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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeWithoutFear View Post
    Trash. Marvel uses its classic characters as either punching bags, punch lines, or whoopie cushions these days. With love: eff you, Marvel.
    Spider-Man has been a punching bag from the start. The Ditko era constantly had Spidey's public image taking a trashing and the Torch/Spidey relationship started with Johnny always being the golden boy celebrity hero that everyone loved while Spider-Man was the creepy threat and/or menace that was always fouling up.

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeWithoutFear View Post
    Agree. Modern writers seem prohibited from portraying classic characters as anything but deeply flawed.
    Yes, darn those modern writers.

    Oh wait.

    ironman_bottle.jpg

    When people complain about Marvel writers making characters flawed, I have to wonder if they've ever actually read Marvel. These characters were created with feet of clay. The whole thing that made Marvel unique is that its character were deeply flawed.

    Quote Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
    This pretty much sums up why I have been down on not just Spidey but most of Marvel the last few years: where is the heroic stance and respect these characters should generate? I am pretty tired of Spidey being portrayed as little more than a court jester who needs help to defeat B-list villains; it seems like it has been forever that we have had a story that showcases Peter's heart and never-say-die spirit that used to be at the core of his character.
    "Been forever?" Those stories are still told ALL THE TIME. Whether it be Peter actually returning from the dead to prove himself the true Superior Spider-Man (literally displaying his never-say-die spirit) to leading a multi-verse of Spider people in Spider-verse to taking on global threats like Zodiac (during the course of which he survived a freaking plummet from space) to routing the plans of a Symkaria-aligned Norman Osborn, Spidey's doing ok for himself.

    It's not like he's begging for help against the return of the Kangaroo.

    Does he come off a little too goofy in Z'Darsky's SSM? I think so. But I also don't think it's nearly as bad as some are acting.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    Spider-Man has been a punching bag from the start. The Ditko era constantly had Spidey's public image taking a trashing and the Torch/Spidey relationship started with Johnny always being the golden boy celebrity hero that everyone loved while Spider-Man was the creepy threat and/or menace that was always fouling up.



    Yes, darn those modern writers.

    Oh wait.

    ironman_bottle.jpg

    When people complain about Marvel writers making characters flawed, I have to wonder if they've ever actually read Marvel. These characters were created with feet of clay. The whole thing that made Marvel unique is that its character were deeply flawed.



    "Been forever?" Those stories are still told ALL THE TIME. Whether it be Peter actually returning from the dead to prove himself the true Superior Spider-Man (literally displaying his never-say-die spirit) to leading a multi-verse of Spider people in Spider-verse to taking on global threats like Zodiac (during the course of which he survived a freaking plummet from space) to routing the plans of a Symkaria-aligned Norman Osborn, Spidey's doing ok for himself.

    It's not like he's begging for help against the return of the Kangaroo.

    Does he come off a little too goofy in Z'Darsky's SSM? I think so. But I also don't think it's nearly as bad as some are acting.
    I agree

    After reading many Spider-Man comics , I strongly believe that Peter Parker is neurotic.

  3. #63
    Mighty Member oldschool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    You didn't laugh at the barista's response to Spider-Man saying he saved New York City "Same here, I used to be in the New Warriors"?

    I thought this was the one semi-decent gag in the book but it still required me looking past Spidey in a jacket in a Starbucks. For me, this book just required too much suspension of disbelief on top of the requisite amount of suspension of disbelief that goes with reading a super-hero comic. Mets, what did you think of the first two issues overall?

  4. #64
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
    I thought this was the one semi-decent gag in the book but it still required me looking past Spidey in a jacket in a Starbucks. For me, this book just required too much suspension of disbelief on top of the requisite amount of suspension of disbelief that goes with reading a super-hero comic. Mets, what did you think of the first two issues overall?
    I think it's fun, but a bit dopey.

    The art is generally nice.

    The storytelling is a bit flawed. When I read the first issue, I though the point of the scene in Chicago was that Peter tracked down someone who hacked his tech, and found a new supervillain who had been using the Iron Man armor, so the appearance of Ironheart in the second issue threw me a bit.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    I think it's fun, but a bit dopey.

    The art is generally nice.

    The storytelling is a bit flawed. When I read the first issue, I though the point of the scene in Chicago was that Peter tracked down someone who hacked his tech, and found a new supervillain who had been using the Iron Man armor, so the appearance of Ironheart in the second issue threw me a bit.
    Heh, I thought the same thing when I read it. But after two seconds I realized, oh no, that's Ironheart.

  6. #66
    "Emma is STILL right! Vegeta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    Spider-Man has been a punching bag from the start. The Ditko era constantly had Spidey's public image taking a trashing and the Torch/Spidey relationship started with Johnny always being the golden boy celebrity hero that everyone loved while Spider-Man was the creepy threat and/or menace that was always fouling up.
    There is a difference in the tonality of the two though. Modern writers have flanderized the character to the point where "childish butt monkey" is his regular default depiction. The older comics may have had him loathed by the public (mostly due to Jameson's smear campaign) but his reputation among his superhero peers steadily increased throughout the years (ie: Marvel Team Up). By the 90's, many of the new young heroes like Darkhawk treated him with respect because of this, and Pete was shown to be the capable mentor-like figure they could relate to.
    "The White Queen welcomes you, TO DIE!"

