before doing perm damage.

    I don't think you can plan a classic, with any sort of accuracy, it's that rare combination of great characters, great art, a great story combined with great leadership (editorial). I'm sure there are plenty of surprise hits.

    I'm sure some the best stories ever conceived are sitting in a drawer somewhere because of restrictions; and some of the worse out there should have been relegated to the drawer once the limitations were known.

    Licensed stuff can be a pita (deal with it a lot IRL)

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Negative Zone View Post
    I wanna see Overdrive take on the Spider-Mobile. Anyone else?
    That was ALWAYS my intended second story for Overdrive (and why I set him up as a Spidey fanboy).
    But then Fred Van Lente jumped in and did the bit first! :-D

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    Paper Doll please.
    There *was* a plan to bring Paper Doll back before Ends of the Earth, but the story required Carnage and he was suddenly tied up in mini-series and unavailable in the lead book.

  6. #21
    Extraordinary Member Derek Metaltron's Avatar
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    Oh god please no Paper Dowl! Not only was that the story which brought back MJ in the worst possible way but a serial girl stalker is really not an engaging villainess.

    I will say Menace wasn't too bad, even if she was yet another Green Goblin rip off. And I respect trying to write the same A-List and B-List Spidey villains of the past fifty odd years which feel fresh can be tough and it isn't a bad thing to try and elevate lesser villains sometimes.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Metaltron View Post
    Oh god please no Paper Dowl! Not only was that the story which brought back MJ in the worst possible way but a serial girl stalker is really not an engaging villainess.
    Stalkers are creepy. Creepy lends to good villains. A SUPER-villain stalker is kinda cool. The question is: Who is she stalking now and why?
    I think there's a lot you could do with that. I think of all the good suspense movies that have a stalker as the main antagonist-- and can't help but feel that when you put that through the filter of super hero comics that a really interesting story could come out of it.

  8. #23
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Slott View Post
    Stalkers are creepy. Creepy lends to good villains. A SUPER-villain stalker is kinda cool. The question is: Who is she stalking now and why?
    I think there's a lot you could do with that. I think of all the good suspense movies that have a stalker as the main antagonist-- and can't help but feel that when you put that through the filter of super hero comics that a really interesting story could come out of it.
    It's all in the execution...

  9. #24
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    There is no other Spidey-villain that becomes flat like Paper Doll. She is unique. The stalker aspect is just a happy bonus to make Peter especially uncomfortable (always a good thing).
    Every day is a gift, not a given right.

  10. #25
    Extraordinary Member Derek Metaltron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Slott View Post
    Stalkers are creepy. Creepy lends to good villains. A SUPER-villain stalker is kinda cool. The question is: Who is she stalking now and why?
    I think there's a lot you could do with that. I think of all the good suspense movies that have a stalker as the main antagonist-- and can't help but feel that when you put that through the filter of super hero comics that a really interesting story could come out of it.
    I suppose that is a good premise, maybe she could do with a second chance. Ok Mister Slott, I will try to trust you on this one.

    (Also if you could ever please my inner five year old which remembers his first Spidey comic by bringing back Black Fox for a story down the line you will be awesome.)

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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    It's all in the execution...
    I think that for some people here, if my name's attached to it as solo writer, they'll assume the execution will be terrible.

    I LOVE working with Chris Gage. It's a pleasure AND an honor!

    But one of the extra, unintended side effects is that when some normally critical readers see that a book has been plotted by me and scripted by Chris, that it gives them the freedom to enjoy the story for its scripted parts. And I take great joy when they compliment a line-- and add some snark that since they liked it, it had to come from Chris-- when little do they know, it's one of mine that was already in the plot, or something I added when doing the normal run of lettering corrections and last minute tweaks.

  12. #27
    Take Me Higher The Negative Zone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Slott View Post
    That was ALWAYS my intended second story for Overdrive (and why I set him up as a Spidey fanboy).
    But then Fred Van Lente jumped in and did the bit first! :-D
    I meant the new spider mobile though. Also Overdrive was a humorous character.

  13. #28
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Slott View Post
    I think that for some people here, if my name's attached to it as solo writer, they'll assume the execution will be terrible.
    Though I'm sure those same people would probably have examples of stuff they've read from you to give them that indication to assume as such were they to read it, stuff they didn't personally enjoy the execution of, same as for any writer (Spencer, Bendis, Remender, Bendis, etc.)

    But one of the extra, unintended side effects is that when some normally critical readers see that a book has been plotted by me and scripted by Chris, that it gives them the freedom to enjoy the story for its scripted parts. And I take great joy when they compliment a line-- and add some snark that since they liked it, it had to come from Chris-- when little do they know, it's one of mine that was already in the plot, or something I added when doing the normal run of lettering corrections and last minute tweaks.
    I imagine when a book has a co-writer that many look deep to try and see where the other writers influence is and just how much of their voice is in the book over the original writer, ala Mark Waid and Jeremy Whitley in Avengers.

  14. #29
    Extraordinary Member Derek Metaltron's Avatar
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    I think the general consensus with every comic writer is that they have good stuff and not so good stuff, but it's in the eye of the individual reader. In your case I like some of your stuff and not so much other stuff. Renew Your Vows is more my cup of tea but I respect a lot of what you do, if not all of the execution.

    ...that's all I've got to say about that.

  15. #30
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Metaltron View Post
    I think the general consensus with every comic writer is that they have good stuff and not so good stuff, but it's in the eye of the individual reader. In your case I like some of your stuff and not so much other stuff. Renew Your Vows is more my cup of tea but I respect a lot of what you do, if not all of the execution.

    ...that's all I've got to say about that.
    Same here .

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