Mockingbird's "Ask Me About My Feminist Agenda" T-shirt popping up in ASM

[Confuzzled]

If you threaten or abuse someone, you open yourself up to be "doxxed".

You as in not YOU you. Anyone who threatens or abuses a real life person over fiction I mean.

[Yagamifire]

If you threaten or abuse someone, you open yourself up to be "doxxed".

You as in not YOU you. Anyone who threatens or abuses a real life person over fiction I mean.

Lmao you just backtracked your own statement so fast its ridiculous. "No feminist has done that bad thing that people shouldn't do! Okay now let me tell you why doing that bad thing is actually fine!"

Btw I feel you just abused me by invalidating my feelings on Gamergate.

You're cool if I dox you now right?

[Mister Mets]

If you're referencing some kind of news story, give a link so that others can get the context of the story.

Yea, as others have said, it's absolutely been a topic in other media. But, it's been a bigger push in comics, and recently in gaming, because they *are* more fringe and thus trying to impose changes on them will upset fewer people and present fewer nuanced opinions to counter. Additionally, since that audience is geeky guys who tend to be easier to push around, there is more room for success. As proof, you can look to football/cheerleader culture (ya know, real life) and you will not find even a fraction of people trying to shout at those cultures about telling the girls to cover up and/or telling society to stop enabling cheerleading in general.

The left isn't going to tell actual women to cover up, because they would be worried about accusations of slut-shaming.

One big difference between video games/ comics and sports is that the latter deals with real women who make the decision to wear cheerleading uniforms. Comics tend to be illustrations; video games tend to be animations.

I would also guess that the majority of sports fans wouldn't care about what's said about cheerleading in a feminist blog. They don't engage with that culture. Since they pay a lot of money for ESPN and sports tickets, the team owners don't care.

[Mister Mets]

Lmao you just backtracked your own statement so fast its ridiculous. "No feminist has done that bad thing that people shouldn't do! Okay now let me tell you why doing that bad thing is actually fine!"

Btw I feel you just abused me by invalidating my feelings on Gamergate.

You're cool if I dox you now right?

He said "When did feminists send rape/mutilation threats and post addresses of people they were attacking online?"

He's not saying it never happens, nor would finding an example of it happening once disprove his larger point.

Also, did Antos actually post the guy's address or send him rape/ mutilation threats?

[Confuzzled]

He said "When did feminists send rape/mutilation threats and post addresses of people they were attacking online?"

He's not saying it never happens, nor would finding an example of it happening once disprove his larger point.

Also, did Antos actually post the guy's address or send him rape/ mutilation threats?

I looked it up. The Diversity & Comics guy attacked the women on social media out of his own free will, questioning their professional and personal integrity with this golden comment:

The Milkshake Crew is a gaggle of Fake Geek Girls who were hired to be Diversity window dressing. Fraud & Distraction.

He then made an entire video calling her out by name and vilifying her and her coworkers: Heather Antos' Milkshake Crew Is SJW Marvel's Legion Of Doom

Apparently the only "doxxing" Antos did was make an observation about how interesting it was that the guy was present at Charlottesville on the day of the protests. She personally didn't accuse him of anything, she just stated her observation. So he played victim despite being the first one to directly demean her and her coworkers.

Edit: He's now claiming that someone's stalking him and Antos aided his stalker, but that is a pretty serious accusation and if true, I don't know why he hasn't filed a complaint with the police instead of calling out Antos on yet another YT video containing screenshots of people siding with him and criticizing Antos for the same.

[JoeWithoutFear]

@Mister Mets

If the whole argument is that these images are harmful for women (and boys) to see, then them taking place in real life would be exponentially more "damaging" than on a comic page or a game animation. So, if the desire to not slut-shame mature adults is higher than the desire to protect "impressionable" young minds from "damaging" content, then maybe the argument isn't that strong to begin with.

@Confuzzled

We just see things differently. It depends on where one hits the start button on the timer, ya know? Personally, to me, the attacks began against gamers long before GG started. The attacks against comic book fans began long before MMM. Feminists like Anita Sarkeesian and media outlets like Kotaku and Polygon were calling gamers misogynistic and racist and so on. I don't know about you, but most people do not respond well to being called bigoted when they aren't. Marvel comics has essentially done the same over the last few years as they've turned most of their writing into very polarized and divisive political rhetoric. Much of the time any character that is straight, white, and male is treated like some kind of inherently problematic figure. And if you don't feel that way, the response from the culture has been that you are a bigot of some kind. Again, people do not respond well to that. That's when things got ugly, and I don't condone that ugliness at all, from either side, but I can understand it.

So, that's where things started for me. And if you feel that is unjustified, that's fine, no one here can change your mind or should try to. For you, the clock didn't start ticking until the ugly backlash began -- probably because you saw nothing aggressive or inaccurate about the initial implications of bigotry among geek culture. Again, that's fine if you see it that way, but many of us didn't.

[MetalWoman]

Never understood what the MMM controversy was about on the anti-MMM side. Some Marvel women take a selfie having some milkshakes in memory of Flo Steinberg, and somehow that was offensive to the anti-MMM side?

[JoeWithoutFear]

Never understood what the MMM controversy was about on the anti-MMM side. Some Marvel women take a selfie having some milkshakes in memory of Flo Steinberg, and somehow that was offensive to the anti-MMM side?

