Gal Gadot to star in Wonder Woman II

[Nyssane]

It's crazy how people are so quick to accept Cheetah's jobbings but not her accomplishments.

[SiegePerilous02]

It's crazy how people are so quick to accept Cheetah's jobbings but not her accomplishments.

When they happen, people are quick to dismiss it because they for some reason give priority to the weaker showings. Even though all of them happened AFTER Perez established her.

Movie going audiences thankfully do not care either way yet.

[AmiMizuno]

One thing I’m curious about is how if it’s correcred that’s Steve will be back it fits with JL and Wonder Woman’s first movie. I mean she said I know of the pain someone giving up their life for you. Or the fact she says thanks for being him back to me. I wonder if this mena sthe Steve we see willnot be the real Steve but since nothing is confirmed we have to wait and see.

[WonderScott]

I’d be up for Barbara Minerva and Doctor Psycho in this film, similarly to how Ares and Doctor Poison were in her inaugural film. Jenkins managed to have a few villainous characters without it turning into a Schumacher Batman film.

Barbara’s descent into Cheetah-ness could start in this film, with a full-on Cheetah in the third film with Circe. Give Barbara a little more room to develop as a character.

Doctor Psycho could be the reason behind Steve’s reappearance in Diana’s life.

[BiteTheBullet]

Batman's also defeated Diana and Superman, so I guess they both suck too. On the other hand, Cheetah's defeated Superman in the Brave and the Bold cartoon and in Geoff Johns's arc, where she also swatted Batman aside rather easily.



World ending threats don't automatically lead to a better movie, and Cheetah is a personal one, which frequently does. Having Superman job to her is unnecessary. He's stronger than Wonder Woman...so what? He's not in the movie. She hopefully will not be appearing in his if it ever happens.

Cheetah has had little trouble fighting a Wonder Woman who flies. I wouldn't rule it out. And even if her flight doesn't happen, there are more important criteria to judge a film.

Wonder Woman being challenged by Cheetah isn't jobbing for her either. It's been established that it can happen in Wonder Woman's own book by her own authors, not by authors of other properties. WW's very creator invented the Cheetah as a nemesis for her, and that version didn't have the powers later ones had.



She already has a self contained movie that's all about her, and this one likely will as well.

Her self contained movie is set in a universe where the events of the Justice League, MoS, SS and BvS all occurred in. I cannot separate the two because of her poor showing/jobbing to Superman and Steppenwolf. It happened and that is that. Unless we can be convinced that the events of Justice League was all some sort of deranged dream of Supermans while he was laying dormant in the tomb, it can't be undone. This version of Wonder Woman, as well as every other character not named Superman, is pretty much worthless when it comes to world ending events. Just have Supes take over and save the day since the other members of the Justice League can't do it together as a team without his help. And that is playing loosely with the term 'help', since the Justice League movie has shown that Supes only needed Cyborg's help and that was more for intel than anything else.

So...let Wonder Woman have her rogues in the form of the Cheetah. It probably won't be a world ending type of event since I don't think the Cheetah is that type of threat. Maybe Circe as the big heavy and having Cheetah as her muscle could be the threat Wondy needs. At least with Circe, since magic is totally undefined, she can pretty much do anything and we can't really question it, because its magic. Come to think of it, Wonder Womans power at the end of her solo movie was pretty much undefined/unexplained so hopefully they don't go that route again.

As far as Batman beating Superman, if we believe that kryptonite is common enough that Batman pretty much has an endless supply of it and uses it in battle against Supes, I can see why he can win in that scenario. Take away kryptonite, and Batman should lose 100% of the time. As far as Batman beating Wonder Woman, if you are talking about the kick to the stomach, well it is technically canon the same as his one punch to Cheetah. I guess Wondy isn't as tough as we thought then.

World ending threats might not automatically make a movie good, but don't tell that to the writers of comic book movies. I think all of the DCEU movies had world ending threats as a plot device, so I am thinking it is a good bet that it will be again another plot point in the new Wondy solo movie.

