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  1. #1
    Extraordinary Member Zero Hunter's Avatar
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    Default Revamp a Villain ....

    Everyone has looked at a villain now and then and thinks to themselves "if they would just do this..." so lets hear your ideas on how to improve an underdeveloped villain or one that has had way to many bad storylines that have kind of ruined them.

    For me I am going with Apocalypse. They have really wrecked that character over the years with bad retcons and just dumb ideas. From making him just a parasite that jumps from body to body to making his whole mission just things the Celestials programmed him to be. I would strip it all away and bring him back as he was before the Celestials altered him. The ancient warrior who lives by survival of the strong and the culling of the weak who has no mercy. An En Sabah Nur following his own path for the first time in thousands of years and not just doing what the Celestials led him to do. Sort of like he was in the Rise of Apocalypse origin mini series.

    Last edited by Zero Hunter; 08-10-2017 at 10:41 AM.

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member Charlie_1981's Avatar
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    Amora the Enchantress, of course.

    As I said many times on the Enchantress thread. Marvel has barely any respect for her when she deserves more as their first female villain in its beginnings.

    Last 15-20 years, Marvel has no direction as how to treat or develop her like the usual boring routine many times seen that since Simonson, Ellis and Jurgens´s Thor runs has no purpose because she fullfill her objective as gaining Thor love.

    Her origin never was explained, their parents are totally unknown as is something that any smart writer can do an amazing story about it to know what kind of persons they were to have two daughters like Amora and Lorelei.

    The Freyja angle actually is hard to follow as idea right now but making something different as trying new routes to follow like taking advantage of something like when Loki turned an average girl from Broxton as the new Enchantress as an inspiration regarding the original one, I have and I continue having the idea of making Sylvie Lushton as Amora and Lorelei´s unknown mother in a story that makes flashbacks on what Amora and Lorelei remembers about her, making Sylvie as the key of Amora´s hidden secrets (Amora as adult inspires Sylvie, and an Old Sylvie in the past of Asgard inspires a teenage Amora as become the Enchantress, a weird thing because involves a rare thing as sharing timelines in different moments) seeing a totally new side of the Alluring Asgardian Blonde that also involves a full storyline of their relationship until Sylvie goes to past and becomes that person even changing parts of their past. Also developing even if Skurge is dead, the relationship between Amora and her old partner on Hel, making Hela as Amora´s natural nemesis and Amora a different kind of Asgardian Hero without losing any of what makes her special and seeing her in full power and someone that everyone should fear, specially her enemies.
    Last edited by Charlie_1981; 08-10-2017 at 11:09 AM.

  3. #3
    Mighty Member pageturner's Avatar
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    Purple man become an eviornmental lobbyist and saves the world.

  4. #4

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    people seem to be picking well known villains. so i'll go against the grain and use morts.

    Shellshock
    original bio http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Gary_Buser_(Earth-616)
    if you don't know him, don't feel bad. he was "a flunky of the Psycho-Man." he died at the Bar w/ No Name with everyone else slaughtered by Scourge.

    my take: I say that what Gary didn't know is that he was using the guise of the real Shellshock; an actual Boba Fett-level bad@$$ in the Microverse (that is where Gary Buser got his weaponry). notice the strange shape of Shellshock's helmet. in my head, it's shaped like that because the real Shellshock is from a race of microverse beings loosely based on mollusks (hey, they did have Lizard-Men and whatever the heck Bug is). the original Shellshock has been in a microversian supermax prison for some time. so Psycho-Man gifted some human scrub with his helmet and multi-faceted gun. just to make it interesting, I'd say that the mollusk people are all vegan pacifists. but Shellshock had some kind of deviant or mutant gene thing going on making him an outcast (born covered head-to-toe w/ a jet-black carapace & having pointed teeth) who eventually grows to become a mercenary and slave trader (provides test subjects to Psycho-man) of some reknown. anyways, he would escape from prison and travel to Earth to reclaim his favorite gun. I'd like to work him into the Fantastic Four's rogues gallery. maybe he could be part of the Frightful Four. his gun could be manually adjusted to shoot everything from deathrays to knockout gas. despite having light sensitive eyes (that's why he needs the helmet), he's an accomplished long range marksman. otherwise, he's just naturally more resistant to injury because of his mutation and completely unfazed by most substances that would be toxic to humans (he also has no bones to break).

    visually, he's this... and this...
    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  5. #5

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    a few of them just need to find new archenemies.