Except that that wasn't the source of the controversy at all. =)

1. Female Marvel employees post selfie of themselves with milkshakes.
2. Literally 2 or 3 random people on Twitter mildly insulted (relative to life on the internet) the girls in the photo and one said they looked like fake geek girls.
3. The feminist social media ecosystem then erupted in cries of harassment and misogyny and oppression. Using this as cold, hard evidence of the sexist nature of the comic book industry and its fans.
4. Comic fans, who are already sick of being implied as evil, erupted back basically saying "eff you for trying to label us that just because you endured the mildest of internet friction."
5. Then the blood bath ensued when the media amplified the victim status because in this day and age, sex sells, but sexism sells waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy better.
6. People (including several from throughout the comic industry) continue to pile on by virtue-signaling that they are supporting the now victimed girls, because these days, silence is considered violence. And it becomes this whole movement.... because apparently, not only should girls be treated differently than men, but the reaction to not doing so should be swift, absolute, and, when necessary*, highly prioritize a sense of justice at the expense of rational thought.

*note: it is never not deemed necessary

And there you have it.

[nnelg]

If you threaten or abuse someone, you open yourself up to be "doxxed".

You as in not YOU you. Anyone who threatens or abuses a real life person over fiction I mean.

How exactly did Diversity & Comics threaten Antos? Was it by reviewing Gwenpool and praising it? Doesn't Antos write that? Also from what I have seen he has "abused" anyone either. He cracks bad jokes and rips comics to get views. He even said his views go down when he reviews good comics.

[MetalWoman]

Except that that wasn't the source of the controversy at all. =)

1. Female Marvel employees post selfie of themselves with milkshakes.
2. Literally 2 or 3 random people on Twitter mildly insulted (relative to life on the internet) the girls in the photo and one said they looked like fake geek girls.
3. The feminist social media ecosystem then erupted in cries of harassment and misogyny and oppression. Using this as cold, hard evidence of the sexist nature of the comic book industry and its fans.
4. Comic fans, who are already sick of being implied as evil, erupted back basically saying "eff you for trying to label us that just because you endured the mildest of internet friction."
5. Then the blood bath ensued when the media amplified the victim status because in this day and age, sex sells, but sexism sells waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy better.
6. People (including several from throughout the comic industry) continue to pile on by virtue-signaling that they are supporting the now victimed girls, because these days, silence is considered violence. And it becomes this whole movement.... because apparently, not only should girls be treated differently than men, but the reaction to not doing so should be swift, absolute, and, when necessary*, highly prioritize a sense of justice at the expense of rational thought.

*note: it is never not deemed necessary

And there you have it.

So basically a bunch of random guys thought calling out internet trolls attacking women toasting a dead mentor was somehow an attack on all comic fans? And the MMM response of creating a bunch of fan art of comic book characters drinking milkshakes is a blood bath inflicted on said guys.

Yah, one side seems to think women need to be treated differently than men, and any failure to do so should result in swift, absolute and highly prioritized justice at the expense of rational thought, but it is not the MMM side.

[nnelg]

I don't use social media much but how exactly is two to three tweets an attack?

[Mister Mets]

A handful of posts were deleted, when one poster got rather rude.

@Mister Mets

If the whole argument is that these images are harmful for women (and boys) to see, then them taking place in real life would be exponentially more "damaging" than on a comic page or a game animation. So, if the desire to not slut-shame mature adults is higher than the desire to protect "impressionable" young minds from "damaging" content, then maybe the argument isn't that strong to begin with.

@Confuzzled

We just see things differently. It depends on where one hits the start button on the timer, ya know? Personally, to me, the attacks began against gamers long before GG started. The attacks against comic book fans began long before MMM. Feminists like Anita Sarkeesian and media outlets like Kotaku and Polygon were calling gamers misogynistic and racist and so on. I don't know about you, but most people do not respond well to being called bigoted when they aren't. Marvel comics has essentially done the same over the last few years as they've turned most of their writing into very polarized and divisive political rhetoric. Much of the time any character that is straight, white, and male is treated like some kind of inherently problematic figure. And if you don't feel that way, the response from the culture has been that you are a bigot of some kind. Again, people do not respond well to that. That's when things got ugly, and I don't condone that ugliness at all, from either side, but I can understand it.

So, that's where things started for me. And if you feel that is unjustified, that's fine, no one here can change your mind or should try to. For you, the clock didn't start ticking until the ugly backlash began -- probably because you saw nothing aggressive or inaccurate about the initial implications of bigotry among geek culture. Again, that's fine if you see it that way, but many of us didn't.

Keep in mind I'm going with my understanding of positions that I don't hold, but there are multiple arguments about the depiction of women in comics and video games, some of which would apply to cheerleading, such as criticism of anatomically possible illustrations.

I don't use social media much but how exactly is two to three tweets an attack?

Where do you get that it was two or three tweets?

That said, if one comment is nasty enough, it could be seen as an attack.

[CrimsonEchidna]

I don't use social media much but how exactly is two to three tweets an attack?

Because it wasn't "2 or 3" tweets. She was harrassed both on that tweet and through her private messages. What we have here is people trying to downplay the harassment she received.

[nnelg]

Because it wasn't "2 or 3" tweets. She was harrassed both on that tweet and through her private messages. What we have here is people trying to downplay the harassment she received.

Unless she is willing to show the rest of the tweets or what ever type of messages as proof. Or somehow take legal action this all seems like a ploy to drum up sympathy. Someone that is actually being harassed would or should be willing to show proof to justify the vilifying of the person that is harassing them.

[nnelg]

A handful of posts were deleted, when one poster got rather rude.



Keep in mind I'm going with my understanding of positions that I don't hold, but there are multiple arguments about the depiction of women in comics and video games, some of which would apply to cheerleading, such as criticism of anatomically possible illustrations.

Where do you get that it was two or three tweets?

That said, if one comment is nasty enough, it could be seen as an attack.

One comment isn't an attack.