As far as Wondy not flying, so be it. I have already given up on that. Apparently she will not fly in this version of the DCEU. After her appearance in 3 movies with no ability to fly as of yet, I ain't gonna hold my breath till she does. I guess only Cyborg (who has never flown before) and Superman can only fly. Way to go DCEU to take away a power of the premier superheroine of all time.

[Punisher007]

After Spider-Man: Homecoming managed to make freaking Vulture into a menacing and interesting villain, I refuse to believe that the same cannot be done with Cheetah as well.

And once again a big and emphatic NO to Cheetah being reduced to Circe's lackey/muscle.

[BiteTheBullet]

After Spider-Man: Homecoming managed to make freaking Vulture into a menacing and interesting villain, I refuse to believe that the same cannot be done with Cheetah as well.

And once again a big and emphatic NO to Cheetah being reduced to Circe's lackey/muscle.

Not really apples to apples. Spidey is considered to be a 'street level' type of hero. And Vulture was totally reimagined into a different type of villain than he was previously portrayed in the comics (disclaimer: I used to read Spidey before the clone saga, so if Vulture has changed since then, I know nothing about that).

Maybe they can reimagine and make Cheetah into a threat formidable enough that the audience can get behind this and not think that Batman can one punch her with impunity. If casting rumours are correct, Emma Stone isn't going to be the one to convince me of that.

[SiegePerilous02]

Her self contained movie is set in a universe where the events of the Justice League, MoS, SS and BvS all occurred in. I cannot separate the two because of her poor showing/jobbing to Superman and Steppenwolf. It happened and that is that. Unless we can be convinced that the events of Justice League was all some sort of deranged dream of Supermans while he was laying dormant in the tomb, it can't be undone. This version of Wonder Woman, as well as every other character not named Superman, is pretty much worthless when it comes to world ending events. Just have Supes take over and save the day since the other members of the Justice League can't do it together as a team without his help. And that is playing loosely with the term 'help', since the Justice League movie has shown that Supes only needed Cyborg's help and that was more for intel than anything else..

You're letting ONE fight scene in another movie determine how you feel about her franchise? Considering what a flop JL was, the solo WW sequel is unlikely to reference anything in it anyway. Worse things have happened to her, power level wise and characterization wise, in the actual comics outside of her book. People don't automatically stop enjoying her book because of what happened in another.

Maybe it's time to accept the fact WW is not actually as strong as Superman? I know many of her fans don't want to admit it, but we have had various instances in her own books that she's not on that power level. Rucka gave us the answer of why she does Bullets and Bracelets in his last run after a high caliber bullet went through her. Unless it's laced with Kryptonite, that's not something that would happen to Clark, Kara or Karen. Note that it also didn't keep her down for long and she was kicking the Shaggy Man's ass the next day. Her most enduring villains are also not global threats in the way, say, Brainiac is.

So...let Wonder Woman have her rogues in the form of the Cheetah. It probably won't be a world ending type of event since I don't think the Cheetah is that type of threat. Maybe Circe as the big heavy and having Cheetah as her muscle could be the threat Wondy needs. At least with Circe, since magic is totally undefined, she can pretty much do anything and we can't really question it, because its magic..

A lot of her enduring villains are already on the Cheetah's level. And making Barbara Ann one of Circe's grunts would be a terrible idea. She doesn't need to be, especially as she's arguably the more popular choice for archnemesis.

Circe isn't a world ending threat either, at least not a good one. War of the Gods and Amazons Attack both sucked, and Batman defeated her in a magic battle. Which is BS, but she's not a clear better choice than Cheetah based on her own track record.

I guess Wondy isn't as tough as we thought then..

Precisely what I said. Both instances are stupid and we should not hold that defeat against Cheetah any more than we do the other one for Diana.

World ending threats might not automatically make a movie good, but don't tell that to the writers of comic book movies. I think all of the DCEU movies had world ending threats as a plot device, so I am thinking it is a good bet that it will be again another plot point in the new Wondy solo movie..

And all the DCEU movies have done poorly or mixed critically. WW was a little more thoughtful in having a villain take advantage of mankind's own weaknesses, and her movie was the most successful. Hopefully Patty Jenkins won't take a stupid pill and do a dumb invasion plot. Or at least not do it for the simple reason that Superman does it and we need to prove that Wonder Woman is exactly the same as him but a woman.

