Why areMarvel's Superheroines Less Popular than DC's?

[Desean101101]

The title is self explainatory. I saw this topic on a forum called Neogaf And I wondered what It would generate on this forum so I decided to post it here in the general Dc thread and the General Marvel thread to see what people come up with.

I think its more of Dc being willing to push them more effectively cross media in Cartoons and giving them very distinct personalities from one another. I can't say the same for some of the more modern Female characters who aren't X-men over at marvel.

[MajorHoy]

First off, you ask why "are Marvel's Superheroines Less Popular than DC's", but have you determined that they are? How and when was it determined?

[Desean101101]

First off, you ask why "are Marvel's Superheroines Less Popular than DC's", but have you determined that they are? How and when was it determined?

I go off more brand recognition and how they are in the popculture consciousness. My Mom barely knows about comicbooks but she remembers Batgirl, Supergirl, Wonder Woman, Lois Lane, Catwomen And Black Canary Because She still remembers Her brother had a Black Canary Poster on his wall that she always thought was a stripper and not a superhero.( Fan-made **** from what my uncle says, Friend of his drew it from a few issues of All Star comics he had)

It just seems Dc Women have a habit of staying in the public sphere more.

[Lee]

Marvel didn't bother making any when they were establishing the foundation of what became the Marvel Universe. The Silver Age only really had Invisible Girl, Marvel Girl, the Wasp and Scarlet Witch - none of them headliners, and often simply defined as being "the girl" on their respective teams.

Chris Claremont & Co introduced a lot of Marvel's most popular female super-heroes in X-Men - Storm, Rogue, Kitty Pride and Jubilee are amongst the best known characters in the series. But again, none of them were created to function as headline acts.

[Rogue Star]

Like I said in the Marvel forum, the Marvel heroines don't have the benefit of being associated with Batman and Superman.

[Sutekh]

DC had Wonder Woman on the TV back when Marvel's only TV offerings were the Hulk and Spider-Man (on the Electric Company). Cartoons that got stuck in the public mind for the generation that watched cartoons on Saturday morning included the Super-Friends (with Wonder Woman, again) and Spider-Man and his Amazing Friends (with Firestar, who was literally invented for the show, and didn't exactly warrant her own series when she transitioned to the comic page).

In later generations, DC put Raven and Starfire into minds with the Teen Titans cartoons, while Marvel was introducing some X-ladies in their X-Men series, but still didn't seem to have the same sort of exposure.

And today, we've got both super-hero TV shows from DC and Marvel, and movies. For TV shows, one of the DC shows is explicitly about a female hero (Supergirl), and heroines are prominent parts of Arrow (various Black Canaries) and the Legends of Tomorrow (Vixen, White Canary, Hawkwoman) and, to a lesser extent, Flash (Jesse Quick, Killer Frost). Marvel's only show on the television for the general audience has had some kickass women (Melinda May, Bobby Morse, Daisy 'Quake' Johnson), but they are, again, either invented for the show, or B-tier, at best. On Netflix, they've got long-lasting established characters like Daredevil (1964), Luke Cage (1972), Iron Fist (1974), and some chick your parents never heard of, invented this century (Jessica Jones, 2001), giving the impression that Marvel doesn't even *like* it's long-lasting female characters.

The movies haven't done much better. DC's barely even started it's meta-universe, and there's already Wonder Woman out there, kicking ass and taking names. Marvel's what, ten movies in? Fifteen? I can't even tell, and their female-led flagship movie is some character that is mostly famous for having lost her powers to Rogue and been knocked up by her own son.

I'm a Marvel fan all day long (despite also loving a lot of DC stuff, like the JSA, All-Star Squadron, Legion of Super-Heroes, Teen Titans, Young Justice, etc.), but Marvel has sucked spectacularly with their handling of their super-heroines, and isn't helped by situations preventing them from getting the most use of classic super-heroines like the Invisible Woman, Storm, Jean Grey, the Wasp, etc.

When you break all the records with an Avengers movie that can't even include the founding Avenger who *named the team,* (the Wasp) because Edgar Wright *might* be using her in an Ant-Man movie that, turns out, he never finished and didn't even include her in the script anyway, and have to use the Black Widow, who was the *third* woman to join the team *eleven years later!*, you've got some problems. Same with Guardians of the Galaxy. The team in it's various incarnations has included powerhouse women like Moondragon, Phyla-Vell, etc. but the writers chose to go with Gamora, who is a tough woman, but operates closer to the Black Widow scale than the Thor scale.

[LifeIsILL]

I like Storm more than any other DC Superheroine.

But with that said, DC has WW, Catwoman, Oracle, Batgirl, Supergirl, Harley Quinn, Starfire, Raven, Wonder Girl.....it's absurd really.

[HandofPrometheus]

Besides the X-ladies and Invisble Woman I find the rest boring and forgetful.

[ed2962]

Marvel didn't bother making any when they were establishing the foundation of what became the Marvel Universe. The Silver Age only really had Invisible Girl, Marvel Girl, the Wasp and Scarlet Witch - none of them headliners, and often simply defined as being "the girl" on their respective teams.

