Fourth World Question

[zhris]

...what were the first three?

[Timothy Hunter]

https://dcmultiversehistorian.wordpr...-fourth-world/ This webpage has some insight on the matter.

[Carabas]

...what were the first three?

There weren't any, originally.

Any first three worlds you might find in DC lore are retcons.
Jack Kirby called it "The Fouth wordl" because he thought it sounded cool and awesome.

[Lee Stone]

There weren't any, originally.

Any first three worlds you might find in DC lore are retcons.
Jack Kirby called it "The Fouth wordl" because he thought it sounded cool and awesome.

Yeah, it was first referenced on the covers of the fourth issues of New Gods, Forever People and Mister Miracle and likely just stuck.

[CRaymond]

First World refers to industrialized capitalist nations in and around 1960, Second World refers to industrialized communist nations of that time, Third World refers to the impoverished and struggling post-colonial nations remaining.

Those terms have fallen out of fashion in the news, but they were prevalent during the time Kirby was dreaming up "Fourth World" problems.

[Doctor Know]

The Third World of the Old Gods was the Nine Realms of the Marvel Universe.

The New Gods and characters close to mention to the New Gods (i.e. Superman) "Ragnarok" as the cause of the 3rd World's destruction, and you can find Asgardian easter eggs in various New God stories.

Superman - Legends





Legion of Super-Heroes - The Great Darkness Saga

I spy, Thor Odinson and Karnilla The Norn Queen among the Daxamites who are under Darkseid's control.

[Doctor Know]

Orion (1999)

After Orion defeated Darkseid, Kalibak tries to take throne for himself. Desaad amps up Kalibak's strength with a Thunderbelt of the Old Gods.





The same kind of belt Thor received way back in Journey Into Mystery #91.





There are more examples, to be sure.

[Lee Stone]

True.
The most telling would be the splash page that copied the Ragnarok fight scene from Kirby's Tales of the Asgardians back-up series, as well as Thor's helmet making an appearance early in the original Fourth World titles.

The New Gods were originally supposed to be the Asgardians' replacements.
But by that time, Marvel began profiting from licensing for cartoons and non-comics products, and the idea of possibly losing Thor (as retcons weren't as in fashion as they are now) was thought as too risky.
This licensing in the late '60s is also what would inadvertently create 'Marvel Time', as characters became somewhat frozen to prevent any changes that could effect the profitability of the licenses.

And since the New Gods were more of Kirby's idea than Lee's, he took them to DC and kept the ties to Asgard and the Old Gods but made them vague enough where astute readers would pick up on it but it wouldn't attract Marvel's lawyers.

[Darkseid Is]

From Mark Evanier's Afterword in the Fourth World Omnibus

"Jack thought the mythos could flow through any number of books and when DC asked for three bi-monthlies, he settled on The Forever People, Orion and Mister Miracle. The umbrella title for the series was to be The New Gods but then, by accident or design, the Orion book was renamed with that title. Later, for reasons unknown, the overall series came to be known as The Fourth World - or sometimes, Kirby's Fourth World. Even Jack couldn't quite explain the numbering system on that one."

Seems like Jack didn't come up with the name "The Fourth World." Certainly doesn't sound like he knows what the hell it means. I'm pretty sure it has nothing to do with third world countries being impoverished. If we go by that the Fourth World would be even worse than a third world country and that doesn't seem to fit in a world of Gods and super beings.