Way to go DCEU to take away a power of the premier superheroine of all time.

They didn't take anything away, because the majority of Wonder Woman's incarnations either don't fly right away or don't fly at all. Maybe she will in the DCEU and maybe they won't. I doubt it has anything to do with Superman, and more that the casual audiences don't remember Lynda Carter ever flying.

[BiteTheBullet]

You're letting ONE fight scene in another movie determine how you feel about her franchise? Considering what a flop JL was, the solo WW sequel is unlikely to reference anything in it anyway. Worse things have happened to her, power level wise and characterization wise, in the actual comics outside of her book. People don't automatically stop enjoying her book because of what happened in another.

Maybe it's time to accept the fact WW is not actually as strong as Superman? I know many of her fans don't want to admit it, but we have had various instances in her own books that she's not on that power level. Rucka gave us the answer of why she does Bullets and Bracelets in his last run after a high caliber bullet went through her. Unless it's laced with Kryptonite, that's not something that would happen to Clark, Kara or Karen. Note that it also didn't keep her down for long and she was kicking the Shaggy Man's ass the next day. Her most enduring villains are also not global threats in the way, say, Brainiac is.



A lot of her enduring villains are already on the Cheetah's level. And making Barbara Ann one of Circe's grunts would be a terrible idea. She doesn't need to be, especially as she's arguably the more popular choice for archnemesis.

Circe isn't a world ending threat either, at least not a good one. War of the Gods and Amazons Attack both sucked, and Batman defeated her in a magic battle. Which is BS, but she's not a clear better choice than Cheetah based on her own track record.



Precisely what I said. Both instances are stupid and we should not hold that defeat against Cheetah any more than we do the other one for Diana.



And all the DCEU movies have done poorly or mixed critically. WW was a little more thoughtful in having a villain take advantage of mankind's own weaknesses, and her movie was the most successful. Hopefully Patty Jenkins won't take a stupid pill and do a dumb invasion plot. Or at least not do it for the simple reason that Superman does it and we need to prove that Wonder Woman is exactly the same as him but a woman.



They didn't take anything away, because the majority of Wonder Woman's incarnations either don't fly right away or don't fly at all. Maybe she will in the DCEU and maybe they won't. I doubt it has anything to do with Superman, and more that the casual audiences don't remember Lynda Carter ever flying.

For over 30 years she has been shown to fly with very little exception, and I am not talking about air currents. So yes, most people, even the casual ones, have probably seen her fly either in the comics or on the Justice League TV show or in the animated movies. There are exceptions like her animated solo movie, but again that seems like her only exception in the cartoon medium, which would have reached the most widespread amount of people prior to her movie. So...yes, they took away a pretty important power, one she has had for close to over half her existence from the mid '80's onward.

Don't care about why the Lynda Carter version didn't fly, because she only was gliding on air currents during the comics in that time period, and that is a stupid as hell power to have. Flying back in the 70's on TV would have also looked seriously stupid. That, and the fact that she was the only superhero established in her corner of the TV universe didn't make me miss her gift of 'gliding'.

And I have said this many times including others on this board. I know Superman is stronger. Don't care. The fact that she seriously jobbed to him in the Justice League movie is what gets my criticism as well as others here. She should have at least fared better than what was shown, and as a result this does impact my enjoyment of her in future endeavors. That is, until they entirely reboot the universe and get the characters as well as their various powers properly shown.

Superman stronger than Wonder Woman....sure, no problem with that.

Superman, faster than Wonder Woman....sure, no problem with that

Superman, so much faster that it renders Wonder Womans reflexes void.....I have a problem with that.

Superman not getting affected by the lasso.... I have a problem with that

Superman being so much stronger and faster that the entire league can't stop him...yes, I have a problem with that

Superman being able to fly when Diana cannot...yes I have a problem with that.