    Trapster can't shake his loser label because he's fighting in the wrong weight class. set him against Ant-Man and, suddenly, he seems like the scariest dude on the planet. I think he's more suited to face someone whose powerset involves stealth as opposed to brute force. plus it just makes sense from the pest control angle. since they've introduced a new female Trapster, I'd change Pete's name to 'Trapmaster.'




    and poor old Moses Magnum. you'd think that he'd be a more popular character. but, when he's not portrayed as Apocalypse's slave, he's jobbing to Daken. I think he should set his sights on Harlem and become one of Luke Cage's main heavies. he was supposed to be the villain in Singleton's scrapped Luke Cage movie; once upon a time. man of the streets vs man of the world.


    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  6. #6
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    Two villains come to mind who definitely do need a revamp.

    TURNER D. CENTURY---------When he was last seen he was resurrected by The Hood to go up against The Punisher. I'm not sure if the spell wore off or if it was permanent by what I would do with him is kick mission to overdrive. When he first appeared he was about returning things back to the way it was during the Victorian era. I would make him more of a Ultra-Conservative terrorist. Century would definitely see fault with the world of today. I also would make him a part of Sam Wilson's Rogues Gallery as I doubt he wouldn't like the idea of a Black Captain America. Century would also have a major disdain for social media, smartphones and most modern technology.

    MIRACLE MAN--------He was resurrected along with Turner D. Century. I would have him be a leader of some religious sect. Make him an agent of The Universal Church of Truth and actually give him abilities that have to do with miracles but with a twist.

    THUNDERBALL--------I would play up more of his intelligence since the writers in the past seem to overlook that he's a nuclear physicist. He would be more of a behind the scenes manipulator and shaker who plays dumb but actually is quite resourceful and strategic. He's also an underwriter and financier of several villain teams such as Power Tools, Grapplers and The Death Throws.

  7. #7

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    thanks for reminding me. I think there should totally be a new Turner D Century but a hipster version; dressed in the garb and adopting the vernacular of the ultra conservative version, ironically. I just want a leaner younger savvier old timey villain. I think he'd be a good foil to someone like Kate Bishop. we already had the ultra-capitalist Golden Skull. why not an avocado toast-eating Turner D Century? visually, I'm imagining Jack Huston (Boardwalk Empire) in Turner's classic gentleman's wear. #MakeitSoNickSpencer
    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Male View Post
    Two villains come to mind who definitely do need a revamp.

    TURNER D. CENTURY---------When he was last seen he was resurrected by The Hood to go up against The Punisher. I'm not sure if the spell wore off or if it was permanent by what I would do with him is kick mission to overdrive. When he first appeared he was about returning things back to the way it was during the Victorian era. I would make him more of a Ultra-Conservative terrorist. Century would definitely see fault with the world of today. I also would make him a part of Sam Wilson's Rogues Gallery as I doubt he wouldn't like the idea of a Black Captain America. Century would also have a major disdain for social media, smartphones and most modern technology.

    MIRACLE MAN--------He was resurrected along with Turner D. Century. I would have him be a leader of some religious sect. Make him an agent of The Universal Church of Truth and actually give him abilities that have to do with miracles but with a twist.

    THUNDERBALL--------I would play up more of his intelligence since the writers in the past seem to overlook that he's a nuclear physicist. He would be more of a behind the scenes manipulator and shaker who plays dumb but actually is quite resourceful and strategic. He's also an underwriter and financier of several villain teams such as Power Tools, Grapplers and The Death Throws.
    I like your ideas for Thunderball. I was hoping that his renewed path of ambition would take post-Illuminati. but no dice. visually, I think he would have been great as the new villainous Goliath (not that I want to step on Atlas' toes); w/ his size augmentation accomplished through radioactivity (to match his field of study).