Chris Claremont & Co introduced a lot of Marvel's most popular female super-heroes in X-Men - Storm, Rogue, Kitty Pride and Jubilee are amongst the best known characters in the series. But again, none of them were created to function as headline acts.

They actually did try in the early 70's...(Shanna, The Cat, a Black Widow back up feature etc ) but those didn't catch on. Later attempts ( Spider Woman, She-Hulk, Red Sonja etc ) developed a fan base but didn't make it beyond B-List, C-List status. Characters like Invisible Woman, Storm, are closet Marvel have to female icons, but folks think of them as team members rather than solo stars.

[El_Gato]

Super Hero Girls is a billion dollar merchandising juggernaut, has graphic novels, dtv's and web episodes (lego and regular animation). It's also getting it's own animated series on CN that'll introduce even more fan favorites like Zatanna and Jessica Cruz next year and has a rumored theatrical release in the works.

In terms of comics(solo leads):

1. Wonder Woman
2. Supergirl
3. Catwoman
4. She-Hulk
5. Lois Lane
6. Captain Marvel
7. Spider-Woman
8. Harley Quinn
9. Batgirl (Cassandra Cain)
10. Batgirl (Barbara Gordon)

DC dominates the list and the top 3 aren't changing anytime soon. Harley Quinn will likely pass Spider-Woman soon and has a chance at passing Captain Marvel if her solo continues to double ship.

The reason DC females are more popular/successful is because DC puts in the effort to promote them! DC treats them like equals and uses them in outside media projects all the time! DC Superhero Girls is a prime example of that!

[MajorHoy]

Chris Claremont & Co introduced a lot of Marvel's most popular female super-heroes in X-Men - Storm, Rogue, Kitty Pride and Jubilee are amongst the best known characters in the series.

By the way, Storm was in Giant-Size X-Men #1, which was written by Len Wein with art by Dave Cockrum. Claremont didn't start writing the X-Men until later.

[Nick Miller]

Besides the X-ladies and Invisble Woman I find the rest boring and forgetful.

Yup.

They don't have a niche, or an archetype

[MajorHoy]

Yup.

They don't have a niche, or an archetype

Not even the Spider-females?





and let's not forget

[K. Jones]

I'm sure there's all sorts of promotional and marketing and writing reasons. The women of Marvel tend to be part of big ensemble casts with a lot of favorite characters - the short run of all-women X-Men was rad conceptually and in line-up for instance. Black Widow, particularly in the MCU, is notable lately for always being part of the ensemble. So on, so forth.

But ultimately I actually think it comes down to the costumes.

Wonder Woman, Black Canary, Supergirl, Batgirl, Batwoman, Mera. Dude those costumes. Perez-era Donna Troy, classic Bumblebee, even Spoiler or Huntress or whoever. I mean over the years they've all had some bad looks but usually they get back to the iconic duds. Even like, Liberty Belle has the classic sharp look. Or Cyclone with her adorable look. Or Enchantress, Nightshade or Phantom Lady with their Pulpy, somewhat provocative looks. Or I mean, especially Catwoman, Harley or Ivy, or even Talia, or Maxima, all villainous but not quite.

And each of those ladies is sooooo distinct from one another - like even Batgirl and Batwoman are so distinct from one another.

A sidenote, but I definitely realized writing that list out that only Bumblebee is a black woman. Harley and Batwoman are Jewish and Talia is Middle-Eastern but phew, DC could still use some women of color AND of note, popularity-wise. Bumblebee is an amazing character with a storied and long history as DC's first black superheroine (correct me if I'm wrong there), but she doesn't have the stature and status of a Storm.

DC's hands down most powerful black woman is Amanda Waller, and she's not exactly a role model.

[Agent Z]

I'm sure there's all sorts of promotional and marketing and writing reasons. The women of Marvel tend to be part of big ensemble casts with a lot of favorite characters - the short run of all-women X-Men was rad conceptually and in line-up for instance. Black Widow, particularly in the MCU, is notable lately for always being part of the ensemble. So on, so forth.

But ultimately I actually think it comes down to the costumes.

Wonder Woman, Black Canary, Supergirl, Batgirl, Batwoman, Mera. Dude those costumes. Perez-era Donna Troy, classic Bumblebee, even Spoiler or Huntress or whoever. I mean over the years they've all had some bad looks but usually they get back to the iconic duds. Even like, Liberty Belle has the classic sharp look. Or Cyclone with her adorable look. Or Enchantress, Nightshade or Phantom Lady with their Pulpy, somewhat provocative looks. Or I mean, especially Catwoman, Harley or Ivy, or even Talia, or Maxima, all villainous but not quite.

And each of those ladies is sooooo distinct from one another - like even Batgirl and Batwoman are so distinct from one another.

A sidenote, but I definitely realized writing that list out that only Bumblebee is a black woman. Harley and Batwoman are Jewish and Talia is Middle-Eastern but phew, DC could still use some women of color AND of note, popularity-wise. Bumblebee is an amazing character with a storied and long history as DC's first black superheroine (correct me if I'm wrong there), but she doesn't have the stature and status of a Storm.

DC's hands down most powerful black woman is Amanda Waller, and she's not exactly a role model.

Vixen is DC's most powerful black woman and has a web series. Her ancestor also appears in Legends of Tomorrow