Superman, in the DCEU, establishing that Wonder Woman, among others has absolutely zero chance of stopping him...yes, I have a problem with that. They didn't even give Wondy a chance to use her vaunted fighting skill because Supes was too fast for that. Has Wondy even shown her vaunted skill against someone that was also skilled in combat throughout the DCEU yet?

So please don't use the strawman argument that I, and others, want Wonder Woman to be as strong as Superman. Most here have never said that. But her combination of speed, reflexes and martial skill is what most here hang onto when the inevitable fight occurs between her and Superman. At least to equal out the odds somewhat, but we can see what the people in the DCEU think about that. That and the fact she will apparently never fly in this version. Good way to throw out the last 30 plus years of canon.

[dianafan1985]

Maybe it's time to accept the fact WW is not actually as strong as Superman?

Yes she is, and was designed to be as strong as Superman. Any person who claims that he or she desires for her to be weaker, cannot be a fan of the same character which Marston created. In BvS, she more than proved that she was in the same category as Superman: she took knocks from a more powerful villain than Superman and Steppenwolf combined with a freaking grin on her face. She knocked Doomsday off his feet, and sliced his arm. Lois Lane and Amanda Waller couldn't do that bud. Wonder Woman could because she is designed to be as strong as Superman and any other Kryptonian. In WW, she went toe to toe with arguably the most powerful Greek god in the pantheon, and brutally was successful. What does that tell me? She ain't no weakling, and she should have been portrayed on a "certain" level in the following film.

In fact, what I have been gathering on the internet is that the motherbox made Superman overpowered, and after watching the film again, I missed where the box was described to be very powerful that it could destroy entire planets. This was the device used to bring the "man of steel" back to life, which could explain him performing on power overcharge, and which made the other characters seem useless to him.

[DochaDocha]

Yes she is, and was designed to be as strong as Superman. Any person who claims that he or she desires for her to be weaker, cannot be a fan of the same character which Marston created.

I'd just point out that there's what was originally intended, and what ended up happening.

You look at Marvel, Thor was meant to be more powerful than Hulk. The rationale was that Hulk was the strongest man (human) alive, but a god could surpass the best of men. So, Thor was meant to be stronger than Hulk, as per the creator's intentions, but nobody is beholden to this rationale and many stories would have you believe Hulk is stronger.

In the end, it's based on what the writer wants.

[Gaelforce]

Just a friendly moderator reminder to keep this debate civil and on topic, please

[Vanguard-01]

Batman's creators intended him to be a pretty smart guy with decent fighting skills, who wears purple gloves and mows criminals down with a Tommy gun.

They never wrote one word about him being a super genius who can come up with world-changing technology on a whim or that he's a master of every martial art or that he can humiliate godlike beings with elaborate-but-not-really plans.

And world-ending threats are becoming stale. Especially by now, the audience knows that the world will not really be destroyed because that would prevent future stories.

I'd like to see a reduction of world-ending threats for ALL heroes, thank you very much.

[dianafan1985]

I'd just point out that there's what was originally intended, and what ended up happening.

What ended up happening was that many stories portrayed them to be on the same level of power and strength, over the many decades of their existence. Why do some people choose to discredit those stories is the real question.

You look at Marvel, Thor was meant to be more powerful than Hulk. The rationale was that Hulk was the strongest man (human) alive, but a god could surpass the best of men. So, Thor was meant to be stronger than Hulk, as per the creator's intentions, but nobody is beholden to this rationale and many stories would have you believe Hulk is stronger.

Did the creator of Thor stated blatantly like the creator of Wonder Woman, that his character was to possess a particular measure of strength to another character? Because Marston clearly stated that she is to be equal in strength to Superman, and thats what we see in many of the stories today.

[DochaDocha]

What ended up happening was that many stories portrayed them to be on the same level of power and strength, over the many decades of their existence. Why do some people choose to discredit those stories is the real question.



Did the creator of Thor stated blatantly like the creator of Wonder Woman, that his character was to possess a particular measure of strength to another character? Because Marston clearly stated that she is to be equal in strength to Superman, and thats what we see in many of the stories today.

Yes, Stan Lee said Thor is stronger. Subsequent writers have often ignored that.