    Last edited by Michael Watkins; 08-10-2017 at 08:17 PM.
    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post

    and poor old Moses Magnum. you'd think that he'd be a more popular character. but, when he's not portrayed as Apocalypse's slave, he's jobbing to Daken. I think he should set his sights on Harlem and become one of Luke Cage's main heavies. he was supposed to be the villain in Singleton's scrapped Luke Cage movie; once upon a time. man of the streets vs man of the world.


    I always thought Moses Magnum should be elevated to a Kingpin, Doctor Doom and Old School Magneto status. He fought Cage a long time ago but he also fought the X-Men and Avengers. I would like to see Magnum be a major supervillain who's worldwide and not tied to one location. Remember, he's also an arms trafficker and the leader of his own country. He should have his finger in a hole bunch of pies.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Watkins View Post
    I like your ideas for Thunderball. I was hoping that his renewed path of ambition would take post-Illuminati. but no dice. visually, I think he would have been great as the new villainous Goliath (not that I want to step on Atlas' toes); w/ his size augmentation accomplished through radioactivity (to match his field of study).

    Come to think of it I'm surprised Norman Osborn didn't ask Thunderball to be the "Luke Cage" on his Dark Avengers team. He would've been perfect on it as well as a right hand man of Osborn. Another thing is since you suggested Thunderball take on the Goliath persona now what if discovered a way to perfect or modify the Pym Particles? Then again I like the idea that him growing to a certain height has nothing to do with the Pym Particles. I would just distinguish him more from Bill Foster for obvious reasons.

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Male View Post
    I always thought Moses Magnum should be elevated to a Kingpin, Doctor Doom and Old School Magneto status. He fought Cage a long time ago but he also fought the X-Men and Avengers. I would like to see Magnum be a major supervillain who's worldwide and not tied to one location. Remember, he's also an arms trafficker and the leader of his own country. He should have his finger in a hole bunch of pies.
    I wonder if he's still in Wakanda. an old handbook bio made it seem like he had claimed part of Africa (the non-wakandan region) for himself. he could be a bigger player. he's done business with A.I.M before. he has the resources. I'm actually surprised that he wasn't Norman's pick to be the new Power Man. Thunderball was still slumming it as a member of the Wrecking Crew, at the time.
    "I just don't get why you wouldn't want to break the law anymore" --Scorpia

  12. #12
    iMan 42s
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    Green Goblin because with the retcons I don't know if Norman Osborn ever wasn't insane.

    While it's probably impossible with Norman now, I would take any future goblin to be inspired primarily through Halloween. It gives a plausible explanation for his armaments and costume. The Green Goblin is goofy, no question of that as despite all the awful things various goblins have done, they are still guys in Halloween costumes fighting a guy in a red and blue unitard. There is a moment where we need to step back and realize that in context, this is really silly. In the future the goblins should be menacing but not overdoing it like what happened with Norman Osborn. As well as with Halloween themed gadgets we also delve into traps, like how would Spider-man handle a haunted house style murder room that could actually do some damage to him or various hostages? What motivates someone to do this? It's fun. The answer is simple, this is ridiculous and with enough effort it's a great way to kill an afternoon and keep up the dynamic between hero and villain. If your villain absolutely understands what they are and keep doing it because they enjoy it, then we as readers can be a little more invested in both sides and motivated to see what shenanigans happen this time. When a Green Goblin story in Spider-man comes up it will play the same beats no question, so why not streamline the whole thing and tell the story for what it is. "I'll get you next time Spider-man!" has meaning because it's a game these guys will keep playing and we might as well acknowledge it by this point.