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegeta View Post
    There is a difference in the tonality of the two though. Modern writers have flanderized the character to the point where "childish butt monkey" is his regular default depiction. The older comics may have had him loathed by the public (mostly due to Jameson's smear campaign) but his reputation among his superhero peers steadily increased throughout the years (ie: Marvel Team Up). By the 90's, many of the new young heroes like Darkhawk treated him with respect because of this, and Pete was shown to be the capable mentor-like figure they could relate to.
    There was a Green Goblin story in the original Stan Lee/Steve Ditko run. Spider-Man runs out of his fight with Green Goblin because he hears that his aunt May is sick iirc. And the public thinks he's a total coward. But Johnny was also there, and he thought that Spidey wouldn't run out like that, there must be a reason. At this time, these two didn't even know each other that much.

    And now, he wants Ironheart's autograph.

  8. #68
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    Congrats to eisner award winning Chip [he won best humor publication for Jughead]



    https://www.newsarama.com/35554-2017...full-list.html

  9. #69
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miles To Go View Post
    Congrats to eisner award winning Chip [he won best humor publication for Jughead]



    https://www.newsarama.com/35554-2017...full-list.html
    I may not enjoy his take on Spider-Man that much, but congratulations to Mr. Zdarksy .

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpiderClops View Post
    There was a Green Goblin story in the original Stan Lee/Steve Ditko run. Spider-Man runs out of his fight with Green Goblin because he hears that his aunt May is sick iirc. And the public thinks he's a total coward. But Johnny was also there, and he thought that Spidey wouldn't run out like that, there must be a reason. At this time, these two didn't even know each other that much.

    And now, he wants Ironheart's autograph.
    Quite the contrast, isn't it?

  11. #71
    Jesus Christ, redeemer! The Whovian's Avatar
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    I tried the first two issues, but this book just isn't doing anything for me. I'll probably stick with it for another few issues, but if I don't like it much more by then, I'm dropping it.
    “Now faith, hope, and love remain, and the greatest of these is love.”--1 Corinthians 13:13

    “You had a dream; I have a plan”--Cyclops

    “There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes.”--The Doctor

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by stillanerd View Post
    I have forthcoming review of this issue, so I won't go into great detail here. But I agree with most reactions on the board. This issue was bad. Worse, it was dull. And even more worse was Zdarsky's depiction of Spider-Man. I thought the autograph bit from the preview was awful. But when Spidey is going "WHEEE!" while hitching a ride on Ironheart's back? Good grief!
    And here's my full review:

    Stillanerd Reviews: Peter Parker: The Spectacular Spider-Man #2 review

    Quote Originally Posted by Miles To Go View Post
    Congrats to eisner award winning Chip [he won best humor publication for Jughead]



    https://www.newsarama.com/35554-2017...full-list.html
    Indeed! Sincere congrats to Chip Zdarsky on winning the Eisner.
    --Mike McNulty, a.k.a. Stillanerd. Contributor for Bam Smack Pow! and Viral Hare
    Previous Articles for Whatever A Spider Can.
    Previous Articles for Spider-Man Crawlspace.

    Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason why it was put up.--G.K. Chesterton

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by stillanerd View Post
    And to think that you were pretty optimistic with the first issue, Mike...

  14. #74
    Incredible Member JoeWithoutFear's Avatar
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    @Prof Warren

    This is a major difference between the eras in which heroic characters had flaws (which actually is the best kind of fiction) and characters being segregated into groups that boil down to "completely damaged or ridiculous" and "infallible! being a super hero is totes easy! LOL!"

    If you haven't noticed this division in modern Marvel writing, then I envy you. =) Please continue to enjoy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vegeta View Post
    There is a difference in the tonality of the two though. Modern writers have flanderized the character to the point where "childish butt monkey" is his regular default depiction. The older comics may have had him loathed by the public (mostly due to Jameson's smear campaign) but his reputation among his superhero peers steadily increased throughout the years (ie: Marvel Team Up). By the 90's, many of the new young heroes like Darkhawk treated him with respect because of this, and Pete was shown to be the capable mentor-like figure they could relate to.
    Bingo!

    Quote Originally Posted by SpiderClops View Post
    There was a Green Goblin story in the original Stan Lee/Steve Ditko run. Spider-Man runs out of his fight with Green Goblin because he hears that his aunt May is sick iirc. And the public thinks he's a total coward. But Johnny was also there, and he thought that Spidey wouldn't run out like that, there must be a reason. At this time, these two didn't even know each other that much.

    And now, he wants Ironheart's autograph.
    Double bingo!
    Me: "Wanna be Hawkeye and Hawkeye next Halloween?"
    My wife: "Only if I get to be Clint."

  15. #75
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    I totally don't understand how to read this series! The tone - the tone! How can one writer manage to have so many exclamation marks on one page!

    The exclamation marks really explain the entire series to me. It feels way too heightened to be realistic and it seems like a parody of Spider-Man - I actually find some of the lame humour quite funny, but it doesn't feel in any sense of form naturalistic. I mean, the problem was on the first page of issue #1 I read Johnny's voice to be deadpan, no emotions, and all the scripts actually benefit (at least for me) reading every character as flatly as possible as it seems to fit Zdarsky's style, which is way too on the nose. The comic would benefit from half of the jokes being removed as it makes Peter seem like a series of memes instead of a person.

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