    I'd also keep the identity intentionally vague. Criminals aren't always the people you know and that it could be anyone doing any sort of crime. It's not always murder and it's not always a robbery, kidnapping, or dimension jumping vampire. Keep it vague and also make the crimes inconsistent. This is a guy who enjoys what he does and puts immense effort into setting this all up. If he wanted to just kill someone a gun is the easy answer, this guy uses Jack O' Lantern/Ghost themed frag grenades. This is more effort than this truly deserves. So one day he could try to kill Spider-man with a gang of witches who fly on jet powered broomsticks, and the next there is a noise complaint of blood curdling screams and laughter. Nothing has to top the last job, if it is spooky enough and may get a hero involved, then it's a day well spent.
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  13. #13
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    The Mandarin I'd revamp by focusing on his early life to clarify his motivations, and then have him attack Stark in disturbingly personal ways. Enough with the global schemes already. Let's see some small, disturbing Mandarin stories.

  14. #14
    Extraordinary Member Mike_Murdock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Male View Post
    I always thought Moses Magnum should be elevated to a Kingpin, Doctor Doom and Old School Magneto status. He fought Cage a long time ago but he also fought the X-Men and Avengers. I would like to see Magnum be a major supervillain who's worldwide and not tied to one location. Remember, he's also an arms trafficker and the leader of his own country. He should have his finger in a hole bunch of pies.
    I was going to say something like this. Maybe not Doom, but certainly a mix between Kingpin and Hydra. He should be a major world player.

    My character suggestion is Lawrence Cranston, aka Mr. Fear. To me, he's one of Daredevil's strongest adversaries already, but he only appears rarely. One of his greatest strengths was just weakened because he used to be able to torment Matt on a personal level because he knew Daredevil's secret identity (he actually figured it out all by himself remarkably quickly, but I digress). To make up for it, I'd suggest doing the obvious thing they practically never did. He's a lawyer who's known Matt since Law School, but they basically had him outed as Mr. Fear in his first appearance and that was the end of it. So what's good for the goose is good for the gander. Put his secret identity back in the bottle. Make him a lawyer again as well and have him go up against Matt in court using his fear powers to win cases. On the villain side, I think he could do more to build a cult following or create a mad bomb style madness rather than just give Matt moments of doubt due to fear.
    Matt Murdock's cooler twin brother

    I'd give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety's sake!
    Thomas More - A Man for All Seasons

    Interested in reading Daredevil? Not sure what to read next? Why not check out the Daredevil Book Club for some ideas?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie_1981 View Post
    Amora the Enchantress, of course.
    As I said many times on the Enchantress thread. Marvel has barely any respect for her when she deserves more as their first female villain in its beginnings.
    I like the idea of Amora and Lorelei being the younger sisters of Freyja, who would be (along with her brother Frey) one of the two main gods of the Vanir pantheon of gods, that was (aeons past) at war with the Aesir pantheon (led by Odin). An arranged marriage between Odin and Freyja united the pantheons, and Freyja's sisters Amora and Lorelei moved to Asgard with their older sister, and became perpetual thorns in the side of the combined Asgardian pantheon, never (or rarely...) quite crossing the line and being declared enemies of Asgard, and quick to count on the protection that comes with their big sister being the Queen of Asgard (just as Loki gets away with as much as he does because he's the adoptive son of Odin, and gets a truly supernatural amount of mileage out of that protected status).

    Each of the three share the status of being immortal blonde goddesses, skilled in various sorts of enchantment magic, much like the mythological Freya, who in addition to being a goddess was also a patron of seithr witches, who specialized in magics of beguiling the mind and senses, and divining the future, and less the blasty-zap 'shields and phasers' sort of magic used by Dr. Strange (although Amora certainly seems to be skilled at that, when she's of a mind to throw down).

    I also like the notion that Amora enchanted Skurge's dimension-rift-cleaving axe personally, suggesting that, if she were of the mind to do so, she could create her own super-villains, by equipping gods, giants or mortals with magical gear, similar to how Loki empowered the Absorbing Man and Wrecking Crew. Giving her a team of lackeys, capable of matching the average super-team, would be one way to make her more than just 'Loki's minion' or 'Malekith's flunky.' I can stand her playing second-fiddle to Loki, because he's Loki. But Malekith? I don't think so. She's way higher on the food chain than him, IMO.

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